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NYCNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA


Posted:
Everybody keeps telling me not to panic but I'm bored not panicing.

We're all gonna die!!!

The UK government ordered 14 million doeses of an antiviral drug against avian flu... and strains are already resistant and passing between people.

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4343136.stm

The time for pushing and shoving is NOW! AHHHH!

I think I feel a scratch in the back of my throat.

wink

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]


Fine_Rabid_DogInternet Hate Machine
10,530 posts
Location: They seek him here, they seek him there...


Posted:
*coughs*

The existance of flamethrowers says that someone, somewhere, at sometime said "I need to set that thing on fire, but it's too far away."


MiGGOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,415 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia


Posted:
apparently, this bird flu is closely related to the 1918 epidemic strain. The one that killed god-knows-how-many people.

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie


TheWibblerGOLD Member
old hand
920 posts
Location: New Zealand


Posted:
Yes, i'm pretty worried about this one, especially since scientists have been talking about it for ages but the media and governments are only just telling everyone else, think it's pretty serious.

frown

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


yoniGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,099 posts
Location: Bideford and Bath, United Kingdom


Posted:
Written by: MiG


apparently, this bird flu is closely related to the 1918 epidemic strain. The one that killed god-knows-how-many people.




is that the world war 1 pandemic because that one was huge it killed more than the actually war

UCOF "evolution: Poi -> stick -> hoops -> devil stick -> juggling club -> juggling ball -> crayons."

Supergroovalsticprosifunkstication
In other words, it's the thumps bump


MiGGOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,415 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia


Posted:
that, i believe, would be the one... *thinks*

Yeah, WW1 finished in late 1918, officially, iirc. on the 11/11 at 11am, wasn't it?
offtopic

Yes. That is the one i'm thinking of. I can't remember offhand how many people died in that, but i recall that it was a whole lot.

*seals self in bubble*

I wonder if, with influenza coming back in a decently large way, we'll start seeing occurances of the black death etc? It's a far reach, i know, but the boffins thought we'd gotten rid of influenza, didn't they? God, what if smallpox comes back?

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie


TheWibblerGOLD Member
old hand
920 posts
Location: New Zealand


Posted:
Can't quite remember the figures for the last big one, somewhere around 20 - 50 million but i've heard this one could kill anywhere from 5 million to 150 million.

Which indicates that they really have little idea, but reckon it's gonna be bad frown

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


SymBRONZE Member
Geek-enviro-hippy priest
1,858 posts
Location: Diss, Norfolk, United Kingdom


Posted:
1918: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Flu

2005: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bird_flu

There's too many home fires burning and not enough trees


MiGGOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,415 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia


Posted:
some figures from sites have put the number at between 20 and 40 million deaths. Back then, though, i think there would have been a lot less people around - hasn't the world population grown heaps since the turn of the century?

according to https://home.nycap.rr.com/useless/bubonic_plague/
the 1918 virus started as a bird flu, then went to pigs, then went to humans.

I think NYC is right.

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie


SethisBRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
1,762 posts
Location: York University, United Kingdom


Posted:
Anyone see the programme on about 2 years ago (BBC), about a projected scenario of a single terrorist infecting someone in London with Smallpox? All of the hypothetical scenarios resulted in the complete decimation of population centres.



I'm going shopping for tinned food... who wants to join me? wink
EDITED_BY: Sethis (1129335860)

After much consideration, I find that the view is worth the asphyxiation.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.


MiGGOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,415 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia


Posted:
can you prove that you're not infectious?
and that all the canned food isn't either?

I want written proof passed through high strength UV before i get out of my bubble

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie


MikeGinnyGOLD Member
HOP Mad Doctor
13,923 posts
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA


Posted:
*kisses MiG passionately*

*Cough, Cough*

-Mike

Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella



A buckuht n a hooze! -Valura


pricklyleafSILVER Member
with added berries
1,365 posts
Location: Manchester, England (UK)


Posted:
I'm quite shocked that this is only coming out now, as they were talking about it on the radio 4months ago, saying that any day now, it could come into contact with human flu, and turn into a pandemic, and the government have only started worrying about it now!

Live like there is no tomorrow,
dance like nobody is watching
and hula hoop like wiggling will save the world.

What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.

Ralph Waldo Emerson


MiGGOLD Member
Self-Flagellation Expert
3,415 posts
Location: Bogged at CG, Australia


Posted:
aaahhh!!1one

*doses self with about three bottles of stuff to get rid of colds*

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie


linden rathenGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
6,942 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
its gunna be a while before bird flu becomes dangerous to humans - at least 1 year i think it is.

they recently recreated the 1918 flu virus to find out how it worked (stupidly its on in lvl 2 bio hazard containment but thats another rant) it had 3 specific mutations that made it dangerous and quickly transmitable. no strain of bird flu has been found with more than 1 of these mutations - as yet.

also the 1918 flu killed roughly 1% of humanity

it infected 1/3rd of the population 1/3rd of those people got dangerously sick

im just impressed that that report is vaguly telling it like it is - normally i get very untrustworthy of media coverage of anything to do with science but that seemed fairly balanced

most of this info has been in the public domain for ages

the government arnt issuing health warnings etc yet because atm its not an imminent threat - its possible it may never be.

the main problem is that the vaccines aren't going to be that effective because all they can do is make general vaccinations rather than one that attacks bird flu specifically because they dont know quite what its final form will be if it manages to attack humans

back


newgabeSILVER Member
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia


Posted:
Written by: MiG


It's a far reach, i know, but the boffins thought we'd gotten rid of influenza, didn't they? God, what if smallpox comes back?




