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Analemma
Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA
Member Since: 22nd May 2003
Total posts: 384
Posted:
Simple, and quite common hug question among Poi players . . .

So can you do THIS move?


To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .


Analemma
Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA
Member Since: 22nd May 2003
Total posts: 384
Posted:Are you really sure?

Try it


To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .


linden rathen
linden rathen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: London, UK
Member Since: 2nd Mar 2005
Total posts: 6942
Posted:yup tongue i make a point of practising it biggrin

back


QuadDamage
QuadDamage

member
Location: Norwich
Member Since: 5th Jul 2005
Total posts: 130
Posted:Is this a trick question?

I tried it before replying, but it seems as simple as ever...



bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:NO!!!







...actually, yes

i believe that Lissajous is implying that there is a difference between what is dsecribed and how it is performed.
either way, i like vegemite.


Laugh Often, Smile Much, Post lolcats Always


Pyrolific
Returning to a unique state of Equilibrium
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Member Since: 10th Jan 2001
Total posts: 3288
Posted:It would be really good if your subject line indicated something about what you are on about Lissajous, but it doesnt really, and neither does your post. Im tempted to delete this thread, but I'll give you the opportunity to make it mean something.

--
Help! My personality got stuck in this signature machine and I cant get it out!


TheWibbler
old hand
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 11th Apr 2003
Total posts: 920
Posted:I think the point is this techy poi spinning environment we live in it's easy to forget that the most complex of things is made from bite sized chunks, you can never practice the basics too much, and keep split time exacty 180 degrees apart is extremely hard. If fact i can't think of a simgle person who can really 'Do' split time.

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:oobabasics biggrin



i reckon i can pretty get damn close, especially when spinning with fire.



i can also spin 2:1 side circles and even 3:2 butterflies on a good day (although these are same-time, not split).



but i'm weird and play this kind of stuff way more often than i should - if i did other things, i might learn something new every once in a while... redface



keeping 2bt weaves perfectly split-time however i am consistently hopeless at - my waistwraps are almost quarter-time on some days umm





cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:Written by: spherculist

I think the point is this techy poi spinning environment we live in it's easy to forget that the most complex of things is made from bite sized chunks, you can never practice the basics too much, and keep split time exacty 180 degrees apart is extremely hard. If fact i can't think of a simgle person who can really 'Do' split time.



that in my opinion is one of the most important posts i have read in recent HoPness!
i respect your view of the basics, spherculist.


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Analemma
Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA
Member Since: 22nd May 2003
Total posts: 384
Posted:Written by:
Im tempted to delete this thread, but I'll give you the opportunity to make it mean something.

Sorry if I appear unclear, but I think Matt explained it quite perfectly and Coleman is one of the few where I would say that he can really do it weavesmiley



Written by:
I tried it before replying, but it seems as simple as ever...


There is imo the problem: No move is simple! Especially not the easy ones . . . . ubbidea

Try it


To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .


oli
not with cactus
Location: bristol/ southern eastern devo...
Member Since: 24th Jul 2003
Total posts: 2052
Posted:depends on your standards. mine are not as high as some of yours i think so id say yes, i can spin my poi in split time well enough for most puroposes... but of course i am still far from perfection.

Me train running low on soul coal
They push+pull tactics are driving me loco
They shouldn't do that no no no


animatEd
animatEd

1 + 1 = 3
Location: Bristol UK
Member Since: 31st Aug 2004
Total posts: 3540
Posted:I find that being a drummer helps with poi timing issues.

Empty your mind. Be formless, Shapeless, like Water.
Put Water into a cup, it becomes the cup, put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, put water into a teapot, it becomes the teapot.
Water can flow, or it can Crash.
Be Water My Friend.


Stout
Stout

Pooh-Bah
Location: Canada
Member Since: 12th May 2004
Total posts: 1872
Posted:One thing I found helps with timing is to simply take your poi out for a walk.

Walk up the block spinning forwards split time, pull off a fancy turn and walk back down the block spinning reverse split time,,,,,,repeat as necessary.

Try working with really light poi. Not only will these help with timing, they have the added bonus of helping teach plane control too.



