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Ry
GOLD Member since Feb 2005

Ry

Gromit's Humble Squire
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Total posts: 4496
Posted:This post was brought about seeing this comment on an older thread on one of the Crowded House members, Paul Hester, taking his own life a while back:



 Written by: ~Leah~



why is it all the really talented people go first? They don't seem to understand what they meant to people. Everyone has a story to tell............



http://www.homeofpoi.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/371780
br>


It sort of got me wondering about the link between creativity and depression. Are depressed individuals more likely to be creative?



Sometimes I see the 'creative' things I engage in- guitar, figuring out the alto saxophone, photography, writing, sculpture, firedancing, sock-spinning as refuge from a heavy heart. The lousier I feel, the more I want to get myself out there, the more f#cked I feel, all the more I want publish another piece of me.



But. Is it worth having a portfolio of sublime photographs, pieces of writing or art or music to your name, paying for it with constantly wondering how it'd feel to jump off every single cliff, bridge, building or drown in every river or bucket, wondering how many of any tablet you see is going to be enough to.. wondering if going to sleep tonight you'll be lucky enough not to wake up the next day.



Vincent Van Gogh, Peter Ilych Tchaikovsky, Mark Rothko, John Berryman, Charles Dickens, Ernest Hemingway, Virginia Woolf, Judy Garland, Sylvia Plath, Anne Sexton, Frida Kahlo, Michael Hutchence, Nick Drake.. all are widely accepted to have taken their own lives.



Depression.. creativity. Genius, madness.. I can't make any sense of it, or sense that is supposed to make sense.



I need to get some sleep.



To start your research: http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/serendipia/Serendipia-Preti.html
br>


[Edited: Stephen Hawking removed from list of names]


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Ry
GOLD Member since Feb 2005

Ry

Gromit's Humble Squire
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Total posts: 4496
Posted: Written by: Mr Majestik


how creative can you be called when all you do is use tools someone else created (a camera, acrylic paints, guitar)? i dont get creativity.

IMO (and no offense intended) i think depression leads to a search for emotional/mental satisfaction, or maybe thats what depression is. anyway, this search is a result of dis-satisfaction with the statusquo, so depressed people will go out and find something they can call all their own. which i still find to be conformist because they usually use all the methods created by other people from their society. maybe people recognise this futility and thats what keeps the cycle going.



Give ten artists paintbrushes and you could say the creative one is the one that's not using it paint. It's application of the tools- the process which leads to the end product. How you could stop your analysis at the tool stage I can't understand.

And it's not about being conformist or not- depressed individuals don't necessarily seek to be unique- that's not the argument.


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c42f
SILVER Member since Apr 2005

c42f

Member
Location: Brissie

Total posts: 23
Posted: Written by: Mr Majestik


how creative can you be called when all you do is use tools someone else created (a camera, acrylic paints, guitar)? i dont get creativity.




Hmm, this doesn't make much sense to me I'm afraid. The logical conclusion from this point of view would be that in order to be "truly creative" we would have to start with a rock and a handful of grass. Of course this is possible, but the results would be vastly inferior.

In some sense you have an important point though: what we really do is to build apon the creativity of others (thousands of years of this in fact!), but that doesn't mean our own creativity "goes away". Rather, the end product is far better than it could have been otherwise.

 Written by: jungleboy


Paradoxically many times praise does not relieve depression or even satisfy, it is simply the act of creation that is like a soothing balm.



I think this has a lot to do with what response you usually get from people regarding the things you create - the way I percieve praise or criticism depends strongly on the usual response by that person to that particular creative activity. OTOH, the act of creation itself is independent of other people's response and I enjoy it independently of them.

~Chris.


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Pogo69
SILVER Member since Apr 2006

Pogo69

there's no charge for awesomeness... or attractiveness
Location: limbo

Total posts: 3764
Posted: Written by: c42f


Hmm, this doesn't make much sense to me I'm afraid. The logical conclusion from this point of view would be that in order to be "truly creative" we would have to start with a rock and a handful of grass. Of course this is possible, but the results would be vastly inferior.

