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kiteman


Flying high!
Location: At the beach.

Total posts: 245
Posted:I'm having a problem getting my head around isolations. I know what they are and how your meant to do them, I just can't get my hands to move around the poi.
Is there an easier way to learn or is it just practice, practice, practice.


If everything seems under control, your not going fast enough!

It's not the size of the wave, it's the length of the ride!

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Bird
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

Bird

now available in "advanced"
Location: Cornwall

Total posts: 6086
Posted:I found the easiest way to learn was to imagine that you are pushing the pedals of a bike around with your hands, do that motion, and it will (eventually) team up with the poi and you'll get a lovely isolation!

Other than that, yes, its practice practice practice!


My state of mind is not yours to define!

There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."

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Skulduggery
GOLD Member since Aug 2004

Skulduggery

Pirate Pixie Crew Captain
Location: Wales

Total posts: 8428
Posted:I can only really do nice isolations in a backwards buzzsaw all my other attemps look very messy. I think Bird is right though. *wonders off to practice practice practice*

Feed me Chocolate!!! Feed me NOW!

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munkypunks
GOLD Member since Jan 2005

munkypunks

enthusiast, but not enthusiastic
Location: Los Angeles, California

Total posts: 367
Posted:someone told me to use the same motion as though you're rolling up a car window. Doesn't consistently work for me yet, though.

You can't fall off the floor, but sometimes you need a chair to reach the cookie jar.

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Adrillf
SILVER Member since Feb 2005

Adrillf

member
Location: UT

Total posts: 112
Posted:They were talking about the old school car windows not the electric ones biggrin wink

But yeah, either one of those work. One thing I noticed was that with isolations, I can not practice them one hand at a time, I have to use both hands. That may or may not help. Also another thing that helps with buzzsaw isolations is to grab the other poi, so left hand grab the right poi and the right grab the left and then just do a few rotations with you grabbing the poi, that way you can get use to the feel of your arms rotating. It causes a good sized knot when you do that, but it at least gets your hands moving.


missegyptology: I'm gonna be a terrorist when I grow up anyway

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linden rathen
GOLD Member since Mar 2005

linden rathen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 6942
Posted:lol
ive just been trying isolations one handed and find it quite easy - try with tail poi and go as slowwly as you can then try to grab onto the tail - and imagine winding down a window or something then practise *grin

*wanders off to attempt both ands together


back

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Cody
SILVER Member since Sep 2003

Cody

That guy from Reno
Location: Reno, Nevada USA

Total posts: 556
Posted:Like Linden said, try spinning really slow, so slow that the poi head stalls out at the top of the swing and starts to fall straight down. At that point, in order to keep the poi moving, you need to move your hand, (think opening windshield here). Play with it, there is a fine point where the poi head doesn't fall, and your arm movement works. smile

Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada

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Dunc
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

Dunc

playing the days away
Location: The Middle lands

Total posts: 7263
Posted:hey, maybe you could try pretending like you're opening a car window! eek wink

I was shown by doing buzzsaw and slowly moving the hands away from each other. Twas very useful smile


Let's relight this forum ubblove

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Analemma


Analemma

enthusiast
Location: West LA

Total posts: 384
Posted:Another recommendation:



Practice Horizontal Isolations (Name: Stirring the Pot wink)



Once the head understands horizontal ones - vertical isolations become easier imo





good luck



andy


To learn - read. To know - write. To master - teach . . .

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crazycarl
SILVER Member since Apr 2003

member
Location: Bellingham and Seattle, WA

Total posts: 21
Posted:I have also found that using heavier poi is immensely useful for learning isolations.
I have just gotten the buzzsaw isolation down relatively well, and am now working on isolation weave -- whoa buddy thats hard...


A bird can fly, but a fly cant bird...

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Shu
BRONZE Member since Apr 2005

Shu

Retro Fyre Wizzard
Location: Pietermaritzburg (KZN)

Total posts: 538
Posted:I find the best way to learn most moves is to understand what you are actually trying to accomplish.