TheWibbler
old hand
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 11th Apr 2003
Total posts: 920
Posted:Cheers bender and Lissajous,

SO many poiple are missing out the essential basics these days imo, then they get all frustrated when they can't do the trickier stuff.

Best way to force yourself to do the basics is.... to teach beginners, then teach some more beginners, then a few more, maybe a few more and then perhaps, if you are really good, you'll be able to 'Do' a 3 beat weave.

Like really Understand what your body is doing. Nothing in poi is ever all that difficult to do. If you practice in a good way then you can build up really crazy stuff from lots of little pieces. Nothing ever fells like a giant leap because your foundations are solid.

Whereas if your foundations are dodgy, and you are trying stuff that's a bit beyond you then you can find yourself in a situation where every new thing is hard.

If you find yourself in this predicament, warm up, then do 1 type of reel for 1 hour, no breaks.

By spinning for 1 hour just doing 1 simple thing your body will figure out very quickly what is the most efficient way to do a move. ie how to use least energy

Your timing will be tight, your stamina will be great, your planes will be spot on, your style will look good and i guarantee, the next time you try some crazy 'Tangle release btb whip catch' combo ~ You might just make it.

Laters

m


Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


arashi
arashi

Pooh-Bah
Location: austin,tx
Member Since: 21st Mar 2002
Total posts: 2363
Posted:is this post useless, in a world of hungry ghosts???
maybe... hug


-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.


aja_tutaja
newbie

Member Since: 24th Aug 2005
Total posts: 2
Posted:mhm, I agree with spherculist, the poitn is that you understand what your body is doing and control it...

by the way - this move is really simple... the trick is that you do a one way butterfly (both pois spining the same way) and simply separate hands on each side of your body...



_Clare_
_Clare_

Still wiggling
Location: Belfast
Member Since: 22nd Oct 2002
Total posts: 5967
Posted:Andy, sometimes I get split time, but it's usually by accident smile

One day though, if I practise lots and lots, I might get it - perhaps it will even look effortless - like yours tongue biggrin


Getting to the other side smile


bender
still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 6979
Posted:Written by: arashi

is this post useless, in a world of hungry ghosts???
maybe... hug


pffft, everyone knows ghosts don't get hungry, they're robots! ubbidea


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Richee
HOP librarian
Location: Prague
Member Since: 15th Jan 2002
Total posts: 1841
Posted:It's called split spinnig, but actualy it's called "Follow time". In this time both Poi goes the same dirrection.
It timing where one Poi is all the time half of a circle(half of a beat, half of revolution) before the other Poi.
For example Weave is Follow time.

One another when both Poi goes the same dirrection is Parallel time, where the delay between the Poi is zero.
For example Turn.


POI THEO(R)IST


Richee
HOP librarian
Location: Prague
Member Since: 15th Jan 2002
Total posts: 1841
Posted:To add:

Split swinging /= Split time

Split time is when Poi goes opposite dirrection, like butterfly, but the Poi head meet " at 3 and 9 o'clock". So you need to split a bit your Butterfly to get in there.


POI THEO(R)IST


TheWibbler
old hand
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 11th Apr 2003
Total posts: 920
Posted:erm....
Written by:
Split time is when Poi goes opposite dirrection, like butterfly, but the Poi head meet " at 3 and 9 o'clock". So you need to split a bit your Butterfly to get in there.



Well Richee that's not what i mean when i say 'split time'

Split TIME has nothing to do with DIRECTION

Split Time is when the the poi are 180 degrees apart (half a circle)
In Time is when they hit the top and bottom of the circle at the same time

Same Direction is when the poi rotate in the same direction
Opposite Direction, well it's pretty obvious.

SO a regular 3 beat Weave is:
Split Time Same Direction

A regular Butterfly is:
In Time Opposite Direction

a 4 beat Parallel Weave is:
In Time Same Direction

a 3 beat split time butterfly is
Split Time Opposite direction


Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


JerryD
JerryD

member
Location: Maryland
Member Since: 2nd Aug 2005
Total posts: 136
Posted:excellent |m|!

Thanks for clearing that up. Pesky nomenclature...


