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Forums > Social Discussion > Wiccan Symbols on Gravestones?

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Prometheus


Prometheus

Diamond In The Rough
Location: Richmond, Virginia

Total posts: 459
Posted:Two seperate Wiccan groups have asked the federal government to approve the pentagram for use on deceased veteran's grave markers
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Since we have no established religion in the US, so you shouldn't have to belong to the monotheistic 'big three' to have your religious symbol on your gravestone, especially if you've given your life for your country. This is purely political cowardice. frown


Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.

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ducky2108


ducky2108

A little bit of a board whore
Location: Glasgow

Total posts: 147
Posted:I want to know what the religious symbol for atheism looks like.

Ancient wiseman say "It is very strange person, who, when left alone in room with teacosy, does not try it on"

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Prometheus


Prometheus

Diamond In The Rough
Location: Richmond, Virginia

Total posts: 459
Posted:I wondered that myself, halfway through the article.

I'd also like to see a list of "approved" religions that lacks a large Wiccan fellowship...


Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:Written by: ducky2108

I want to know what the religious symbol for atheism looks like.



google rocks smile


cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Birgit
BRONZE Member since Jan 2005

Birgit

had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
Location: Edinburgh

Total posts: 4145
Posted:so if you're an atheist you have an atom-like thing? what if you don't believe in science either? ubblol

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:no, i think what that page shows is that there is no one, agreed upon symbol to represent atheists.

besides, you can't 'believe in science' - you can only concur with its findings so far wink


cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Domino
SILVER Member since May 2004

UnNatural Scientist - Currently working on a Breville-legged monkey
Location: Bath Uni or Shrewsbury, UK

Total posts: 757
Posted:http://www.helsinki.fi/~ssyreeni/atheist/no-ghost-c-06.en.html
br>
A few athesis symbols, the IPU one is quite cute


Give me a lever long enough and a place to stand and I can beat the world into submission.

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Domino
SILVER Member since May 2004

UnNatural Scientist - Currently working on a Breville-legged monkey
Location: Bath Uni or Shrewsbury, UK

Total posts: 757
Posted:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbols_used_in_U.S._veterans%27_cemeteries
br>
Some of the others used if anyone's interested. Looks like the atheism one is probably the American Atheists symbol (the atom and A)


Give me a lever long enough and a place to stand and I can beat the world into submission.

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Lurch
BRONZE Member since Nov 2003

Lurch

old hand
Location: Oregon

Total posts: 929
Posted:No offence, but Wiccans are pretty far down the totem pole when it comes to world religions and population/popularity. There are a lot of other groups that should be coming first if you want to start playing that game. Eventually though it's going to become a massive database of different symbols for specific religions/people. Someone is going to get the wrong icon put on their gravestone and the lion will have three heads instead of two heads and a serpents tail, or he'll be holding three arrows instead of an arrow and an olive branch and then all hell will break lose...

*pardon my ramblings... I didn't get any sleep tonight..


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Sethis
BRONZE Member since Mar 2017

Sethis

Pooh-Bah
Location: York University

Total posts: 1762
Posted:ubblol

Ultimately, does it matter? Why do you need any kind of symbol indicating religion on your tombstone? Why not just the name, date and a short epitaph?

But then maybe people have more rigid views on it than I do...


After much consideration, I find that the view is worth the asphyxiation.
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Birgit
BRONZE Member since Jan 2005

Birgit

had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
Location: Edinburgh

Total posts: 4145
Posted:The article says that actually 36 symbols have been approved (including an atheist one), so you don't have to be the big three, and wicca probably scores higher in popularity than some of the other 36... ah well. I didn't even know you needed approval of symbols on tombstones. Next they'll regulate what underwear you can wear for cremation rolleyes

"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)

Owner of Dragosani's left half

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Prometheus


Prometheus

Diamond In The Rough
Location: Richmond, Virginia

Total posts: 459
Posted:Written by: Birgit

The article says that actually 36 symbols have been approved (including an atheist one), so you don't have to be the big three, and wicca probably scores higher in popularity than some of the other 36... ah well. I didn't even know you needed approval of symbols on tombstones. Next they'll regulate what underwear you can wear for cremation rolleyes

Personally, I don't even see a need for cemeteries, much less tombstones, but that's a whole 'nother thread... rolleyes I think it's just a matter of respect. As long as it's not viewed as a scorecard.


Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.

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jo_rhymes
SILVER Member since Apr 2005

jo_rhymes

Momma Bear
Location: Telford, Shrops

Total posts: 4525
Posted:it's weird isnt it? how much importance people place on death.
I was chatting to my mum t'other day, she'd just done her will and had to specify her funeral plans. She's decided to be buried in a cardboard eco-friendly coffin with a tree planted to mark where she lies.
It's never nice to think of death, but why not let people just have whatever kind of burial or tombstone they want! It's not much to ask. On the other hand, i'm not bothered either way. I'd quite like to have a little doggy chipped into my tombstone, that'd be cute. awww.


Hoppers are angels who lift us to our feet when our wings have trouble remembering how to fly.

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NOn


activist for HoPper liberation.
Location: ffidrac

Total posts: 1643
Posted:Written by: Prometheus

Written by: Birgit

The article says that actually 36 symbols have been approved (including an atheist one), so you don't have to be the big three, and wicca probably scores higher in popularity than some of the other 36... ah well. I didn't even know you needed approval of symbols on tombstones. Next they'll regulate what underwear you can wear for cremation rolleyes

Personally, I don't even see a need for cemeteries, much less tombstones, but that's a whole 'nother thread... rolleyes I think it's just a matter of respect. As long as it's not viewed as a scorecard.



ubblol that would be funny, can imagine these, rabbi's, priest and the like scooting round the graveyards tallying up the fallen.... Hinduism would lose out pretty quick since it's part of their thing that they are cremated i believe.

but maybe people should think about their underwear for cremation, nice natural fibres please, no synthetics wink A ridiculous amount of pollution is caused my cremations, especially if the whole coffin is whacked in, fully lacquered, with plastic handles and everything.... go in cardboard style, or papier mache or if you like, a willow basket....... I am a mine of information on green funerals, i did my degree project on it smile

as for the tombstones, you should be able to have whatever you bloody like carved into it, it'd be nice though if people could be more inventive with them, if they're going to go to the trouble of having them. There's a book called beautiful death which has lots of pictures of some fab sculptural tombstones... most of which were taken in france methinks.....


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if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.

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Sporky


Sporky

addict
Location: Glasgow

Total posts: 663
Posted:I want to be cremated and have my ashes scattered off the end of the pier at St Andrews. Personally, if someone wants something carved on their grave stone then it should be up to them, just as it is their right to choose where they are burried.

Have faith in what you can do and respect for what you can't

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Birgit
BRONZE Member since Jan 2005

Birgit

had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
Location: Edinburgh

Total posts: 4145
Posted:Actually I was thinking of synthetic underwear just after sending off the post, but I had to go shrug

The Swedish (I think) way of shockfrosting the bodies so that they just fall to tiny dust pieces is quite cool and eco-friendly, I wouldn't mind that.

ah, here's the link smile

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4293992.stm


"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)

Owner of Dragosani's left half

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DoktorSkell
SILVER Member since Jan 2005

DoktorSkell

addict
Location: Van Diemans Land

Total posts: 475
Posted:So why exactly do you need approval for what is displayed on your gravestone?

Fair luna bright, fair luna moon
it shines at night but fades too soon
fair luna moon, fair luna bright
forever we dance
we dance under starlight

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Sporky


Sporky

addict
Location: Glasgow

Total posts: 663
Posted:Possibly so as not to offend people who don't like your chose religion. I mean a Nazi might not like to know there's a Jew burried in the same cemetary as a member of his/her family tongue

Honestly though, I think its just the military's lust for conformity and people being slightly uneducated about less popular religions that stops the wiccan iconography being used.


Have faith in what you can do and respect for what you can't

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Boo_Bunny
BRONZE Member since Mar 2017

Boo_Bunny

Sparkely arty Mormon rainbow fairy
Location: infront of you

Total posts: 933
Posted:whats funny about the story is that its from salem, massachusetts. no wonder the wiccans are having a hard time about this.