In some sense you have an important point though: what we really do is to build apon the creativity of others (thousands of years of this in fact!), but that doesn't mean our own creativity "goes away". Rather, the end product is far better than it could have been otherwise.




Completely agree, chris... truly creative people are always able to take what has come before them, then envision and bring to life something new. This is true of any creative venture... art, music, poetry, carpentry... whatever. This is why we're still "creating" music thousands of years after our ancestors first gave it a shot.

In fact... it largely distinguishes human from other life forms. Our ability to, as a species, remember and build on those that came before us.

Originality and the ability to express ourselves are better indicators of creativity than the tools we use to express it.

 Written by: c42f


I think this has a lot to do with what response you usually get from people regarding the things you create - the way I percieve praise or criticism depends strongly on the usual response by that person to that particular creative activity. OTOH, the act of creation itself is independent of other people's response and I enjoy it independently of them.




Again... agree. I (personally) get far more satisfaction from the act of creating something new, than I do from other people's responses to that creation. I don't write music to hear what other people think; I write it because I enjoy the act of creating new sounds. Hang on, I think I'm agreeing with the 2nd bit, which is actually agreeing with jungleboy... heck, I'm confusing myself now.

Just out of interest's sake, I did a quick google search on "creativity depression". A *LOT* of people have done a *LOT* of research on the topic. Without having had a chance to read through any of it, it seems pretty clear that many others have had the same idea.


--pogo (pat) [forever and always]

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Mr Majestik
SILVER Member since Mar 2004

Mr Majestik

coming to a country near you
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear

Total posts: 4693
Posted:its hardly original if people have been doing it (creativity) for all of known history.



maybe all i'm saying is that constantly building on something (something!) using creativity hasnt been getting us anywhere. after all, its been going on for so long and we still keep doing it, maybe we forgot what we set out to do.


"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"

jointly owned by Fire_Spinning_Angel and Blu_Valley

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GothFrogette
BRONZE Member since Mar 2017

GothFrogette

grumpy poorly froggy
Location: Nuneaton

Total posts: 3999
Posted: Written by: Mr Majestik


its hardly original if people have been doing it (creativity) for all of known history.





it doesn't have to be original though, you will not be able to find many things, if any at all these days that are original.
Its not to conform in anyway its a way of expresion using what ever you can to try and improve/distract your brian from whats going on in there or give it a chanel, rather than things going around in your head to the point where you can not cope.
Heck sometimes i get as much satisfaction from creating a meal as i do from a sculpture.... sometimes i do both in one go... never underestimate the power of a mash mountian with tree's grass and dino's biggrin


Life's too short to worry about where you put your marshmallows

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Tao Star


Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1662
Posted: Written by: Mr Majestik


its hardly original if people have been doing it (creativity) for all of known history.

maybe all i'm saying is that constantly building on something (something!) using creativity hasnt been getting us anywhere. after all, its been going on for so long and we still keep doing it, maybe we forgot what we set out to do.



and there you've hit the nail on the head!!! what people have been saying previously in this thread is that they don't get creative to 'set out to do' anything...it's not being used to make anything, just as a process. like crying -people have been doing that for years but you'd hardly tell them to stop, they know what it will produce but it's the process that needs to be gone through. final results are (or can be) pretty much irreleant.


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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BansheeCat
BRONZE Member since Jul 2005

veteran
Location: lost

Total posts: 1247
Posted:Majestick- creativity hasn't gotten us anywhere? Whaaa? Huh? Absurd statement.

Tao Star- you hit the nail on the head, it is a process!

Outcome and destination unknown- that is one of the things that makes the process interesting. A Journey, exploring ourselves, environment and community. The reasons people undertake the journey are multiple, depression being one of them...

