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Hanzveteran
1,328 posts
Location: Bendigo, Vic, Australia


Posted:
Morning All
For my Health & Human Development class I have had to reasearch Alternative and Complimentary Medicines.
I have put together a basic survey, which I would like people to answer.
If you can think of any other questions, please tell me and I will consider a slight change to the survey.
Thank you.

What do you know about alternative or complimentary medicines?
What do you think about the use of alternative and complimentary medicines?
Have you ever used an Alternative or Complimentary medicine?
If Yes, please answer the following
Which Alternative or Complimentary medicine did you used?
Why did you use it?
Would you use it again? Why/ Why Not?
If you answered No to question one, please answer the following
Would you ever consider using an Alternative or complimentary medicine? Why/ Why not

flash fireBRONZE Member
Sporadically Prodigal
2,758 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia


Posted:
What do you know about alternative or complimentary medicines?



As far as I know, officially alternative and complimentary medicine is essentially this: remedies that do not have FDA (or equivalent) approval, nor do they undergo clinical trials and scientific testing. Practitioners do not have to be assessed or qualified and the medicine is not scrutineered by the TGA.



In a more casual sense, however, when people mention complimentary or alternative medicine, it means traditional, herbal, new age & eastern medicine.



What do you think about the use of alternative and complimentary medicines?



I think many of them are wonderful and should play a far larger role in the health of our society than simply hammering bacteria with antibiotics. I also think that much dis-ease is psychosematic, and natural medicine (naturopathy in particular) can eradicate these sorts of things through the development of healthy lifestyle, respect for the earth and a better understanding of food & its medicinal qualities.



In China, the use of TCM (Traditional Chinese Medicine) - herbs, acupuncture, massage etc is all part of the national health scheme and is provided FOC to people... Wouldn't that be great if that was to happen in Australia. Unfortunately, the pharmaceutical industry is way too wealthy and influencial (subsidiary of the petrochemical industry, after all), so it will never happen. Besides, Jo Blow & Mrs Bloggs out in the 'burbs generally don't want to be prescribed anything other than what western medicine recommends. They'll have none of that hippy crap, thanks very much.





Have you ever used an Alternative or Complimentary medicine?



Yes.



If Yes, please answer the following

Which Alternative or Complimentary medicine did you used?




Naturopathy

Homeopathy

Acupuncture/Acupressure

Herbs/Vitamins

Meditation





Why did you use it?



Because I believe that mother earth provides everything we need - food is medicine, herbs can fix anything, and a healthy approach & excellent diet will rid most ailments, and I also think that thousands of years of practice certainly has some basis (TCM). I watched my aunt eradicate breast cancer through raw food, herbal remedies and yoga.





Would you use it again? Why/ Why Not?



Yep. If I have a cold, I'll take a herbal remedy. I feel far more in tune with myself when utilising natural therapies - opens the heart and mind & spirit.





If you answered No to question one, please answer the following

Would you ever consider using an Alternative or complimentary medicine? Why/ Why not




n/a



Sorry for the rant.

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Is it Fair to all concerned?
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If you can answer YES to these 4 questions then you may post a reply.


Hanzveteran
1,328 posts
Location: Bendigo, Vic, Australia


Posted:
all good, you werent ranting.
thanks for those... keep them coming please guys!

jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
What do you know about alternative or complimentary medicines?
I have extensive knowledge about most things considered complimentary medicine. Almost all of it is useless. Chiropractics is slightly dangerous but can have effects (both good and bad). Herbal remedies can be benificial but most are just nostrum and can even be harmful. Homeopathy in particular is absolute rubbish.

What do you think about the use of alternative and complimentary medicines?
It's just modern day snake oil. Personally I think this is just a symtom of a grave ill that is sweeping over society. People have lost pride in themselves and fear the truth. Verily they turn to anything to provide them with comfort, forsaking reason in their flight. I believe that this is something that should be fought at every step with every ounce of strength that I have.
.
Have you ever used an Alternative or Complimentary medicine?
I'll let you guess...