I was touched by His Noodly Appendage


coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:matt, i think richee may be referring to drew's magic list that he made a few years ago...

in that you have 4 timings which have direction incorporated into them:

parallel-time - same direction, in time
follow-time - same direction, 180 apart
same-time - opposite direction, in time
split-time - opposite direction, 180 apart

they fit really well with all the variations of moves using those timings that have come along over the years:

e.g. follow-time reels, parallel-weave, same-time butterfly, split-time butterfly weave, and so on.

i'm not saying one naming convention is right and the other is wrong - i'm saying both are right smile

the one i listed above one is shorter but also maybe a little less intuitive.


cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


Richee
HOP librarian
Location: Prague
Member Since: 15th Jan 2002
Total posts: 1841
Posted:
Exactly,
one more think,
just remake the list:

Same dirrection::

Parallel-time - In time(Omnimodus)
Follow-time - 180 apart, Split time(Omnimodus,Spherculist:)

Opposite direction:

Butterfly time - In time(Coleman, Spherculist)
same-timing(Coleman)
Split-time - 180 apart

When you use In & Split time than it referre to my
split time Butterfy and Follow time Weave together.
I use rather Parallel, Wollow, Butterfly & Split time to define the Time in Poi spinnnig.
Seems to me that Parallel, Wollow, Butterfly & Split time are subfamilies of SPlit and In time.

In Time - Parallel Time & Butterfly(Same) time
Split time - Folllow time & Split time

How do you see it?


POI THEO(R)IST


JerryD
JerryD

member
Location: Maryland
Member Since: 2nd Aug 2005
Total posts: 136
Posted:umm
*goes to get tylenol*


I was touched by His Noodly Appendage


spiralx
spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK
Member Since: 1st May 2002
Total posts: 1376
Posted:Meh I prefer to think of same-/split-time and same/opposite direction as two separate things. Because otherwise you're going to have to come up with names for 1/4 time weaves and 1/4 time butterflies - hey, how about snack time and bed time? ubblol

"Moo," said the happy cow.


coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:its all about the clock-time man wink

peace *flowerpower* meditate


cole. x


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood


TheWibbler
old hand
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 11th Apr 2003
Total posts: 920
Posted:No way, i had no idea about Drew's definition coleman, thanks,

I think i prefer to keep time and direction separate too, must be a sphercular thing wink

It would be really useful if there were just 4 simple words for:

a) split time same direction
b) split time opposite direction
c) in time same direction
d) in time opposite direction

I like the way arashi describes them as 'Spider' and 'Crane'
I think Crane = in time same direction ( "it's a hippy thing because cranes mate for life" ~ Arashi)

Spider = hmm, not sure

But i would be more than happy to adopt a system of 4 simple words cos it gets so annoying writing out times and directions all the time.

Sorry jerryD, it seemed that it was all cleared up, now i'm super confuddled, btw that escher bug on your avatar is one of my favourite things he did,

Anyway,

gotta scoot,

laters


Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.


VampyricAcid
VampyricAcid

veteran
Location: My House
Member Since: 27th Jun 2005
Total posts: 1286
Posted:ive been working on a 360 butterfly (only name i can think to give it) where the crossovers move around in a circle so the timing keeps changing, looks cool, really confusing, but good practice for timing control.

Split Time - poi 180 degrees apart

alternate spinning - poi going in different directions
how about that?? so you can have split time alternate moves


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Intala
Intala

member

Member Since: 20th Jul 2005
Total posts: 86
Posted:Yes, I can. As far as same direction goes, either forward or backward. But opposite direction need a bit more practise.

Love, Intala


Practise Harry, practise


ma'tina
ma'tina

multiplex
Location: somewhere...
Member Since: 20th Mar 2005
Total posts: 611
Posted:think so, at least, but you had a look so decide about my playing yourself!

......at least I'm playing in time, split-time and opposite direction, forwards and backwards and when I close my eyes they feel pretty harmonious, flowing,,,.....but as mentioned before: decide for yourself!



btw, what is perfect? isn't even perfect relativ??? unless you look at it from a completely technical point of view: 180 constant distance.



hug2



alles Liebe,



tina


- Ho Sa -
kisses & peace & love to beautiful madges
*rever le temps le prendre*


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