So, the relationship between depression and creativity: I would just say that creativity can be an important part of a healing process. Producing art, enjoying art,exploring art... Perhaps if there is a strong relationship between depression and creativity it is simply because the depressed or mentally ill recognize that they need healing and are working on it!

Suicides and overdoses, well, there are a million reasons why people leave this planet/form. Perhaps we just acknowledge and mourn the loss of our artists more than others?


"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."

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Ry
GOLD Member since Feb 2005

Ry

Gromit's Humble Squire
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Total posts: 4496
Posted: Written by: Tao Star



 Written by: Mr Majestik



its hardly original if people have been doing it (creativity) for all of known history.



maybe all i'm saying is that constantly building on something (something!) using creativity hasnt been getting us anywhere. after all, its been going on for so long and we still keep doing it, maybe we forgot what we set out to do.





and there you've hit the nail on the head!!! what people have been saying previously in this thread is that they don't get creative to 'set out to do' anything...it's not being used to make anything, just as a process. like crying -people have been doing that for years but you'd hardly tell them to stop, they know what it will produce but it's the process that needs to be gone through. final results are (or can be) pretty much irreleant.





The nail on the head?? Personally, I think the process is important. But I strongly disagree with the notion that the final results could possibly be irrelevant. That suggests that it (the thing labelled creativity) is a kneejerk reaction, which is the fundamental opposite of what creativity is supposed to be.



I think that creativity is about the end product- for example, when I start working on a photograph, I know exactly how I want the final product to look, if that means post-processing, tweaking curves and levels, re-framing- even retaking the shot. I don't get my satisfaction til the final product comes out. To stop at saying it was only a process I had to go through, i.e. the process of producing a photograph or 'to have a cry', completely writes off the possibility of actual 'creativity', not to mention the miracle of thought and ideas.



What I'm interested in is the idea that sublime creativity and mental wellness (as opposed to illness) form a dichotomy- e.g. a master creative is incapable of being mentally well, or is more likely to be mentally unwell compared to a normal person, while a mundane person is more likely to be creatively retarded e.g. that you're more likely to put the sublime into his/her work with a series of beatings instead of a couple of masterclasses.



Andrea: I'm think 'healing process' is another concept which I can't really come to terms with. In the creativity/mental wellness dichotomy, if one embraces creative pursuits as a coping mechanism, it vaguely implies that the state of 'mentally well' is where people are supposed to be, and by method of progressive deduction, sublime creativity is for the loony.



Still working it out.


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Pogo69
SILVER Member since Apr 2006

Pogo69

there's no charge for awesomeness... or attractiveness
Location: limbo

Total posts: 3764
Posted:Well, Ry... I don't know the answers to any of the question you are posing. But then, do a little googling and you'll realise that no-one else does either... but they're working on it.

It's interesting stuff though, both for me personally and as something that I've thought about a bit over time.

My son has been diagnosed with asperger's and adhd and has a *very* mild dose of ritalin every day to help him "fit in". He is actually supposed to be on a higher dose, but neither my ex-wife or I will do it to him. On the lower dose, he calms down a bit, but is still himself. On the higher dose, he zones out and becomes a bit of a zombie... the real Lachlan is no longer there.

Has always made me wonder... if those in the past who likely would have fit the criteria for conditions like aspergers/adhd/bipolar etc were bombed out on the drugs we have available to "help" us today, would we have seen any of the things they have "created"?

I'm not saying that any/some of the mind altering drugs, modern medicine/science has produced aren't beneficial, but they *absolutely do change people*. On a decent dose, you are no longer the person you were...


--pogo (pat) [forever and always]

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BansheeCat
BRONZE Member since Jul 2005

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Location: lost

Total posts: 1247
Posted:I absolutely do not beleive that "sublime creativity" is in opposition to mental health... I can cite examples of some amazingly sucessful creative people-- in terms of both output/end product., and process-- that are very mentally stable, and quite happy.(Perhaps not famous, but is that the real relevant bit? )

Like all things, there is probably a spectrum we dance along, playing between all extremes.