If you answered No to question one, please answer the following
Would you ever consider using an Alternative or complimentary medicine? Why/ Why not

No, because I will not support an industry that I consider to be, essentially, evil. I don't think that the practiciner themselves are particularily malicous but they have fooled themselved with a childs fantasy and in doing so do great harm to society.

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


onewheeldaveGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom


Posted:
Written by: jeff(fake)



It's just modern day snake oil. Personally I think this is just a symtom of a grave ill that is sweeping over society. People have lost pride in themselves and fear the truth. Verily they turn to anything to provide them with comfort, forsaking reason in their flight. I believe that this is something that should be fought at every step with every ounce of strength that I have.






Don't Worry Jeff: One day a real rain will come- and wash all the scum from the streets.

smile

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!


jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
Written by: onewheeldave


Don't Worry Jeff: One day a real rain will come- and wash all the scum from the streets.




I'll stop readin poetry for a while I think... rolleyes

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


MiGGOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,414 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia


Posted:
what do you know?

Admittedly, not much. I figure that there has to be some benefits behind it, cos there wouldn't be many thousand years of people using it if it did nothing. Not too sure about acupuncture and similar stuff, but i figure herbs and oils could work.



I mean, they've proven that colours affect mood (or so i've heard, not 100% sure about correctness), so i figure that ingesting something has to have some effect.



Plus, there's plenty of things out there that can kill you if you eat them, so there has to be some stuff that's good for you...



what do you think?

To each their own. A fusion between eastern and western/ pharmaceutical and natural/whatever you call it would be cool, take the best bits from each.



One woman i know is on about 5 different daily tablets for arthiritis. One tablet helps the arthiritis, but causes headaches. The one that fixes the headaches causes bloating. The one that helps the bloating causes etc etc etc. Maybe, somewhere, there's a herb, oil, pressure point, psychsomatic treatment or something that'd help the arthiritis and not have any side effects.



Me, personally, i'd rather not take anything unless i really feel like i need it. If i have a bad headache (and by bad headache, i mean the sort that make me throw up, and think of any method possible to end the pain. In the throes of the worst i've had, i contemplated suicide, cos that'd hurt less), i'll have a mercyndol (really strong headache stuff), but thats about it for tablets. If i have a bad cough, my solution is ammonia and senega (tastes like poo, but more natural than the normal cough medicine, and at about 1/4 the price. Plus, i think it's more effective). For cuts and stuff, i'll use tea tree oil.



Ideallically, i wouldn't use anything, take what my life throws at me and use it to strengthen my body. But, sometimes, it hurts too much. And others, you just need intervention of some kind. I'm not one of those people who'd rather lose a leg to something easily preventable rather than use western medicine.



I guess, the point i'm rambling towards is that a mix of both is probably best.



do/have you used them?

Yeah, every now and then. I think i answered that in that last question, though.



if answered no etc

n/a...

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie


roarfireSILVER Member
comfortably numb
2,676 posts
Location: The countryside, Australia


Posted:
What do you know about alternative or complimentary medicines?



Unfortunately, I really don't know much. I have been meaning to find out more about it because it's all very interesting, and I will one day.



What do you think about the use of alternative and complimentary medicines?



As far as I know, it has many benefits... but like everything I'm sure it has downsides too. I am a bit skepictal about some forms....but that doesn't mean I won't give it try though. However, to be honest, if I had to pick between natural medicine and standard medicine I would probably pick standard medicine. I think I trust it more.



Have you ever used an Alternative or Complimentary medicine?



Over the last few years I've had a lot of problems with muscle spasms. I used to take (and still do when it flares up) some natural 'Blackmore' tablet things.



I've taken things for digestive problems and stress too.



I've been meaning to try acupuncture and aromatherapy...I'll do that one day soon too! I've also been to an irodologist which was interesting.



Would you use it again?

Yes, like I said...I'm willing to give most things a go.

.All things are beautiful if we take the time to look.


Suibomaddict
577 posts
Location: Oregon, USA


Posted:
What do you know about alternative or complimentary medicines?
More than average, less than my wife. I know that in general, CAM is abused through ignorance, often villified through mainstream news, and is an essential part of our lives; whether we use it directly, or use pharmaceuticals, which are, more often than not, based on herbalism.

