Forums > Social Discussion > f it weren't for H.G. Wells, Sci-Fi wouldn't be what it is today...
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3,540 posts
Location: Bristol UK
Do you believe the above statement to be True/False?
Discuss your opinions of his works, or indeed your opinion on any Sci-Fi works.
Who (In your opinion) was a/the role model for modern Sci Fi?
What defines Sci-Fi from fantasy?
Edit: I changed some bits to make this topic a bit broader...
EDITED_BY: Long_Time_Coming (1132231529)
Empty your mind. Be formless, Shapeless, like Water.
Put Water into a cup, it becomes the cup, put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, put water into a teapot, it becomes the teapot.
Water can flow, or it can Crash.
Be Water My Friend.
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh
There are only two types of sci-fi;
Type1:1984, Brave New World and the works of H.G Wells
Type2:Crap (relatively speaking of course)
Todays sci-fi has nothing of the originality of Wells's books so I'm not sure how much of an influence he has actually had. Wells ought to be mandatory reading for anyone wanting to write sci-fi though.
According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,666 posts
Location: Preston, United Kingdom
There has been alot of good sci-fi's made, all be them put in the same catagory with plastic shiny crap like startrek (except DS9, and the orrigional for comedic value like polistirene rocks and never ever ever wear red
)To be honest as far as I know I dont think HG wells has much to do with good sci-fi, unless of course Alien, Sollaris, Farscape, Space 1999, and Battlestar Galactica had any simalar themes or anything based on his work in them.
Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat
'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
I dunno. I think that Jules Verne had something to do with it.
As did Isaac Asimov, the father of the modern Space Opera.
Sorry, bub, but leave Asimov out of it and I might have to aim a blaster at you and close the contact...
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
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Location: Gold Coast, Qld, Australia
Arthur C Clarke, read some top stuff by this guy, he made a few movies, space Odesy 2001 is one of em
i think 
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i didn't know 1984 was sci-fi, i mean as far as i know sci-fi is about science somehow effecting the future, often with moral problems. but 1984 is more than that isn't it?
"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"
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3,540 posts
Location: Bristol UK
Ooooh... more Sci-fi fathers...
Nice...
As to 1984, never read it... from what I've heard, I'd love to...
Empty your mind. Be formless, Shapeless, like Water.
Put Water into a cup, it becomes the cup, put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, put water into a teapot, it becomes the teapot.
Water can flow, or it can Crash.
Be Water My Friend.
coming to a country near you
4,696 posts
Location: home of the tiney toothy bear, Australia
you soo should, its like a drug, you'll never think quite the same after........
i read it two years ago and just found the movie version n my school library last week. the movie isn't very good if you havent read the book first, but for those who have read the book should see the movie.
"but have you considered there is more to life than your eyelids?"
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1,584 posts
Location: Angels Landing, USA
Doc is right. Arthur C Clarke, who wrote 2001: a space oddessy and many other "progressive" sci-fi writers claimed to have learned from Asimov.
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HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Clarke is good. Maybe even he's a "Father."
Oh, and Frank Herbert? DUNE? Maybe not a "father," but definately a strong force.
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
Basu gasu bakuhatsu - because sometimes buses explode
1,584 posts
Location: Angels Landing, USA
Dune was to sci fi what the Matrix films were to action flicks.
Amazing world and first book/movie, to be followed up by a load of bullocks.
To do: More Firedrums 08 video?
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Fresno fire
Mission: Ignition
534 posts
Location: Central New Jersey, USA
Maybe true, everyone learns from everyone else and then puts their own spin into it. Socrates taugh Aristotle who taught Plato. All three are said to have a big impact on philosophy, but dispite one teaching the other, they all gave separate contributions. They worked their new ideas from their predeccesors.
So while HG Wells might have have an impact, but he had the most impact on the crap. Every good writer has their own style.
(by the way, im not totally sure of the order of the greek philosophers and who thaught whom.)
Don't mind me, just passing through.
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh
Written by: Doc Lightning
Sorry, bub, but leave Asimov out of it and I might have to aim a blaster at you and close the contact...
The grandaddy of unconvincing sci-fi characters. Also wins the title for the most contrived and boring end to a vast galaxy and millenia spanning story arc ever.
Written by: Brit_Joe
...Farscape....
According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK
Written by: jeff(fake)
There are only two types of sci-fi;
Type1:1984, Brave New World and the works of H.G Wells
Type2:Crap (relatively speaking of course)
Todays sci-fi has nothing of the originality of Wells's books so I'm not sure how much of an influence he has actually had. Wells ought to be mandatory reading for anyone wanting to write sci-fi though.
