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Forums > Social Discussion > Magic Mushrooms Class A - Election Rigging legal

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Zauberdach


Zauberdach

Sometimes sword wofter
Location: Edinburgh

Total posts: 199
Posted:Ok magic mushrooms are finally being all out banned as a CLASS A drug along with Crack and Heroin:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4105883.stm
br>
While it is perfectly legal to rig votes in the UK:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4410743.stm
br>
hmmm.... Politicians have the time to make Mushrooms illegal but not to sort out making election rigging illegal.

What do you think, I think I've just become a little more cynical umm


IMPORTANT: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of a sane person.

"just get the f**k on with it and make me the anti-christ already!"

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Stone
GOLD Member since Jun 2001

Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne

Total posts: 2830
Posted:Yes pricklyleaf, I think in Australia certain types of mushrooms are classed under the poisons act. Not sure though, as rules change. I think linden was trying to point out that people might eat the wrong species and die.

bonzai, Im surprised they are still legal, but it does seem strange to classify mushrooms with the highly addictive drugs like crack. I suspect that all politicians want to do is get re-elected without having to make difficult decisions. They seem to look for easy solutions to complex social problems and often use smoke screens to cover-up little things like election rigging.

Sprout, I often think the media have an irresponsible attitude to drugs. They are usually ill informed and tend to sensationalise everything to sell papers, ads or whatever, and they often inadvertently tell people where to buy drugs. I wonder what other circumstances were involved in causing that kid to go off his head. Banning is a best a temporary solution, as people tend to look for substitutes which are often more dangerous than the previous substance. A social worker friend tells me that in Australia glue and petrol sniffing, chroming and the misuse of other OTC products are now the biggest problems drugs for teenagers.

OWD I agree it is important to have having a very good understanding of the reasons people use drugs in the first place. We have discussed the social issues before, and drugs use to me would indicate social problems which are often more serious than a lack of something in their lives. I wonder how many in you substantial minority of fairly messed up people were abused. Though its probably a bit more complex than that.

Apparently we picked up our taste for alcohol, when as primitives, we discovered that fermenting fruit made us feel good. I often wonder if as a species we are pre-disposed to drug addiction? Traditionally, I think these urges were released at annual festivals, then it was back to reality for the rest of the year.

Humankind has had a long fascination with enthogens, and the use of enthogens like sacred mushrooms in shamanism, and other religious rituals. I think Tea Fairy made some excellent points regarding the power of sacred mushrooms in rehabilitation. The use of Ayahuacsa in the rehabilitation of alcoholics is also well documented.


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001

Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England

Total posts: 5688
Posted:Last chance to buy today (unless you can find an open head-shop on a Sunday...)

Boo...

Just before Falmouth too...

I can kind of see the reasoning for the re-classifying, but I personally think A-class is too high


Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude

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quiet


quiet

analytic
Location: bristol

Total posts: 503
Posted:growkits may still be legal; it's worth checking

liberty caps will be growing everywhere in a couple of months

the notion that shrooms and crack should be classified as equally bad is absolutely crazy. stupid, stupid legislation.


ture na sig

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Posted:Written by: onewheeldave

And that judgement isn't me saying that drugs are bad, or that they should be illegal, it's me saying that, IMO, drugs are taken in an attempt to cover up, or fill, a lack of something.




This is such a common misconception about psychedelics that I can't believe it's so widespread. Psychedelic drugs are TOTALLY different from other drugs in that the simply CAN'T be used as a form of escapism. If you have serious issues, and you try to use psychedelics to escape these problems, you'll be in for a real shock. Psychedelics will bring all of your psche into being; you will have to confront your innear fears more than ever before, which can be a little overwhelming. Psychedelics can be used as a therapeutic tool for resolving (not escaping) issues, gaining perspective, learning new modes of thought and appreciating different facets of life.

One wheel dave, if you think that an attempt to gain insight and perspective is 'an attempt to cover up, or fill, a lack of something', then what does this say about you, a philosopher?