What do you think about the use of alternative and complimentary medicines?
As mentioned before, I think it's abused by ignorance. CAM is not a "quick fix", you cannot one-dose it like you do with pharmaceuticals. Then again, CAM, when used properly, tries to get at the root of the issue and not just mask the symptoms. One of the main things CAM provides, that the medical industry often misses, is the personal interaction and mental support that is necessary for certain healing processes. True, this has largely been falling away as CAM is more and more widely used and folks jump on the bandwagon to try and cash in the dollar signs.

The worst example of this is Ma Huang, which was bastardized into a weightloss product.. Ma Huan (ephedra) has very different uses than weight loss, and it's the "quick fix" options that are preying upon the populace. Never go for the quick fix...

Have you ever used an Alternative or Complimentary medicine?
Every day.. I love tea (herbalism).

Which Alternative or Complimentary medicine did you used?
Primarily herbalism. There are mechanisms in plants that balance out thier use. Plants are wonderful things.

I suffer allergies quite heavily here, and a tea of nettles, licorice, eyebright and goldenrod (with a few other things thrown in for personal preference) make a world of difference to me.

Please note: eyebright is on the United Plant Savers at risk list, so if using, make sure it is cultivated or organic (not wildcrafted) (www.plantsavers.org).


Why did you use it?
My wife is an herbalist, with a Bachelors degree in herbalism, and introduced me to herbalism. I'm a computer person, but I try and keep aprised of various issues. I update the news-links on our website, so I get to read much of the hype, in both directions.. The media definitely keeps me both amused and sad...


Would you use it again? Why/ Why Not?
Every day.. I love tea.. I love meditation..

There's a resource list on our website if interested. It needs to be updated, but has a good foundation of items. I'm not gonna link directly here, but our site is in my profile.

Definition of poi- A Hawaiian food made from the tuber of the taro that is cooked, pounded to a paste, and fermented.

Ahnold discussing poi - "It is naht a toober!"


mparkerSILVER Member
member
70 posts
Location: Houston, Texas, USA


Posted:
What do you know about alternative or complimentary medicines?

These are treatments unacknowledged and untested by the FDA. Like herbs and physical treatments. I know that there's a range of them out there, both valid, invalid, and somewhere in between (does something , just not exactly what they claim.

What do you think about the use of alternative and complimentary medicines?

I think that there is a lot of them out there that are pure snakeoil. Fake things that do more harm than good. BUT when properly researched and added to a more medically approved health regimen, they can be of great use. A lot of the ancient Asian medical arts are good, and a lot of old herbal lore is also very helpful. But you have to be careful of where you get your information.


Have you ever used an Alternative or Complimentary medicine?

Yes.

If Yes, please answer the following
Which Alternative or Complimentary medicine did you used?

I have used many herbal treatments, teas and herbal powders. the occasionall herbal or similar type of supplement, some interesting "toxin removers" that are pads you stick to your foot. They contain wood vinegar and other compounds and they wick toxins out of your system (and make your feet smell like yummy barbeque. I also go every two weeks to a body work specialist who performs a combination of Chairopractic, massage, reflexology and reiki. And who has pretty much made me a whole new person. She also pegged that my recurring IBS was actually a wheat allergy. I'm currently having some foot pain and am considering having her refer me to a good acupuncturist.


Why did you use it?

I was having recurring pains, and generally heard what worked via word of mouth.

Would you use it again? Why/ Why Not?

Yes. A lot of the herbal blends work well for me, and my bodywork person has helped me rid myself of many physical problems I had no idea could be gotten rid of. I'm a much happier, physically more active and healthy person in mind and body now.

If you answered No to question one, please answer the following
Would you ever consider using an Alternative or complimentary medicine? Why/ Why not

Didn't answer no, but I'd consider using other methods, depending on what my research would tell me was a good method. in other words, I wouldn't just do it because it was there. There needs to be some validity before I mess with something.

MikeGinnyGOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA


Posted:
What do you know about alternative or complimentary medicines?
A fair amount. After all, I'm a physician who has an interest in CAM. I read what literature I can and I've done a few literature reviews myself.