An isolation move involves a stall!

you are not trying to stall the poi, but you are trying to isolate a section along the chain (usually the centre) and stall just that point.

Of course it does not have to be the centre point, it could be any point along the chain, and gets some amazing results!

Keep that Practice, practice, practice.


Regards hug

Shu
(Ice-E FyreStorm - Group Manager & Performer)

You know those people your parentals warned you about?... I'M ONE OF THEM! ubbloco
Yes, i do bite!!

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Cody
SILVER Member since Sep 2003

Cody

That guy from Reno
Location: Reno, Nevada USA

Total posts: 556
Posted:With an isolated weave i suggest over exaggerate the movements. Turn 90 degrees to each side with the move, or more. I think the reverse weave is easier to isolate. biggrin

If you want video, I do an isolated reverse weave in "Controlled burn's first video" in the video section. biggrin


Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada

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Richee
BRONZE Member since Jan 2002

HOP librarian
Location: Prague

Total posts: 1841
Posted:For Iso I use:

Catch opposite heads of Poi with opposite hand and try make circle between your hands (buzzsaw plane)....than try to make buzzsaw weave as slow as possible to get the same movement.


POI THEO(R)IST

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Lycanthrope


Lycanthrope

The original drunk/stoned/vegetarian shapeshifter
Location: Blackhill, Australia

Total posts: 209
Posted:can any1 post a link to some movies that very clearly show an isolation, i think i might have a slightly romantacised idea of what they should look like

Lycan:are you a citrus fruit?
Orange:no
Lycan:dam, i wanted to make citrus fruit pie.
*Lycan walks off completely unaware he has once again been outwitted by the intellectual orange*

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Sprocket
GOLD Member since Jun 2004

Sprocket

Member
Location: middle of the outback

Total posts: 140
Posted:I think sock poi are great to start isolations because they stretch and cover some messy isolating... After you get the hang of it you can use whatever you like but the heavier the better it seems.

Happy isolations!!!


hm, pinecones, my favourits!

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infinite


infinite

member
Location: ashland OR

Total posts: 110
Posted:In COL5 jools does an isolation so well it it looks like she has grabbed teh heads of the other poi buzzsaw. More video foootage is on this site called socks and sticks.

dont make peoples heads turn, give them whiplash.

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LazyAngel
GOLD Member since Jul 2004

LazyAngel

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Cambridge UK

Total posts: 2895
Posted:Lycanthrope: Check out these vids- Oli videos - particularly stix and sox for isolated buzzsaws, and the rest because they're a) very good b) show a lot of different technical stuff like antispin and isolations etc. which is hard to get your head round without seeing! ubbloco

Because ActiveAngel sounds like a feminine deodorant

Like sex, I'm much more interesting in real life than online.

'Be the change you want to see in the world around you' - Ghandi

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Shu
BRONZE Member since Apr 2005

Shu

Retro Fyre Wizzard
Location: Pietermaritzburg (KZN)

Total posts: 538
Posted:altho i've known the isolation theory for some time, i have really focused on actually doing them myself! Recently i have been trying to get it tapped, but until i stood infront of a full lenth mirror i battled somewhat... the mirror really helps with getting these moves tapped.

Now i'm able to do weaves an butterflies incorporating isolations. I'll have to agree with Cody, the bigger the exageration with your hands and arms (and shoulders), the easier you'll find incorporating isolations into a routine with turns etc!


Regards hug

Shu
(Ice-E FyreStorm - Group Manager & Performer)

You know those people your parentals warned you about?... I'M ONE OF THEM! ubbloco
Yes, i do bite!!