As for it being *only* a healing process, of course not! But it is an effective one when used that way. It is not limited to that though. It plays a role in so many things, who could possibily quantify and cateogorize them all! What a wonderful tool for self understanding and expression though, and those canbe very useful to people struggling with depression.

I dont understand your comment about process orientation making creativity a " Knee jerk" reaction, can you please explain?

Why is creativity "supposed to be", anything? Why not define it as you like, and use it how it works best for you? So if you like end product, and require that for your satisfaction, so be it. You chose that path, for reasons that suit you. But it is certainly not an inherent aspect of creativity, (that it has an outcome, particularily a defined one). Or at least, not as I see it. ;-)

I personally would be miserable if I attached myself to the outcome more than the process. In a constant state of striving, instead of one of discovering. I use my art as my business, and live off it, so an end product certainly is part of the picture, cause that is what people buy from me. But I just let my enjoyment and involvement in the process lead me, and then see what I get at the end. It results in a more engaging product, or so my customers tell me...Works well so far.


Interesting points, lots to think on!
smiles,
Andrea


"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."

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Ry
GOLD Member since Feb 2005

Ry

Gromit's Humble Squire
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Total posts: 4496
Posted: Written by: andrealee



I dont understand your comment about process orientation making creativity a " Knee jerk" reaction, can you please explain?





You'd have to refer to Marf's post, which I quoted just before my reply.



Basically, what that suggests to me is that 'creative' endeavours are undertaken as a response to one's condition.



'One is upset, one has a cry- the process of crying makes one feel better..gives an outlet.. allows cathartic release etc. Crying produces tears.. one's face gets wet.. and so on so forth.'



I can't use that as a comparison to sublime creativity, because it implies that one becomes 'creative' as a reflex response.



Example, 'Person writes because he/she is upset, aroused, livid, whatever- he/she doesn't care what he she is writing, he/she writes for the sake of writing; writing is his/her cathartic release. To postulate, he/she may not have any actual bearing over the final piece- the process carries him/her there.'



To exagerrate, it's sort of like peppering up people's faces, and a la infinite monkey theorem, someone's sneeze (read: process one automatically goes through) is going to produce a Van Gogh (read: creative output).



Does that make sense?


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Ry
GOLD Member since Feb 2005

Ry

Gromit's Humble Squire
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Total posts: 4496
Posted:Also, since I mention it so often.. 'sublime creativity' vs. I suppose, kneejerk 'creativity'. At what point do you differentiate.. Is there any difference at all?

When I look at a photograph I've taken, e.g.
http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=2755889
br>
What's exactly is the difference in saying
1. Oh.. the photographer's a talent (subjective..)
2. Poor thing, he must be so withdrawn into his own world.

Or is it just safer just to forget all the cogs of the process behind the scenes, and go with
3. I like the photograph (again, subjective).

Which doesn't necessarily disrespect the creative process or the tribulations of the creative author- but does adopt the ignorance not dissimilar to the stance of those who say 'I love eating meat, but I don't want to see those animals getting slaughtered.'

Still working it out.


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BansheeCat
BRONZE Member since Jul 2005

veteran
Location: lost

Total posts: 1247
Posted:I think I understand you now, but still disagree...



My point is that for many people, it is the very nature of the process that may produce the "successful" product.



Someone veiwing my work, or your pictures, need not know anything about my/your process. But many will feel it in the end peice, or even those that dont frequently will acknowledge that certain peices "work" better than others- and I find that those peices that stand out are ones that came through a process I was thoroughly engaged in.W hen I produce something for the simple reason I feel its outer form will sell, it is usually lacking something, less outstanding, less integrity to the art. And people, knowing nothing of the process, can detect this! Really, they can, and do!