No, we never 'got rid' of influenza... that's what we call the 'flu: it cycles around endlessly mutating into slightly different forms that are more or less dangerous to humans. That's what viruses and bacteria do... constantly change how they infect and what they do.

Sometimes less dangerous forms become more virulent... sometimes nasty one become less so . Scarlet fever, for instance used to kill heaps of kids.. now we hardly hear of it. The danger is not that 'bird flu' comes into 'contact' with human flu.. it's that it might one day mutate in such a way that humans could catch it from each other, rather than( as is the case now) from birds. But a human to human form of 'bird flu' doesn't exist yet. And as Linden Rathen says, it may never. And maybe by the time it did mutate to be human-human, it may have also become less virulent. It's all projection. Meanwhile, if you want something to really worry about: Try TB. It is already human-human easily transmissable, has mutated to become resistant to many treatments, costs a fortune even when if can be treated, and is often lethal.

.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....


newgabeSILVER Member
what goes around comes around. unless you're into stalls.
4,030 posts
Location: Bali, Australia


Posted:
And on a cynical but probably realistic note: Millions of doses of vaccines, Tamiflu etc reportedly being 'stockpiled'. Against a disease that does not yet exist and may never in the form that 'matches' the medicine. Yet widespread, inappropriate (too small) dosages of vague antivirals are more likely to make a disease resistant and more dangerous. So in who's interest is all this publicity? How much profit is being made?

It astonishes me that so much of our 'news' these days is about 'threats' and imminent dangers, often from shadowy and/or non existence forces. For what purpose, are we being encouraged to be so afraid: of foreigners, neighbours, 'terrorists' diseases, and so on.

.....Can't juggle balls but I sure as hell can juggle details....


mcpPLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom


Posted:
I like bird flu, it reminds me of quincy and the legionaires episode.

Somebody was telling me the other day that if we dug up st mary's close in edinburgh (was bricked up with plague victims still inside and alive.) that the bubonic plague would just srping up again, as it remains in the soil... Don't know if I believed them though.

And anyway, ebola is more old skool than stupid bird flu.

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.


Tao StarPooh-Bah
1,662 posts
Location: Bristol


Posted:
i heard on radio 4 that some scientists recreated the 1918 version that infected humans(which apparently is a different strain than the later one) which killed millions i think...for researh

doesn't that strike you as a bit silly seeing as they'd got rid of it before (i know it's very likely to change again and come back, but stil....)

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.


SethisBRONZE Member
Pooh-Bah
1,762 posts
Location: York University, United Kingdom


Posted:
Newgabe: In the UK it's mandatory that you get vaccinated against TB before year 8. Literally every child that goes to secondary school gets vaccinated. Therefore TB is not a threat to us. Of course, if it infects somewhere that DOESN'T have that system... well... you're kinda screwed really.

After much consideration, I find that the view is worth the asphyxiation.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.


onewheeldaveGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom


Posted:
Written by: newgabe



It astonishes me that so much of our 'news' these days is about 'threats' and imminent dangers, often from shadowy and/or non existence forces. For what purpose, are we being encouraged to be so afraid: of foreigners, neighbours, 'terrorists' diseases, and so on.




It is sad.

A lot of people benefit from fear-mongering- where the population is scared of threats, companies can sell them 'protection' and thus make a profit; governments can push through liberty restricting legislation that otherwise would not be accepted.

IMO, a powerfull way of combating it is, for those who are not at all anxious about impending flu epidemics and terrorist attacks, to remain so, and to be visibly free from fear.

Maybe then, those who have succumbed to the anxiety and worry may actually start to fear that they are missing out on something important- a enjoyable and low-stress life.

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!


Tao StarPooh-Bah
1,662 posts
Location: Bristol


Posted:
very wise words....and even if you don't convince anyone else, at least you will stay nice & relaxed & not suddenly have a heart attack.

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.


NYCNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA


Posted:
Written by: onewheeldave





Maybe then, those who have succumbed to the anxiety and worry may actually start to fear that they are missing out on something important- a enjoyable and low-stress life.






Bah, I fail to see how this helps consumerism. Stockpile and loot! Stockpile and LOOOOT!



But seriously Dave, just because someone's making a buck or three off something, doesn't mean it's a bad thing. If there hadn't been some MAJOR interventions already (costing major bird farming corporations big bucks), this thing would already be worldwide.



I think SARS was controlled and relatively contained by serious effort of some key epidemiologists. Not by sitting back and thinking happy thoughts.

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]


IgirisujinSILVER Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
2,666 posts
Location: Preston, United Kingdom


Posted:
I doubt itle evolve into a new strain meaning it becomes easilly passibly from human to human, right now its an animal bug so its not easy to get into humans.