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Stove


Stove

newbie
Location: PDX, OR, USA

Total posts: 11
Posted:*newbie disclaimer* I dont know if there are any taboos about resurrecting old threads. I dont know if anybody is actually likely to -read- this thread and reply to it. But I do have a question about isolations that's been perplexing the daylights out of me: when one isolates, do the arms orbit the poi such that the isolation can be maintained for a theoretically indefinite amount of time? Every time I see isolations performed, it's in the context of a weave-isolate-weave-isolate pattern. As such, it's difficult to

Thanks to all - erh, that is assuming anybody still reads this thread...


Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
I have a catapult. Give me all the money, or I will fling an enormous rock at your head

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GothFrogette
BRONZE Member since Oct 2004

GothFrogette

grumpy poorly froggy
Location: Nuneaton

Total posts: 3999
Posted:after 2 months i have finaly got them, just practice although i do seem to have odd muscles that move now when i do it... lol

Life's too short to worry about where you put your marshmallows

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Fine_Rabid_Dog


Internet Hate Machine
Location: They seek him here, they seek ...

Total posts: 10530
Posted:I'm working on a buzzsaw isolations

I can do them, but they are really sloppy, and I keep messing up

They are elusive little buggers, but I'm very close indeed biggrin


The existance of flamethrowers says that someone, somewhere, at sometime said "I need to set that thing on fire, but it's too far away."

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.:star:.
SILVER Member since Jan 2005

.:star:.

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1785
Posted:Written by: Stove

*newbie disclaimer* I dont know if there are any taboos about resurrecting old threads. I dont know if anybody is actually likely to -read- this thread and reply to it.



There is definately NO taboo abour resurecting old threads, infact it is very much encouraged biggrin As soon as you post in an old thread it gets bumped back to top so people will read it...evidently!! biggrin biggrin

I'd love to offer words of advice about isolations but i can't do them whatsoever!
Happy spinning!


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Skulduggery
GOLD Member since Aug 2004

Skulduggery

Pirate Pixie Crew Captain
Location: Wales

Total posts: 8428
Posted:People that are good at isolations can keep them going as long as they wish. They can also change the axis of the isolation. By that I mean the point at which the isolation turns on. I started learning isolations with the buzzsaw and was taught to think of your hands acting as if they were peddling a bicycle. If you get your hands to line up with the weight of the other hands poi you have an isolation thats axis is the center of the poi chain/cord. If your hands spin futher out than the ends of the poi of the other hand you get a rotation around the ends of the poi. Thats harder to do as your hands have to creat a bigger circle...... Hm I'm not explaining this very well am I. Sorry I'm not very good at putting stuff into words.



I'm not very good at isolations yet but I think its just a case of lots of practice. Oli is a good one to watch for isolations as is Garthy. Download some of their vids and see.



I've found its easier to do with slightly heavier poi to but then I like heavy poi.



Good luck



p.s. bumping an old thread is always more desireable than making a new one smile


Feed me Chocolate!!! Feed me NOW!

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Stove


Stove

newbie
Location: PDX, OR, USA

Total posts: 11
Posted:Actually, that was extremely useful! You actually explained it quite well. So, one of the critical points here is that you somehow have to convince the poi to spin around an unnatural axis, presumably by making your hands into, essentially, weights of equal pull as the poi.

Man, this stuff is so neat!

Next question: what on -earth- is a buzzsaw?

*is eating this up*


Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
I have a catapult. Give me all the money, or I will fling an enormous rock at your head

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Penguin Sven
SILVER Member since Jun 2004

Penguin Sven

member
Location: Australia,Vic

Total posts: 185
Posted:for me, isolations are best done with sock poi of same length. Make sure the head is heaps heavier than the body, use a tennis bal or something heavy...live a big ball bearing (actually don't use a ball bearing)

I tried to do isolations forst woth fluffy poi with ball chain, but the wieght distribution was spread all over the poi to much, you need (at least i need) most of the wieght in the head.

hope that helps


"glow bugs, to slow to resist eating, to bitter to eat more than one handfull in a sitting" toothpaste for dinner

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kasei


kasei

newbie
Location: Georgia

Total posts: 6
Posted:Before someone comes in and yells at you to do a search... wink

A buzzsaw is when the poi are spinning split time, same direction, in between your hands and either toward or away from your face (you can do it forward or reverse.) Make sure your chains aren't too long so you don't smack yourself in the face (I just wrap once around my hands.)