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Sporky


Sporky

addict
Location: Glasgow

Total posts: 663
Posted:lol

I have a wiccan ex from Natick Ma and she used to get holy water thrown over her on regular occasions. And the Christian Union in St Andrews were joking about branding pagans with cigarettes the other day.


Have faith in what you can do and respect for what you can't

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Eera


old hand
Location: In a test pit, Mackay

Total posts: 1107
Posted:It's suprisingly hard to get non-standard stuff on gravestones; some places that have been on the news won't let things like "daddy" or "grandmum" on.

Their argument is that they want to preserve a certain dignity about the place which can be diminished by the content of inscriptions, and personally I concur. While a little affection might not go amiss I'd hate to see the inevitable "I told you I was ill..." popping up all over the shop.

If you have a look around a cathedral and see the stuff they used to put on gravestones; all bones and skulls and worms, do you think the same things would be tolerable today? There's a lot of graveyards now that present themselves as memorial gardens and try to pretend there isn't a bunch of dead people under your feet.

Your religion should be reflected in the way you lived your life, so what does it matter what your gravestone is like.

I'm going to be buried facing north under a barrow with lots of grave goods, so in 1000 years an archaeologist will reconstruct my face for the telly.


There is a slight possibility that I am not actually right all of the time.

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Igirisujin
SILVER Member since Jul 2005

Igirisujin

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Preston

Total posts: 2666
Posted:I havnt read the article, or possibly understood the first post but....

...if these are for use on deceased veteran's grave markers wouldnt it make more sense not to allow the wiccan symbles or any others. On what authority do we have it that these deceased veterens were ever wiccans in the first place? You wouldnt just guess and slap any old marker on a tombstone would you?


Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat

'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?

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TinklePants
GOLD Member since Jul 2005

TinklePants

Clique Infiltrator, Cunning Linguist and Master Debator
Location: Edinburgh burgh burrrrrr

Total posts: 4217
Posted:Being somewhat wiccan myself I don't see why it would be a problem. If one wishes to show their beliefs through symbolism, they should be granted that wish. I more often than not wear my pentagram necklace, which I've had so many years I can't remember when I bought it (I think it was when I was in school (15 or 16 - 8 yrs ago) but like I said, I can't remember lol

Joe - we don't know the deceased's wishes - his family probably did though....


Always use "so's your face" and "only on Tuesdays" in as many conversations possible

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Sporky


Sporky

addict
Location: Glasgow

Total posts: 663
Posted:Written by: TinklePants
we don't know the deceased's wishes - his family probably did though....



True. So if the deceased wanted to be catapulted into a tank filled with live shrimp then who are we to argue? wink If the American government had the right idea they'd leave it up to the family to decide what happens after their loved one has dies.


Have faith in what you can do and respect for what you can't

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TinklePants
GOLD Member since Jul 2005

TinklePants

Clique Infiltrator, Cunning Linguist and Master Debator
Location: Edinburgh burgh burrrrrr

Total posts: 4217
Posted:Might I add...

Not all wiccans worship the same pantheon of Gods. Some worship the old european Gods like Thor etc, others the Roman Gods, Venus and Jupiter, others the greek pantheon, Zeus and Aphrodite, and others worship local Gods. Then there are the elementals, fairies and other spirits. You can mix and match it, as its not Who you worship but their values, influences and what they stand for (love, leadership, etc). It's a very personalised religion. Well, not exactly a religion as it's core beliefs predates all religions. It was the first belief system.

I'd better stop before I write a 3000 word essay on the subject lol


Always use "so's your face" and "only on Tuesdays" in as many conversations possible

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NOn


activist for HoPper liberation.
Location: ffidrac

Total posts: 1643
Posted:Written by: Birgit

Actually I was thinking of synthetic underwear just after sending off the post, but I had to go shrug

The Swedish (I think) way of shockfrosting the bodies so that they just fall to tiny dust pieces is quite cool and eco-friendly, I wouldn't mind that.

ah, here's the link smile

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4293992.stm




wow, that's amazing, hadn't seen that one before! thanks for posting the link. i suppose it makes a lot of sense, if people get all brittle and you can break them up, but would also have thought that method of freezing would be good for preserving bodies in tact, like you freeze dry strawberries... you'd just have to be careful not to drop them!