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quiet


quiet

analytic
Location: bristol

Total posts: 503
Posted:quoting OWD:

'My honest opinion, from what I've seen, is that people who are happy, and content with their place in life, do not use drugs.

There's plenty of people who believe that they are content, and believe that they use drugs to enhance their experience.

My opinion is that they are, in the majority of cases, mistaken i.e. they take drugs to make up for what they perceive as a void within.'

Dave, I'm baffled. You say that a) these people *believe* they are content, and then you say b) they 'perceive a void within'. This looks contradictory. Do these people think they're content, or not? If they do, then who are you to say that they aren't?

And are you suggesting that drugs cause unhappiness, or that unhappiness leads to drug use? Or that the two have a common cause? Please clarify.


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Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001

Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England

Total posts: 5688
Posted:Grow kits are illegal too now.
As is picking wild ones (and Farmers are advised to spray fungicide on known grow spots...)


Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude

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onewheeldave
GOLD Member since Aug 2002

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: sheffield

Total posts: 3252
Posted:Guys, what I posted was simply my opinion formed from many years of experience with drugs and observations of those who take them.

I fully and totally understand why and how people can believe drug use, psychedelic or otherwise, can be conducive to insight- I once believed it myself.

However, looking back at those experiences, and most especially, seeing how long term drug use has affected many of the individuals I know; I've come to some pretty solid conclusions.

Whilst i am sure there are some exceptions, my conclusions are that drug use is more conducive to delusion than to insight.

Elsewhere, i've posted my reasons and also the personal experiences and observations that have led me to that conclusion, so I'll suggest you check out my other posts on drugs.

Personally, i've no desire to get into a heated debate on the pros/cons of drug use, so I'll just try to say something which I think most of us can agree on: -

Which is that a perfectly good life is feasable without any drug use whatsoever, and that deep and profound insight is also entirely attainable without the use of drugs/psychedelics.

If people wish to use drugs then that's their business; good luck to them.

Personally speaking, I believe I have something useful to say about drugs, as I have been around them for a lot of my life, and I've seen several profoundly different perspectives of drug use, and, perhaps most important, I've reached a point where I have come to some solid conclusions and opinions.

In my view there is plenty of peer pressure on the young to experiment with drugs, and their is plentiful promotion of drug use.

I believe (in fact i know) that a drug free life has many, many benefits; yet such a life is often seen as being 'dull', or associated with being fearful or unimaginative.

So I choose to promote the benefits of a drug free life.

Lastly, in answer to your question quiet, i believe that unhappiness can contribute to drug use, and that drug use can contribute to unhappiness. I'm not going to talk of 'cause' as I don't believe it to be appropriate.

What I will say is that, in my experience, unhappiness and drug use seem to be good bedfellows, and I've often found that where there is one, the other also tends to be in evidence.


"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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Posted:Written by: onewheeldave

Which is that a perfectly good life is feasable without any drug use whatsoever, and that deep and profound insight is also entirely attainable without the use of drugs/psychedelics.




There's no denying that.

Written by: onewheeldave

Lastly, in answer to your question quiet, i believe that unhappiness can contribute to drug use, and that drug use can contribute to unhappiness. I'm not going to talk of 'cause' as I don't believe it to be appropriate.



Almost all of the psychedelic drug users I've met are the most free and happy people I know. Maybe I have a different perspective on what it means to be 'happy', or maybe we have just had very different experiences. Either way, it's best to go by your own personal experiences and make SURE that you haven't been brainwashed.


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The Tea Fairy
SILVER Member since Jul 2004

The Tea Fairy

old hand
Location: Behind you...

Total posts: 853
Posted:I've seen my boyfriend break down during a trip because he realised what a complete w*nker he'd been to his friends and family (coke addict), then he never touched hard drugs again. Mushrooms taught him a lesson, it's just as Psyrush describes, he saw more of his 'psyche' and his destructive behaviour was clear to him for the first time.

I've also had a friend develop severe schizophrenia and psychosis, probably because of his drug use, but he started very young on LSD and used it far too often. Most of the psychedelic users I know are chilled and happy people, but there are a few people out there for whom it's, well, not so good.