That's a vast over-generalisation now isn't it?
Unless of course you're saying that only the first author of a style of books can be defined to be original, in which I case I think that's a ridiculous argument... "Moo," said the happy cow.
Pooh-Bah
1,762 posts
Location: York University, United Kingdom
There is a lot of good Sci-Fi out there, and lots of it wasn't written by "The Giants" as it were. Anyone read Kevin J Anderson "Ressurection Inc"? Or lots of other stuff (can't be bothered to list it) is actually better than some of Asimov and Well's creations.
And where do you draw the line between Sci-Fi and Fantasy? Because that opens up a whole new can of worms.
After much consideration, I find that the view is worth the asphyxiation.
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1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh
Written by: spiralxWritten by: jeff(fake)
There are only two types of sci-fi;
Type1:1984, Brave New World and the works of H.G Wells
Type2:Crap (relatively speaking of course)
Todays sci-fi has nothing of the originality of Wells's books so I'm not sure how much of an influence he has actually had. Wells ought to be mandatory reading for anyone wanting to write sci-fi though.
That's a vast over-generalisation now isn't it?
Kind of obviously a personal opinion
. I just don't enjoy any of the modern sci-fi as much as I do Wells. In addition you must admit that there are a lot of plot devices which come up a lot and a lot of bad science (look, the aliens are all humonoid and speak perfect English). I'm sure there is some good sci-fi out there but when you compare it to the great sci-fi the difference is obvious.p.s. if anyone nows of any great modern sci-fi (and I mean on a par with Wells) I'd be happy to read it
. According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,666 posts
Location: Preston, United Kingdom
Written by: Sethis
There is a lot of good Sci-Fi out there, and lots of it wasn't written by "The Giants" as it were. Anyone read Kevin J Anderson "Ressurection Inc"? Or lots of other stuff (can't be bothered to list it) is actually better than some of Asimov and Well's creations.
And where do you draw the line between Sci-Fi and Fantasy? Because that opens up a whole new can of worms.
Sci-fi is phantasy, it dosent need to be particularary futureistic. I also forgot to mention Bladerunner and Logans Run! And oh yes Dune, how could I forget that, cool film I should read the books sometime.
Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat
'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?
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3,540 posts
Location: Bristol UK
Written by: Brit_Joe
Sci-fi is phantasy
Woah there, Joe. Sci-Fi isn't Fantasy (with an 'F'
) If Sci-fi is fantasy, you could say that Professor Steven Hawking shouldn't be regarded as a professor, but as a Fantasy Novelist, due to his books on all his theories. Besides, a lot of sci-fi stuff could turn out to be real in the not too distant future. Things such as alien beings/invasion, time travel... Sci-Fi doesn't necessarily have to be Futuristic, either.I can see where you're coming from, But I think you mean to say it is Fictional, not fantasy. But who's to say that one day, it might even be fact?
I class Fantasy as books/film that are about/include things such as magical beasts, fairies, pixies and the like, Films like the Dark Crystal, Legend, Lord of the rings even, is fantasy.
Empty your mind. Be formless, Shapeless, like Water.
Put Water into a cup, it becomes the cup, put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, put water into a teapot, it becomes the teapot.
Water can flow, or it can Crash.
Be Water My Friend.
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,666 posts
Location: Preston, United Kingdom
Oh I do dunno I cant spell. Well I see little difference between fantasy and fictional, as there both made up and come from the imagination, and anything from your imagination is fanstasy.
Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat
'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?
Stream Entrant
2,829 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Do you believe the above statement to be? True, look at the number of movies and a certain radio play made out of his books.
Discuss your opinions of his works. Never found them that great to read.
Who (In your opinion) was a/the role model for modern Sci Fi? No contest, Sir Thomas Malory's Le Morte Darthur.
What defines Sci-Fi from fantasy? There is no distinction. Wells and Verne were originally classified as science romance.
If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Written by: jeff(fake)Written by: Doc Lightning
Sorry, bub, but leave Asimov out of it and I might have to aim a blaster at you and close the contact...
The grandaddy of unconvincing sci-fi characters. Also wins the title for the most contrived and boring end to a vast galaxy and millenia spanning story arc ever.
Asimov-bashing heathen SCUM!!!
*Aims a blaster at Jeff and closes the contact.*
-Mike
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK
Written by: jeff(fake)
Kind of obviously a personal opinion
p.s. if anyone nows of any great modern sci-fi (and I mean on a par with Wells) I'd be happy to read it
Humanoid aliens that speak English? Maybe if you're reading sci-fi from twenty years ago (or Anne McCaffrey, heh) but I can't remember seeing any of those in any books I've read in the last few years
Recommendations?