Aurinko freedom agreement reached 10th Sept 2006

if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.

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NOn


activist for HoPper liberation.
Location: ffidrac

Total posts: 1643
Posted:Written by: Eera

If you have a look around a cathedral and see the stuff they used to put on gravestones; all bones and skulls and worms, do you think the same things would be tolerable today? There's a lot of graveyards now that present themselves as memorial gardens and try to pretend there isn't a bunch of dead people under your feet.




mmm... another thing that's interesting to look at is memento mori sculptures, there's a good book on that too. that's all about reminding people that there is life and there is death, it was used a lot in sculptures, as well as tombstones. I remember seeing a picture of one cathedral tomb for a bishop or some such, who had three .... i forgotten what they're called but the sculptural carving thing you see on the tombs of dead bishops and the like ... that is the top of the tomb stone, you know that thing... well this dude had three of them on different shelves above his tomb depicting his body in various stages of decomposition.... it didn't mention whether they got him out at various stages to use as a model though....

but yeah, i agree with you they probably wouldn't let you have that sort of thing in a tidy clipped grass "memorial garden". Probably they even cover him up in the cathedral now.... who'd want to be buried there anyway, where's the fun in that? there should be more spooky looking graveyards with gothic arches, higgledy piggledy gravestones and overgrown undergrowth biggrin


Aurinko freedom agreement reached 10th Sept 2006

if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.

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Ange_GSC
SILVER Member since Aug 2005

Ange_GSC

HOP's glowstick ambassador!!
Location: Bay Area, California

Total posts: 128
Posted:Have any of you read the Da Vinci Code?

Apparently the Pentagram represents a hell of a lot more than just devil worship. Its a symbol that been around before christianity even existed.


missegyptology: "I just remember beingall off balance and unicycling really fast down to campus and the arabic was all blurred on the page"

^When Linz pulls an all nighter before Arabic class^

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TinklePants
GOLD Member since Jul 2005

TinklePants

Clique Infiltrator, Cunning Linguist and Master Debator
Location: Edinburgh burgh burrrrrr

Total posts: 4217
Posted:I'm not angry but its the way you said it "apparently" and "represents a hell of a lot more than just devil worship" I wish people would get proper knowledge on this subject.

The pentagram does not represent devil worship
The inverted pentagram (upside down) is however, used in satanism, usually with a goats head in the middle.

The pentagram is a power/protective/earth symbol.
The top spike of the star points towards the heavens. the 5 points represent the 5 senses, 5 extremities of man - head, arms, legs), the compass (four ponts and your location), the four elements and the fifth which is spirit, etc.

When inverted it stands basically for self-ego, and the journey to better ones self no matter the cost to others. Or something like it. Which is one of the beliefs of satanism.

I blame '70's horror movies for beginning the whole "pentagram is evil" way of thinking.

I have a copy of the da vinci code too btw.


Always use "so's your face" and "only on Tuesdays" in as many conversations possible

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NOn


activist for HoPper liberation.
Location: ffidrac

Total posts: 1643
Posted:Written by: TinklePants

The pentagram is a power/protective/earth symbol.
The top spike of the star points towards the heavens. the 5 points represent the 5 senses, 5 extremities of man - head, arms, legs), the compass (four ponts and your location), the four elements and the fifth which is spirit, etc.




ah ha! i tried to find out what it meant for another random project of mine, nobody i asked at the time could give me an answer.... but now i have one, bit overdue, but still it's nice to know, kind of the same conclusion i came to, great! thankee muchly...


Aurinko freedom agreement reached 10th Sept 2006

if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.

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Igirisujin
SILVER Member since Jul 2005

Igirisujin

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Preston

Total posts: 2666
Posted:Written by:
Written by: Eera
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


If you have a look around a cathedral and see the stuff they used to put on gravestones; all bones and skulls and worms, do you think the same things would be tolerable today? There's a lot of graveyards now that present themselves as memorial gardens and try to pretend there isn't a bunch of dead people under your feet.



I know its a shame, I hate those shiny clean lined plain headstones people use today. I want gargoils and ravens and allsorts on my tombstone. Theres an old cemetery near where I live and a newer one a few miles up the road, the old style is infinatly better too look at.


Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat

'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?

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