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simian


simian

110% MONKEY EVERY TIME ALL THE TIME JUST CANT STOP THE MONKEY
Location: London

Total posts: 3149
Posted:This is quite wow

Written by: www.livescience.com

Scientists have produced superheated gas exceeding temperatures of 2 billion degrees Kelvin, or 3.6 billion degrees Fahrenheit.

This is hotter than the interior of our Sun, which is about 15 million degrees Kelvin, and also hotter than any previous temperature ever achieved on Earth, they say.

They don't know how they did it.

The feat was accomplished in the Z machine at Sandia National Laboratories.

"At first, we were disbelieving," said project leader Chris Deeney. "We repeated the experiment many times to make sure we had a true result."

Thermonuclear explosions are estimated to reach only tens to hundreds of millions of degrees Kelvin; other nuclear fusion experiments have achieved temperatures of about 500 million degrees Kelvin, said a spokesperson at the lab.

The achievement was detailed in the Feb. 24 issue of the journal Physical Review Letters.

The Z machine is the largest X-ray generator in the world. Its designed to test materials under extreme temperatures and pressures. It works by releasing 20 million amps of electricity into a vertical array of very fine tungsten wires. The wires dissolve into a cloud of charged particles, a superheated gas called plasma.

A very strong magnetic field compresses the plasma into the thickness of a pencil lead. This causes the plasma to release energy in the form of X-rays, but the X-rays are usually only several million degrees.

Sandia researchers still arent sure how the machine achieved the new record. Part of it is probably due to the replacement of the tungsten steel wires with slightly thicker steel wires, which allow the plasma ions to travel faster and thus achieve higher temperatures.

One thing that puzzles scientists is that the high temperature was achieved after the plasmas ions should have been losing energy and cooling. Also, when the high temperature was achieved, the Z machine was releasing more energy than was originally put in, something that usually occurs only in nuclear reactions.

Sandia consultant Malcolm Haines theorizes that some unknown energy source is involved, which is providing the machine with an extra jolt of energy just as the plasma ions are beginning to slow down.

Sandia National Laboratories is located by Albuquerque New Mexico and is part of the U.S. Department of Energy (DOE).



eek

z machines, unknown power sources... This is clearly the sexiest thing in science since giant robots.

full link to story


"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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Birgit
BRONZE Member since Jan 2005

Birgit

had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)

Total posts: 4145
Posted:wow.

I love it how they say "the x rays are usually ONLY several million degrees".

How do you measure billions of Kelvin, and how does the whole structure not melt and collapse?!?

Very impressed!


"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)

Owner of Dragosani's left half

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Gnor
BRONZE Member since Mar 2003

Gnor

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Perth, Australia

Total posts: 5814
Posted:thats one awesome thermometer

Is it the Truth?
Is it Fair to all concerned?
Will it build Goodwill and Better Friendships?
Will it be Beneficial to all concerned?

Im in a lonely battle with the world with a fish to match the chip on my shoulder. Gnu in Binnu in a cnu

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spiralx


spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 1376
Posted:Cool! biggrin

"Moo," said the happy cow.

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jeff(fake)


jeff(fake)

Scientist of Fortune
Location: Edinburgh

Total posts: 1189
Posted:Treat with caution till more information comes out.

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...

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ado-p
GOLD Member since May 2004

ado-p

Pirate Ninja
Location: Galway/Ireland

Total posts: 3882
Posted:Wow, you could cook a whole ham in a nanosecond...

Love is the law.

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Rovo
GOLD Member since Jul 2003

Rovo

(the person actually known as Chris Bailey)
Location: Austin, TX, USA

Total posts: 544
Posted:The picture of the Z machine in action is pretty sweet.

Written by:
Because of the high voltage involved, the Z machine is submerged in oil and water. This image shows lightning arcs beneath the liquid surface



Z Machine in Action


Peace, Love, Circles

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NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:Written by: jeff(fake)




Treat with caution till more information comes out.





Temperature is an average so using temperature to describe extremely small sample sizes is misleading or at least useless.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kin...

Total posts: 7330
Posted:Written by: NYC

Temperature is an average so using temperature to describe extremely small sample sizes is misleading or at least useless.



but the temperature of a hot plasma is generally meaured using the electron temperature which can be pretty well defined.

then, as long as you know what percentage of the plasma is ionised, you can determine the ion temperature fairly accurately, no?


the picture of the z machine full of lightning is a bit cool innit?! biggrin


cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Matty_B
SILVER Member since Feb 2005

Matty_B

veteran
Location: Blu's Pocket, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1314
Posted:I guess the way to stop it melting is to hold it within the magnetic field...

though there are always a few crazy stories like this . . . the more energy out than in has been a cold fusion dream for many years. . . .


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Matty_B
SILVER Member since Feb 2005

Matty_B

veteran
Location: Blu's Pocket, United Kingdom

Total posts: 1314
Posted:Still cool story though

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spiralx


spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 1376
Posted:The story is a bit misleading, it's not an "unknown" energy source, they've got a good idea why it happens, it was just unexpected at the time!

I've changed my desktop to this pic (1500x989 pixels)

http://www.sandia.gov/media/images/jpg/Z02.jpg
br>
Crazy looking, beats the crap out of a plasma ball! ubblol


"Moo," said the happy cow.

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spiralx


spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 1376
Posted:Written by: coleman
then, as long as you know what percentage of the plasma is ionised, you can determine the ion temperature fairly accurately, no?


Surely all of a plasma is ionised eh? Since that's the definition and all wink


"Moo," said the happy cow.