Or you could check this

A Previous Buzzsaw Thread

Hope that helps!


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mtbeer
GOLD Member since Aug 2004

mtbeer

ARRRR!
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA

Total posts: 529
Posted:Here is a pic of a buzzsaw for reference:

Non-Https Image Link

Isolated buzzsaws take a lot of practice but they look great once you clean them up.

There is a good thread on continuous isolated weaves here.
That one helped me out quite a bit.

You can isolate the majority of poi moves to some degree but each one takes loads of practice. I find mixing isolations in with long arm moves like flowers or any of the giants to be quite beautiful.


"My skin is singed but it heals my heart and with glowing pride I'll wear my scars." -Davey Havok

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*HyperLight
BRONZE Member since Dec 2003

*HyperLight

old hand
Location: Great Malvern [UK]

Total posts: 1174
Posted:I've just learnt isolations. Still a bit wobbly, but definitely isolated smile Here's my tips:

1) I'd suggest (as many others have already) that you use reasonably heavy sock poi - that made life a LOT easier.

2) Try doing it in front of you in wall(?) plane. Stand with your arm out (just one for now) straight in front of you and start spinning your poi. Once the poi's spinning like it would normally, try speeding up your hand movement, and wave your hand in a circle like you were turning the wheel of the car. You'll find with a bit of practice, that you can get your hand and the head of the poi turning on opposite sides of a circle.

Once you can do that, try turning your body so that the circles are side on in front of you. If you can get this far, congratulations, you can do a one-handed isolation!

Now practice with the other hand, doing a circle in the same direction, turn to the same direction as before and you've mastered the second hand.

Next try starting both hands off (one at a time still) in front of you. If you can do all that, all you need to do is start both hands off together. I tend to start one hand off then as the head of the poi goes past start the second so that they start off 180 out of sync.

That's how I learnt and seems like a fairly logical way to peice it all together smile


Cake or Death?

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Stove


Stove

newbie
Location: PDX, OR, USA

Total posts: 11
Posted:Hmmm, excellent. This will be useful indeed! All I need now is a pair of sock poi...

Thank you all! Now all I have to figure out is what the -crap- a butterfly weave is supposed to be and I'm set....

*trots off to do some searching*

Oh, and by the way - cake please.


Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
I have a catapult. Give me all the money, or I will fling an enormous rock at your head

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Disc0


annoying boy
Location: Sweden

Total posts: 160
Posted:butterfly wave is a move where the hands are moving exactly as a normal waeve, but the poi are spinning in different directions. you could think it as a TTN on each side of the body

one good way to clean up sloppy isolations is looking at them through a mirror. or looking at the their shadows if you're outside and don't have a mirror.

check thi site about definitions of moves:
http://www.spherculism.com/wiki/index.php


fire is just light and heat.
it's you friend!

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kepki2003


kepki2003

Member
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan

Total posts: 34
Posted:I learned the isolated 5beat weave over the course of about 4 months. That was last winter when there was nothing to do, except spin! I started practicing lots of airwraps and transitions in/out of them. I applied that same concept to the weave, but with out locking the poi, start with a weave, bring them to the front of your body, spit your arms to equal lengths, send your right poi under to your left arm while bringing your left arm up and out (in a circle) the other arm should follow and do the same, Then you let the poi continue circling with your arms, then you can just speed the poi up and let them come out the other side of your arms. (That was also my introductions to orbitals.)
I hope this was helpful... I figured it out by watching the YT sock vid ot the gathypoi video... The isolations are great, YT where ever you are, you have inspired me so much its amazing!!.
http://www.feuershow.de/
is a great website for poi moves beginner to advanced (not that HOP isnt) although its in german you can navigate it enought.


Spin More Poi!!!

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