What do you think about the use of alternative and complimentary medicines?
I wish it had a different name, frankly. I don't believe that such a concept as Complimentary and Alternative Medicine should exist. All therapies, whether synthetic, natural products, or non-patentable natural products and procedures (the general category under which so-called "CAM" therapies generally fall) should be held to the same standards: is there a large, randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled trial that supports the use of a given therapy?

Contrary to popular belief, the drug firms do not suppress this research. Inertia does. Older physicians believe that it's all snake oil, but they forget that many well-known drugs are actually natural products. Digoxin, which is used in congestive heart failure, is isolated from Digitalis, the foxglove plant.

Indeed, one common CAM therapy is now quite mainstream: fish oil. It has been shown in several studies to prevent diabetes, reduce inflammation, prevent heart disease, lower cholesterol and triglycerides, and most recently has been demonstrated to be an antidepressant in high doses.

Where I oppose CAM is when it's used by people who are poorly educated or by people who categorically and closed-mindedly categorize all therapies into "Conventional=bad" and "Alternative=Good." These people tend to not get treated for conditions for which safe and effective medical therapy exists and may, instead, opt for a less effective and potentially more dangerous CAM therapy. For example, a number of Spirulina supplements were found to have dangerous concentrations of heavy metals in them. Echinacea, which enhances immune function, should NOT be used by those with autoimmune conditions such as rheumatoid arthritis or crohn's colitis. Peppermint relaxes the lower esophageal spincter, so it's a bad idea for someone with GERD to be taking it. And herbal products such as Saint John's Wort, if properly licensed as drugs, would have a list of potential drug interactions and side-effects that would make fluoxetine or any other conventional SSRI look very tame by comparison. It's this automatic assumption that because it's natural it must be safe that gets people into trouble. After all, Socrates had a natural herbal tea as his last beverage, didn't he? And one drug that I use quite often for patients in the hospital is also quite natural in origin...and also heavy with side-effects: morphine.

The last problem I have with CAM is that people tend to start pill-popping their herbal/nutritional supplements. When you take any therapy, whether it's pharmaceutical or natural, you have to be thinking about what you are treating or preventing. Why would you take something that's "good for your liver" when you don't have any liver disease or a set-up for such? If something is supposed to "remove toxins," I want to know exactly how it does so and which toxins, exactly, it removes. Active herbs contain drugs and those drugs can interact and produce nasty side-effects. So taking herbs for the sheer, unadulterated hell of it is a bad idea.

Have you ever used an Alternative or Complimentary medicine?

Yup.

If Yes, please answer the following
Which Alternative or Complimentary medicine did you used?
Why did you use it?


1) High-dose fish oil
2) High-dose vitamin E

I use these both for their antiinflammatory properties, because I have ankylosing spondylitis, a condition similar to rheumatoid arthritis, but it affects the vertebral column. I have found them of some benefit.

Would you use it again? Why/ Why Not?

I still do.

-Mike

Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella



A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura


Hanzveteran
1,328 posts
Location: Bendigo, Vic, Australia


Posted:
awesome, thanks for all that guys... handed in my assignment today, so thats all I need
thanking you all very muchly hug

jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
You're welcome. Mabey I wasn't clear on the matter but I define CAM as any kind of treatment which has been thoughrally tested and found to be rubbish but still continues. So my definition of complementary and alternative medicing is anything which doesn't work. wink

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


TheWibblerGOLD Member
old hand
920 posts
Location: New Zealand


Posted:
Written by: jeff(fake)


So my definition of complementary and alternative medicing is anything which doesn't work. wink




Then by your definition youare correct, they don't work

my definition of complementary and alternative medicing is anything which i can't get on prescription, does what i want it to, has no nasty side effects and isn't made by any of the most evil american corporations.

I'm not gonna get into all this again. My position is simple, if you believe in it, then it works, if you don't then it doesn't. Even if some things are placebo, so what, the placebo effect is an awsome example of what the human body can do. Do a little research into a 'placebo operation' they did years ago, it's facinating stuff. And how come homeopathy works on animals???