Distress and Permutation City by Greg Egan
https://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0006480128
https://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0752816497
Revelation Space by Alaistair Reynolds
https://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/1857987489/
The Time Ships (incidentally the authorised followup to The Time Machine) by Stephen Baxter
https://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0006480128
Altered Carbon by Richard Morgan
https://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0345457684
Off the top of my head
All books I've enjoyed lots, probably Distress is my favourite out of these ones... "Moo," said the happy cow.
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
SpiralX: ditto greg bear.
I would say Raft by Stephen Baxter was still his best work.
The Gods Themselves : Isaac Asimov (only really good asimov work, apart from stranger in a strange land and friday.)
Tiger! Tiger! (The stars my destination) : Alfred Bester
The Demolished Man : Alfred Bester
The Child Garden : Geoff Ryman
Vurt : Jeff Noon
The Sparrow : Mary Doria Russell (much much much better than contact, but then, who reads carl sagan anyway?)
Enders Game (and the rest of the ender books) : Orson Scott Card
Solaris : Stanislaw Lem (obvious)
and yes, you should read the entire Dune Trilogy, and the three books after that too. But Dune is the best.
and in reply to the original thread, Stanislaw Lem has an entire book discussing what science fiction is. You should take a look at it.
I love Anne McCaffrey!
for a real science fiction book, go read: Godel, Escher, Bach by Douglas Hofstadter.
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK
I'd disagree about Dune, sure they're classics but they're poo
Wasn't mad keen on Vurt either. If you like that sort of thing Richard Morgan does it better.If you like really mind-expanding sci-fi, read Star Maker by Olaf Stapleton - written in 1925 and still brilliant.
I like all of Stephen Baxter's stuff, about as epic as you can get, but definitely read Evolution - it's a series of stories each about one of humanity's evolutionary ancestors from the time of the dinosaurs towards the present day. Very well told!
"Moo," said the happy cow.
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,533 posts
Location: Hampshire College, MA, USA
I put in my vote for Isaac Asimov. He's hugely influential in sci-fi, I doubt there are many sci-fi writers who haven't taken something from him.
-James
"How do you know if you're happy or sad without a mask? Or angry? Or ready for dessert?"
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
How can you not like dune! It kicks ass, if only for the bit about "I must not fear"
I'll have a look at richard morgan, never heard of him myself.
Yeah, I read star maker, I thought it was okay. Flowers for algernon I liked better out of the master works series.
And I forgot william gibson, but if you like that sort of thing, you'd know. Plus I had to spend exorbital amounts of money at the library when I forgot to return it...
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
371 posts
Location: Edinburgh
if you like Asmiov space operas then check out Peter F. Hamilton, the heir apparent to Mr. Clarke. His Night's Dawn trilogy put the pep back into modern British Sci Fi.
As for enders game mcp the first was good then it got all preachy.
And for creepy old techno slight fantasy mix try china meiville, he's cool cause he listens to drum and bass
Viva UGLY STAFF
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
china melville listens to drum and bass? Shame his books are [censored].
I might agree with you about revelation space, if it didn't read like airport novel sci fi.
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
old hand
1,107 posts
Location: In a test pit, Mackay, Australia
Anyone read Evgeny Zamyatin's "We".
Then read 1984 and Brave New World and realised exactly where Huxley and Orwell got their ideas from.
It's so hard to find decent sci-fi. The majority of it seems to be "Fantasy masquerading as..." or is a simple horror/western/whatever with ray guns. To find stuff with some actual science in it seems rare.
I have a deep and somewhat sameful love for Douglas Hill. Hell, I grew up reading the guy, what can I say.
There is a slight possibility that I am not actually right all of the time.
371 posts
Location: Edinburgh
Good hard stuff is all about peter f hamilton
sounds a bit dirty that
Viva UGLY STAFF
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
clarke was always pretty crap, and pete f hamilton, airport novelist also. My god man, have some dignity, it's like saying you like kim stanley robinson!
I never really liked hard sci-fi, I mean, wow, all your calculations are impeccable and you physics is all entirely correct and complete. You should have took your knowledge and made a space elevator instead of writing about it.
Making up aliens and then talking to them in books, is like distorting your image in a mirror for a good old bit of navel gazing with your distorted self. So if a author can make up a convincingly alien race and then write about them, I appreciate that.
Otherwise it's ideas all the way, I don't care if they're more fantastical than most fantasy novels, it's what I like in sci-fi, and you could probably tell by the books I wrote up above. That and good writing.
Which reminds me: Neal Stephenson's first novel, Snow Crash. Also a classic.
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
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