Some people are interested in the stories behind things, and it can be interesting to share that with the veiwer, or even involve them in the process. But good art should stand without it- meaning I dont need to know you or your story to appreciate it, though I might like to. Good art often does make one question, wonder, dream-- who made this, why, how did this happen, what will happen to it... We can make our own story for it too.



See the movie Rivers and Tides, about the art of Andy Goldsworthy to get a sense of what I mean. Not only is he engaged in process, he lets the art he makes be engaged in the uncontrollable environmental processes, creating collaborations with nature.



I still dont buy any concern over creativity being reduced to a reflexive response... That arguement seems weak to me.



Firstly, because one very much cares what they do, what they write- to use your analogy- as they are doing it. To be unattached to outcome is a very different thing than not caring. Ones motivation for creation may becomes a very valuable aspect fo the art. For example, feeling of saddness, exploration of colour tones that express your saddness, may lead to a peice that can be particularlily evokative of that sense for the viewer. This can be done deliberately, using your state of being as an artistic tool of sorts. Applying awareness of this relationship may result in a work of art/dance that perfectly captures a particular sensibility , communicates more powerfully. What stirs you, may stir others...



And sometimes, art arises spontaneously from these strong states, like the urge to sing aloud when joyful. What is produced at these times often, in my expereince, has a clarity, a truthfulness, a power, that is transcendent. crosses all languages.



How can holding an end product in your mind before beginning and then striving to achieve it, be considered more creative? I think it is a fine way to do things if you want to, but to feel it is more self determined and thus more creative, seems a bit limiting to me.



Sorry, no time to edit this, hope the spelling is not horrible, and picture lots of cute gremlins running through it!

smiles,

Andrea


"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."

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KaelGotRice
GOLD Member since Jul 2003

KaelGotRice

Basu gasu bakuhatsu - because sometimes buses explode
Location: Angel's Landing, USA

Total posts: 1584
Posted:What are you people discussing again?



I don't see "art" as an outcome. Eventually the paintings will rot away or burn, the same as the books, the dances will be forgotten, the songs die away in the wind, all the encoded information of creativity and 1s and 0s that make up digital artwork will be destroyed by entrophy, so do the electrical impulses and memories in our brains fade away when we die.



But does that mean that the feelings have meant nothing, or the emotions were not felt? Everything continues to constantly change, even art. And it is those who don't realize this who suffer it.



From this bipolar's perspective - The stories are all there. All of the art is already out there. It isn't ordered yet, the words are merely jumbled letters hanging in the air. To the painter the colors are the light of stars and galaxies far off. All that remains is for the artist to reach out and create some order out of the disorder in this universe. The artist captures that moment if at least for awhile, that feeling of creation, or spark of God, if you believe in that sort of thing (I don't).



Inevitably, death is the outcome. But if we get stuck on that fact, what would you do with your life? Supposing you were stuck miles out to sea in a raging ocean, will you automatically sink and let yourself go into the abyss, or will you continue to swim towards the ever distant shore, gasping for breath, until you finally drown in the great sea?



To be an artist is to continue to swim. You may see the end in your head, real or imagined. Everything you do to express yourself is art. It's the way you walk, the way you talk, the way you express yourself to other people. Suicide or death, the universe going out with a bang or slowly dissolving away, the end product weighs heavily in your mind, but all you can do is carpe diem, seize that moment out of nothing, and create something that will last or inspire future artists.



Artists are mad to live, we have clearer vision than most. That is all.



Thanks for listening. smile


To do: More Firedrums 08 video?
Wildfire/US East coast fire footage
LA/EDC glow/fire footage
Fresno fire

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ubbrollsmile.gif" alt="" />

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nearly_all_gone
SILVER Member since Aug 2004

nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton

Total posts: 1626
Posted:The way I see it, people who are depressed are often depressed because they are original thinkers, at odds with the prevaling order of the world. They find it hard to cope in some way, and their depression comes out. So they express themselves in different terms, musically for example. Some of my greatest heroes have been seriously depressed. Ian Curtis, for example, one of the true poets of our age.