I've had far more success with 'alternative healers' than i have done with western doctors. I once had a doctor who dismissed the advice i had from a reflexologist (who could diagnose me by massaging my feet) then proceeded to diagnose me from the other side of his desk ubblol and charged me £50 for asorted tablets which a chemist then advised me would seriously damage my stomach.

And if you live in america i would suggest you find out if a prescription drug in legal in europe before taking it. Your pharmacutical companies have a habbit of testing dangerous drugs on you cos you are cheap and dispensible.

Anyways, i just think it's hilarious how scientists are so quick to dismiss Alchemy ~ how do you think nuclear power stations work? ubblol Elemental transmutation ring any bells wink

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


MikeGinnyGOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA


Posted:
Written by: spherculist


Anyways, i just think it's hilarious how scientists are so quick to dismiss Alchemy ~ how do you think nuclear power stations work? ubblol Elemental transmutation ring any bells wink




There's a bit of a difference between alchemy and nuclear fission.

Yes, you get a different element out, but that's about all they have in common.

-Mike

Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella



A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura


wjenewbie
2 posts

Posted:
Has anyone on this thread considered ingesting willow bark to relieve pain and (according to recent scientific tests) reduce your chance of certain cancers by up to fifty percent...

Alternatively you can buy asprin :-)

There are certain studies at the moment that seem to indicate that water has some form of chemical memory,
e.g. - https://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn1532
which would put something like homeopathy on a solid scientific basis.
Also, if the science is accurate, we are expected to believe that time is relative to accelleration, there is an infinte singulariy at the center of each galaxy, particles (and therefore all matter) can be in two places at once, and continually linked to other particles over distances of light years with instant effects between, light can be slowed by gravitation or magnetic forces to allow closed loops of time to travel into the past, oh and for extra comedy points nanotechnology will allow us to make materials that are stronger than concrete and lighter than air, and lifts that can carry loads into space.

As I have no problem with expecting that much of the above has a lot of truth to it, so I can also believe that observations carried out over thousands of years, with the strongest possible motivation for ensuring results (i.e early death) has some real effect, even if the science is not there to support it yet. I agree that a lot of the explanations for why some of this stuff works are unbelievably inane (yeah man, it's the cosmic energy fields, interacting with our eternal earth mother dude) but until scientists overcome the dogma they supposedly hate and start working on these subjects they will always be the dominion of the unquestioning faithful. At which point homeopathy will no longer be a bastion of the true faith but will just be more of the scientific, technological evil that non-religious technocrats (like myself) push upon a suffering populace. Much like what has already happened with alchemy, electricity and in fact most things in nature that lend themselves to accurate measurement.

MikeGinnyGOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA


Posted:
I don't think that the discovery that dilution appears to cause molecular clustering in any way validates homeopathy.

It's like saying that the discovery of gravity waves validates warp drive.

-Mike

Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella



A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura


jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
Written by: spherculist


a)and isn't made by any of the most evil american corporations.

b)if you believe in it, then it works, if you don't then it doesn't.

c)Even if some things are placebo, so what

d)And how come homeopathy works on animals???

e)Anyways, i just think it's hilarious how scientists are so quick to dismiss Alchemy ~ how do you think nuclear power stations work? ubblol Elemental transmutation ring any bells wink



a)CAM is big business now, and surely peddling snakeoil to frightened and vulnerable people is evil by anybodies standards.

b)wrong, if it works it works, if it doesn't it doesn't.

c)multipart answer
1:it's immoral to give people ineffective treatments
2:because proper medication will combine the placebo effect with their own effects
3:because the placebo effect won't cure everything. A brain tumour doesn't give a crap what you think you're taking

d)no it doesn't. You're basing this on research which is fatally flawed and carried out by people who have a major emmotional and financial incentive to deliver a positive result. Properly conducted trials (large, double blind, randomised) have without fail shown no effect on animals or people.

e)alchemy is based on the pricipal that you can transmute elements by stricly chemical means. Nuclear fission is very different from that. You might have put a laughing face here but you've just betrayed your own stupidity.