I still think we should have the right to choose for ourselves, though.


Idolized by Aurinoko

Take me disappearing through the smoke rings of my mind....

Bob Dylan

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Tao Star


Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1662
Posted:OWD - i completely agree with what you say - it is abviously right for you....however, i've tried drugs, had fun, decided i don't need them any more.


that doesn't mean i had negative reasons for taking them. I stand by what i did, i had fun, i enjoyed myself. Just as i no longer feel the need to go to school or play like a little kid (well not all the time anyway!) that doesn't mean those things didn't teach me stuff, i just grew out of them.


your reality is not always the same as everyone elses, and you can't necessarily judge people on what you yourself have experienced (and that includes your perceptions of what other people experience too.) smile


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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onewheeldave
GOLD Member since Aug 2002

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: sheffield

Total posts: 3252
Posted:I agree, peoples realities are not the same.

I'm in no way saying that people cannot have fun on drugs; though I would argue that often there is too much emphasis placed on the belief that such fun is the result of taking drugs.

In the past I've had fun whilst smoking, being drunk or having consumed hallucinogenics- eventually I came to the conclusion that I'd rather have more fun by staying straight, and, incidentally, avoiding the inevitable negatives of drug use ('bad' trips, expense and the insincerity often involved in social circles which are primarily based around drug aquisition and consumption).

Tao Star, you've tried your drugs, enjoyed them and then decided you don't need them. That's great- where drug experimentation is concerned it's pretty much the ideal, and, if that was the same for everyone, then it would be excellent, and I wouldn't have to keep posting the other point of view.

However, it's not the same for everyone- the numbers of alcoholics, addicts, smokers dying horrible deaths caused by their addiction, marijuana users whose lives are damaged by dope, hallucinogenic users who become mentally destabalised etc, etc; are huge in our culture.

Now this is far from everyone- many people can drink in moderation, many dope smokers don't become fixated on marijuane use.

Nevertheless, in our culture there are many whose drug use is extremely negative.

And yet still, there is, I feel, a 'sneering' attitude towards the doctrine of abstinance- it is seen as authoritirian, weak, unimaginative and conformist.

I fully accept that there are historical reasons for that, and that, in the past, it has been misused.

I also accept that there is a place for encouraging safe and moderate use of drugs.

However, IMO, it is not the full solution- there is a substantial minority of the population for whom abstinance is more appropriate.

I don't care whether drugs are legal or illegal, i don't care if people use drugs (to this day I have friends who use drugs, i do not have a problem with that).

My prime focus is to present abstinance as a valid approach to drug use, and to clear up some of the myths that are used to critisise it (one of which is 'I and my friends use drugs with no problems, therefore everyone can).

Secondarily, as i have openly stated before, it is my belief that happy people, who are content in themselves, do not take recreational drugs- in my opinion, there is always a reason, and that reason is a negative one.

I believe this because of what i have experienced over many years, and what I have seen in others.

It's good to remain open-minded and it's not good to have rigid dogmatic opinions; nevertheless, in some cases, where one has had a lot of experience, been through a lot of differing perspectives, come to good understanding of the causes behind those experiences etc; a solid opinion results.

Drugs are not taken for good reasons, is my opinion. That's all it is- my opinion.


"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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quiet


quiet

analytic
Location: bristol

Total posts: 503
Posted:quote OWD: 'However, it's not the same for everyone- the numbers of alcoholics, addicts, smokers dying horrible deaths caused by their addiction, marijuana users whose lives are damaged by dope, hallucinogenic users who become mentally destabalised etc, etc; are huge in our culture.'

Hang on a second. There are plenty of alcoholics, and plenty of smokers die of smoking-related illnesses. How many people in this country have psychedelic-induced mental illness? Or are you just guessing?

I'm still puzzled by why you think that happy people don't take drugs. You've stated that unhappy people often turn to drugs, which is probably true, at least in some cases; but that doesn't mean that happy people don't turn to drugs. And I know plenty of happy people who do.

Abstinence is definitely cool if you can pull it off, though. Me, I'm weak smile


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