I think that there's a lot of truth in what some have said about taking up a creative art in order to withdraw from life to some extent. It's a comfort to have something you can do when you feel as though you can do nothing, I guess.

Very interesting topic.


What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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KaelGotRice
GOLD Member since Jul 2003

KaelGotRice

Basu gasu bakuhatsu - because sometimes buses explode
Location: Angel's Landing, USA

Total posts: 1584
Posted:And to carry my thoughts further...



Artists care about everything. We are obsessive by nature. We strive for perfection even though we know that the outcome may be far from perfect.



Sometimes we (and by we I mean you can substitute bipolar or artists here wink) care so much about the world, about the universe, about our friends and family, about everything - that we can't express it. It festers inside and wrenches our minds, hearts, and soul. We become mad or suicidal in these times.



A lot of us will find solace through some medium of expression or art. Through that medium we pour out our mind, heart, and soul. We literally bleed ourselves onto our canvas or through our pens onto paper, or during a dance we are losing ourselves in.



The great artists are constantly aware of those feelings - but nowadays it's either lost or watered down in the crap of commercialism and capitalism.



Such is life.


To do: More Firedrums 08 video?
Wildfire/US East coast fire footage
LA/EDC glow/fire footage
Fresno fire

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ubbrollsmile.gif" alt="" />

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BansheeCat
BRONZE Member since Jul 2005

veteran
Location: lost

Total posts: 1247
Posted:wow Kael, that was beautiful!

"God *was* my co-pilot, but then we crashed, and I had to eat him..."

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Mr Majestik
SILVER Member since Mar 2004

Mr Majestik

coming to a country near you
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear

Total posts: 4693
Posted:here here

thats what i meant about creativity getting us nowhere, it does get watered down and abused by others. i just wish peoples 'creativity' could benefit everyone on a macro level instead of it all being micro.


"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"

jointly owned by Fire_Spinning_Angel and Blu_Valley

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nearly_all_gone
SILVER Member since Aug 2004

nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton

Total posts: 1626
Posted:Please enlighten me Mr M, what do you mean by an "abuse" of creativity?

Surely it's all a matter of perception from others?

Great art brings people together. All art is therapy, in my opinion. Like Kael says, you bleed yourself out onto the page, your anger, fears or happiness or whatever. If other people choose to take that and use it for negative purposes, I don't think it's really the art that can be blamed.

Creativity - creativity invented medicines, spaceships, poi, the internet... just because it's not a painting doesn't mean it's not creative.

To say that creativity has got us nowhere seems a bit of a stretch to me...


What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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Golaf


newbie


Total posts: 4
Posted:depression and creativity kinda go hand in hand

thats what i say!


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nearly_all_gone
SILVER Member since Aug 2004

nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton

Total posts: 1626
Posted:Well.. thanks for the insight... ubblol

What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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jo_rhymes
SILVER Member since Apr 2005

jo_rhymes

Momma Bear
Location: Telford, Shrops

Total posts: 4525
Posted:Apologies, I havent read all the posts on this thread, I know alot of people without depression who are creative, but I also know ALOT of people with depression who are creative too.
At the mental health centre I attend, creativity is encouraged to express whats going on inside us.
Personally, when I'm happy I prefer to go out and see friends and have fun in the sunshine, when depression takes hold, I become more withdrawn and do get more focused on the creative side. I find I can get more in touch with myself when I'm feeling low.


Hoppers are angels who lift us to our feet when our wings have trouble remembering how to fly.

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daize
SILVER Member since Dec 2005

daize

member
Location: Falmouth, Cornwall

Total posts: 175
Posted:Really, I find the opposite is true to myself jo...

When I'm depressed, it's really hard to summon the enthusiasm and motivation to do anything.