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


spiralxveteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
Written by: spherculist

my definition of complementary and alternative medicing is anything which i can't get on prescription, does what i want it to, has no nasty side effects and isn't made by any of the most evil american corporations.



"No nasty side effects" would rule out a large proportion of "natural" remedies (as Doc's post says)... and that's just a lot of the ones that have actually been studied.

While I'm sceptical of CAM, I'm more sceptical of claims like this which seem to declare it's a universal panacea with no flaws.

"Moo," said the happy cow.


MiGGOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,414 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia


Posted:
Lets not turn this into a flaming thread, guys.

Less insulting of stupidity and other peoples views, and more nice discussion about stuff. We could argue the point of whether CAM works or not for weeks, each refuting each other's views, even with having a common definition for what it is, which i'm not sure we do right at this point.

jeff(fake) says CAM is anything that doesn't work. I, and (i think) a few other people, mean things like fish oil, massage, aromatherapy and stuff. Is that what's going down, or am i thick?

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie


TheWibblerGOLD Member
old hand
920 posts
Location: New Zealand


Posted:
Oh dear jeff, there's nothing else i can say to you accept i'm very glad i don't share your point of view.

All your answers apply IMO far more to western medicine than to the alternatives. Your misguided faith in western medicine is great. But to each their own.

WJE: It's a rare treat to hear wise words on such a topic as this. I entirely agree with you that we are in a situation where the science just isn't quite there yet. Shame scientists these days are so frightfully dogmatic.

m

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
Written by: spherculist


All your answers apply IMO far more to western medicine than to the alternatives. Your misguided faith in western medicine is great. But to each their own.




Firstly you will find that my 'opinions' apply to everything. There is an objective reality and your beliefs do not make a scap of difference to it. If it were otherwise how would it be possible for anyone to be surprised since nothing outside of their view could ever exist?

Secondly I think a significant part of western medicine is badly tested and misused. I have no 'faith' in it at all. If it is to be regarded as a proper medicine then it must pass rigourus testing.

Unlike you I make no contrived distinction between 'western' and 'eastern' medicine. There is only medicine that works and b*llocks.

Written by: spherculist

Shame scientists these days are so frightfully dogmatic.




Shame the irony of your statement seems to be entirely lost on you.

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


BirgitBRONZE Member
had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
4,145 posts
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)


Posted:
Please not another one of those... there must be about 50 threads already dedicated to alternative therapies and western medicine and homeopathy etc... please use one of those now that Hanz's survey is finished if you want to argue smile

Though I have to say it's interesting how people define alternative... for me it's less about being natural or not, but more about if it's got a mechanism that's understood or if its results (if real or placebo I won't discuss!!!) have to be put down to something science/western medicine can't explain.

"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)

Owner of Dragosani's left half


jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
Written by: Birgit


Please not another one of those... there must be about 50 threads already dedicated to alternative therapies and western medicine and homeopathy etc... please use one of those now that Hanz's survey is finished if you want to argue smile



I suppose if everyone puts their repsonses into some older tread we can keep on argueing until the cow come home. That would require slightly more effort though... eek

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


BirgitBRONZE Member
had her carpal tunnel surgery already thanks v much
4,145 posts
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland (UK)


Posted:
yupyup... but if you put them in newer ones you tempt me to join in and repeat my old arguments like everyone else does ubblol

"vices are like genitals - most are ugly to behold, and yet we find that our own are dear to us."
(G.W. Dahlquist)

Owner of Dragosani's left half


flash fireBRONZE Member
Sporadically Prodigal
2,758 posts
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia


Posted:
Enough of the hostile undertones thanks people.

HoP Posting Guidelines
Is it the Truth?
Is it Fair to all concerned?
Will it build Goodwill and Better Friendships?
Will it be Beneficial to all concerned?
If you can answer YES to these 4 questions then you may post a reply.


Suibomaddict
577 posts
Location: Oregon, USA


Posted:
Written by:

There is only medicine that works and b*llocks.




Just out of curiousity.. if a medicine, regardless of it's classification, helps one person, but harms another... would you call that medicine that works, or b*llocks??