Its only gotten as far as around turkey, and because its still an animal erm bug, its not likley to reach the uk. Eastern european countrys are banning bird exports from infected areas, and there isnt a possiblity from it being transferd to western europe from migratory virds, its simply too far for that.



Theres only a possiblity of it mutating into a new strain, theres no garentee it will happen.



After SARS and foot and mouth, and even miximatos...wahtever, governments know the dangers of this kind of thing, so the'll act.



Just ask yourself, did you catch sars? *looks downa at himself* Nope im still alive, well why am I gonna catch bird flu then?



This is 2005, we ahve good hygene standards, better medacine, more common sense about bugs flying around. not 1918, relaaaax guys.



Havnt botherd reading the other posts, so im probably repeating stuff someones said, shows how much im worried about it :P

Chief adviser to the Pharaoh, in one very snazzy mutli-coloured coat

'Time goes by so slowly for those who wait...' - Whatever Happend To Baby Madonna?


KyrianDreamer
4,308 posts
Location: York, England


Posted:
There's a vaccine for TB? Fascinating....

Kid died of it in my secondary school actually. Caused all manner of panic. Turns out its not actually that ridiculously easy to transmit, tho...

And the "black plague" as such, still exists on occasion. My aunt (a police officer) wound up going out to a house where someone had died of it. And then she got sick and panicked... [[but it turns out he more so died of dehydration (a real worry for anyone who gets sick and lives alone)]] but thats also pretty treatable these days....

Overuse of antibiotics etc is still a very real worry, but, as I'm not so much in a position to be making new and better ones myself, I think I'll chill about it. However, I suppose I should cough on you, nyc, for your comment in the other thread tongue

*cough*

-k.

Keep your dream alive
Dreamin is still how the strong survive

Shalom VeAhavah

New Hampshire has a point....


onewheeldaveGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom


Posted:
Written by: NYC







But seriously Dave, just because someone's making a buck or three off something, doesn't mean it's a bad thing. If there hadn't been some MAJOR interventions already (costing major bird farming corporations big bucks), this thing would already be worldwide.






I'm not saying it's a bad thing to make money from selling a service; just pointing out that when that service is actualy not essential and is being marketed by scaremongering and instilling fear in the population; those who see through it can combat it by 1. not buying it 2. setting an example to others by demonstrating that they can get by fine without it.



Written by: NYC







I think SARS was controlled and relatively contained by serious effort of some key epidemiologists. Not by sitting back and thinking happy thoughts.






If this threatened epidemic does require serious intervention, then there are plenty of people better suited, who will put in the necessary work- me getting worried will not help in the slightest.



Secondly, and apparently not a well known fact, is that worry and anxiety are not a necessary prerequisite to finding solutions to problems smile



I'd go further and claim that worry and anxiety are actually a hindrance most of the time when it comes to looking for solutions- most people work best, achieve more, and have greater creative flow when they are content/happy.
EDITED_BY: onewheeldave (1129420034)

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!


linden rathenGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
6,942 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
tao star

firstly every member of the population has a small immunity to the 1918 flu strain which means it is less dangerous to us now, also its in contained bio labs

(again im a lil worried its only being kept at lvl 2 rather than lvl 1 but meh)

the main thing is they are learning a lot about it

from various experiments with mice they've been able to deduce the mutations that made it so dangerous and so transmittable

oh and the black death they not sure what it is, bubonic plague was one of the black deaths but the legendry uber killer hasnt actually been identified - there are too many differences between its symptoms and those of bubonic plague. it just dissappeared

there is a vaccine for TB but like all things some people havnt had it and there are stronger strains of it out there - very nasty indeed - im not sure if this is still true but there was a strain in NY where if people werent taking their medicine (over 30 tablets a day) they were locked up and forced to take them eek

back


RicheeBRONZE Member
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic


Posted:
im scarred

POI THEO(R)IST


linden rathenGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
6,942 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
*passes richee a big teddy bear to cuddle

back


NYCNYC
9,232 posts
Location: NYC, NY, USA


Posted:
Written by: onewheeldave


Secondly, and apparently not a well known fact, is that worry and anxiety are not a necessary prerequisite to finding solutions to problems smile

I'd go further and claim that worry and anxiety are actually a hindrance most of the time when it comes to looking for solutions- most people work best, achieve more, and have greater creative flow when they are content/happy.




It all depends on symantics... as always. smile

I just took a class on the science of stress and there's actually a range of optimum stress. That is, too little, or too much stress produces less effective results than just the right amount of stress.

So it all depends on how you define "worry/anxiety" and "content/happy". And how effectively one can be motivated without over stressing.

I think the same works for politics as well. There is an appropriate amount of concern and attention that should be paid to each issue. Too much or too little are equally irresponsible.

But I will concur that you are totally useless in saving me from Bird Flu. wink

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]


onewheeldaveGOLD Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
3,252 posts
Location: sheffield, United Kingdom


Posted:
Well NYC, it's never been my intention to save you, or anyone else from bird flu- I'm simply endevouring to save you from worrying about bird flu smile

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!


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