I'm for focused, and more creative when I'm clear and level headed... Being an artist, it's bloody annoying if I'm unhappy/depressed! I never get any work done frown


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Neon_Shaolin
GOLD Member since Jul 2005

Neon_Shaolin

hehe, 'Member' huhuh
Location: Behind you. With Jam

Total posts: 6120
Posted:I've read this thread many times but have been unable to bring myself to post anything on it...



For me the creative process is very private matter. I have no problems coming up with 'cool-looking' imagery in my artwork but cannot distance myself from my psyche enough to TRULY bare my soul in a creative manner...



Whether its because of me not feeling that I am skilled enough to do justice to the inner workings of my noggin or if I'm scared that people won't care about what I want to express...



How many people have listened to, let's say, Nirvana or more topically - emo music and said 'oh quit your whining and get over yourself'? Which probably doesn't do the artist any good. The artist shouldn't let that bother them but if they are feeling that sensitive it will take its toll.



I have often asked myself - which would I prefer? Mental health or unlimited creativity?


"I used to want to change the world, now I just wanna leave the room with a little dignity..." - Lotus Weinstock

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faith enfire
BRONZE Member since Mar 2017

faith enfire

wandering thru the woods of WI
Location: Wisconsin

Total posts: 3556
Posted:i like to hold on to things for a bit...then it is not so tender or raw a wound...sometimes i will make an adjustment to make it a bit worse, not so personal
i find it helps
it's hard to remember the last time i was actually happy...i've had that fleeting happy and contentedness but happy...
at the top of depression i just lay in bed, and let the house go to [censored], just getting to go to work, i pay all the bills mostly and taking the dog out
but when i am in the throws of it...what i am capable of amazes me...i can do more than carry a tune, draw anything in vivid detail and pull together words in a beautiful stretching of conciousness
but it is also the time when no one can deal with me...no one wants to feel helpless and when your loved one turns into a big ball of snot and tears if you look at them, they have a tendency to leave or at the very least be hurt and sometimes resentful

i think i would have my sanity, i miss it, if you see it running around could you send it home, i miss it sorely smile


Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed

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jo_rhymes
SILVER Member since Apr 2005

jo_rhymes

Momma Bear
Location: Telford, Shrops

Total posts: 4525
Posted:I see your point, luckily my "deep" creations like poetry, or songs I keep quite private, and will only show to those close to me who I know will support me. I do paint but mainly happy things like turtles and sunflowers!
I guess I have 2 states of creativity- painting when i'm happy, and knitting when I'm sad or indifferent. Hmm, how odd. I'll have to pay more attention to my moods and how I spend my time. biggrin


Hoppers are angels who lift us to our feet when our wings have trouble remembering how to fly.

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Neon_Shaolin
GOLD Member since Jul 2005

Neon_Shaolin

hehe, 'Member' huhuh
Location: Behind you. With Jam

Total posts: 6120
Posted:I like drawing happy things too...



I seem to have a thing for drawing scantily-clad comic book femme fatales because that's what I'm good at. I also do that for a living for a nightclub as serendipitously that is what the target audience likes and I do like doing it.



If I'm feeling miserable the last thing I want to do is anything! nevermind what I do for a living which although satisfying can be quite stressful... Especially when I don't feel I could match the vision I had in my head for the flyers...



By the way I'd love to see your turtles Jo!


"I used to want to change the world, now I just wanna leave the room with a little dignity..." - Lotus Weinstock

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Pogo69
SILVER Member since Apr 2006

Pogo69

there's no charge for awesomeness... or attractiveness
Location: limbo

Total posts: 3764
Posted: Written by: Neon Shaolin


How many people have listened to, let's say, Nirvana or more topically - emo music and said 'oh quit your whining and get over yourself'?



Haha!! Neon, I say that (to myself) all the time listening to my daughter's taste in music. She's very emo, look/attitude/music etc...

 Written by: Neon Shaolin


I have often asked myself - which would I prefer? Mental health or unlimited creativity?



I'd love to come across a little more creativity, but I don't think I have enough spare mental health to trade... ubblol


--pogo (pat) [forever and always]

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