My body is not the same as yours, my bodies reaction to outside influences is not the same as yours, my bodies ability to heal itself is not the same as yours. To clump things into black and white is part of the problem.. double blind randomized tests do not take into account the processes that should go into healing. There are synergies involved that mainstream testing has a very hard time resolving into a simple category. There are things about body, mind, plant and healing that stringent science cannot comprehend at this point.

I understand your points, and do not necessarily disagree with them. But they feel far too lopsided to me.

Definition of poi- A Hawaiian food made from the tuber of the taro that is cooked, pounded to a paste, and fermented.

Ahnold discussing poi - "It is naht a toober!"


squarexbearSILVER Member
....of doom!
585 posts
Location: Hastings, UK


Posted:
note - i'm answering these questions without reference to the debate in this thread.

What do you know about alternative or complimentary medicines?

Medicine or treatment seen to be outside the sphere of 'conventional' medicine. Often seen to treat the body as a whole, rather than concentrating on the symptoms of disease.

Alternative therapy is discredited regularly by conventional medical practitioners and researchers. However, anecdotal evidence suggests that it does work.

Some alternative therapy is available on the NHS, accessibility depending on how sympathetic your GP is to it.

What do you think about the use of alternative and complimentary medicines?

I'm all for it. Treating the body holistically makes a lot of sense and is something that conventional practise often ignores. Also provides a lot of remedies for stress

Have you ever used an Alternative or Complimentary medicine?

Yes

Which Alternative or Complimentary medicine did you use?

Osteopathy, Cranial Osteopathy, Homeopathy, Massage, Aromatherapy, Reflexology

Why did you use it?

Osteopathy: back pain
Cranial Osteopathy: temper tantrums and mood swings when i was a kid.
Homeopathy: many different reasons
Massage: back pain, stress, combined with other treatments
Aromatherapy: many different reasons - mainly insomnia, stress
Reflexology: i was a guinea pig for a friend.

Would you use it again? Why/ Why Not?

Osteopathy: yes - pain relief and improved posture, as well as a brilliant feeling of relaxation (i like it when they crack your neck and for a nanosecond you think they've killed you, before going all floaty)
Cranial Osteopathy: mixed feelings - i had a course of treatment when i was 9/10 and although there was some improvement in my general behaviour it hasnt lasted, harhar, stupid puberty.
Homeopathy: yes, regularly - homeopath is a family friend and bloody good at her job. results.
Massage: yes - when i can afford it/nag one out of my boyfriend.
Aromatherapy: yes, regularly - one of the few things to help me sleep.
Reflexology: yes - with a slightly more experienced practioner

I think that alternative therapy, in my experience, promotes relaxation and a greater sense of wellbeing, something that modern medicine is often unable to do. By creating a more healing atmosphere, your body is better able to respond and fight off illness/cope with pain. I am happier and more comfortable with any of my practitioners than i am with my GP.

jeff(fake)Scientist of Fortune
1,189 posts
Location: Edinburgh


Posted:
I'm going to bump up an older thread so we can keep going.

Written by: flashfire


Enough of the hostile undertones thanks people.




Fair enough. I'd like to say that I'm not being hostile to any person or persons (although it might be percieved as such sometimes) just everything that they believe in. I think that there is an important distinction between a person and their beliefs.

I'd like to add that folks shouldn't feel the need to hold back when argueing with me. I like it (sadly HOP lacks a masicism graemlin frown)

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...


MiGGOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,414 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia


Posted:
the little guy smiling when he gets spanked seems at least a little bit masochistic... tongue

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie


MikeGinnyGOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,925 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA


Posted:
Written by: spherculist


WJE: It's a rare treat to hear wise words on such a topic as this. I entirely agree with you that we are in a situation where the science just isn't quite there yet. Shame scientists these days are so frightfully dogmatic.





Scientists have always been dogmatic.

The scientific method works. It is designed to take into account *ALL* variables, even unknown ones. That's the beauty of randomization.

Try being a scientist for a while before you trash the method. You might learn that you know not of what you speak.

-Mike

Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella



A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura


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