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NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:Written by: coleman

Written by: NYC


Temperature is an average so using temperature to describe extremely small sample sizes is misleading or at least useless.



but the temperature of a hot plasma is generally meaured using the electron temperature which can be pretty well defined.

then, as long as you know what percentage of the plasma is ionised, you can determine the ion temperature fairly accurately, no?

cole. x



Yeah, I'm just saying because of the small sample size any 'coolness' associated with this phenomina is purely theoretical as opposed to practical... much like most academic scientific research.

wink


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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Dom
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK

Total posts: 3009
Posted:I want one! This is indeed sexy science! (god I'm such a nerd!)

I'm just hoping that it doesn't turn into one of those stories where they annouce something brilliant that'll solve our energy problems forever only to find out they plugged thier voltage meter in the wrong way round. Anyone remember cold fusion?


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Eera
BRONZE Member since May 2003

old hand
Location: In a test pit, Mackay, Austral...

Total posts: 1107
Posted:Shows what happens when you touch the filiments without gloves on. They overheat and blow.

There is a slight possibility that I am not actually right all of the time.

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Tao Star


Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1662
Posted:well, wow in a way, but what are they going to do with it?



surely it's of no more use than the hottest they got before this?



apart from showing off...that's always a valid excuse i guess. but still, i don't really see the point.


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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Patriarch917
SILVER Member since Oct 2005

Patriarch917

I make my own people.
Location: Nashville, Tennessee, USA

Total posts: 607
Posted:Of course, the real breakthrough is going to come from popping bubbles.

http://www.livescience.com/forcesofnature/050303_hot_bubbles.html


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Tao Star


Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1662
Posted:bubbles, now there's something i can see a point to - they're entertaing and decorative. smile

especially imploding ones. how cool.


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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TheBovrilMonkey
SILVER Member since Sep 2001

TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England

Total posts: 2629
Posted:Written by: Tao Star

well, wow in a way, but what are they going to do with it?

surely it's of no more use than the hottest they got before this?

apart from showing off...that's always a valid excuse i guess. but still, i don't really see the point.



It's to make physicists look cool because, let's face it, they need all the help they can get wink tongue


But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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bender
GOLD Member since Nov 2001

still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Total posts: 6979
Posted:Newtonian physics rely on four forces, and that temperature would create a an excitation that would mess with the strongest of these forces, the nuclear bonding force.
String theory suggests that such realultimatepowah can be detected across branes, and scarier still, across dimensions.
1. this could attract the attention of other intelligences out there, like that of ninjas, or pirates...OR... ninjas AND pirates!
2. conservation of energy must be adhered to. i would hate to think of what had to be used up in order to unleash this energy. there i no free lunch in physics, piracy of ninjitsu.
3. there is no point three.
4. i haven't made a list joke on Hop for like a year.
5. list humour will always be funny.
6. see number 5.
7. see number 7.

b


Laugh Often, Smile Much, Post lolcats Always

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NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:See, now you're on to something. Sololuminescence is WAY cooler than some stupid superhot plasma sample.

This is my favorite part:
Temperatures this high make the study of sonoluminescence especially interesting for the possibility that it might produce a method for achieving thermonuclear fusion.

I'm pretty sure I need some thermonuclear bubbles. I'm not sure why, but I'm pretty sure that I need them.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:... And if you're really bored this weekend you can always make single bubble sonoluminescence but only if there are no cool parties or anything.

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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Tao Star


Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1662
Posted:Written by: NYC


I'm pretty sure I need some thermonuclear bubbles. I'm not sure why, but I'm pretty sure that I need them.



ooh, me too!

i have some bubbles at home, but they're not tht hot. if i had hot ones i could blow them at bread and get some instant toast! woooo! bubble toast!


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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Birgit
BRONZE Member since Jan 2005

Birgit

had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)

Total posts: 4145
Posted:there doesn't have to be a use for it. That's the nice thing about science, you can do it just simply only exclusively for the pursuit of knowledge, and laugh like a little child running after a ball when you find out something new, even if 98 % of the population won't understand you smile

"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)

Owner of Dragosani's left half

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kin...

Total posts: 7330
Posted:Written by: spiralx

Written by: coleman

then, as long as you know what percentage of the plasma is ionised, you can determine the ion temperature fairly accurately, no?


Surely all of a plasma is ionised eh? Since that's the definition and all wink



so what would the difference be between a hot and a cold plasma be then...?

and if you try and say its determined by the tightness of the plasma's arse i'll stick my tongue out at you wink


cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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spiralx


spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 1376
Posted:Whether they're hot or cold? :P Either way they're ionised gas smile

"Moo," said the happy cow.

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kin...

Total posts: 7330
Posted:i think you need to go back and look at the definition of a plasma my man.



plasmas can be ionised at a range of levels, anywhere from 1% ionisation (supercold plasma) all the way up to near full ionisation ('4th state of matter' hot plasma like you get in the sun).



so, to answer your original question; no - the definition of a plasma is not that it is a fully ionised gas tongue





cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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spiralx


spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 1376
Posted:Ok, I'll be quiet now smile

"Moo," said the happy cow.

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87wt2gxq7


87wt2gxq7

veteran
Location: Birmingham

Total posts: 1502
Posted:Written by: coleman

but the temperature of a hot plasma is generally meaured using the electron temperature which can be pretty well defined.

then, as long as you know what percentage of the plasma is ionised, you can determine the ion temperature fairly accurately, no?




Can you? How does gas (okay, ion) temperature couple to electron temperature, and how is it only determined by the ionisation fraction, yo? Is it an equipartion type groove thang?


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Glåss
DIAMOND Member since Nov 2001

Glåss

The Ministry of Manipulation
Location: Bristol, United Kingdom

Total posts: 2523
Posted:2 billion kelvin

Wow thats nearly as hot as my late night blues dancing party smile

Thankies for posting. biggrin


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