Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:What to you makes an unfit/irresponsible parent?
What do you think dictates what mental abuse is?


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Pink...?
Pink...?

Mistress of Pink...Multicoloured
Location: Over There
Member Since: 6th Apr 2002
Total posts: 6140
Posted:I'd say an unfit parent is someone who doesnt actually love their child. Or someone who beats their child up.

Never pick up a duck in a dungeon...

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vanize
vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas
Member Since: 21st Aug 2001
Total posts: 3899
Posted:mental abuse to a child would be deriding their self esteem on a regular basis, to the point that it would permenantly damage their personality.

As for the unfit parent thing, well, apparently it is a lot easier to be an unfit parent if you are male than if you are female. (I know that isn't what you are looking for, but it's what I have to say).


-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

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tattty
member
Location: crapy planet thanet
Member Since: 29th May 2002
Total posts: 158
Posted:An unfit parent is one who loves themselves more than their children. children are easily emotionally bruised; more than most parents seem to realise.

xx


Make your own happiness by making others happy [Ikeda]

*they used to read me stories, as though my dreams were boring*

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Magnus
member
Location: Bath, UK
Member Since: 5th Sep 2002
Total posts: 279
Posted:Parents create the world in which their children grow up.

The world in which children grow up shapes the way they view life and relate to other people.

I'd say that the ideal parent creates a world of awe and wonder for their children, such that the child sees life as awesome and wonderful, and the world as a place where they can be effective and fulfilled.

An unfit or irresponsible parent creates a world of struggle and fear for their children, such that the child sees the world as a terrible place full of danger, where life is a constant battle.

Most parents probably quite realistically fall between the two, and an abusive parent is an extreme case of the latter.

Children have an enormous capacity for understanding and reason. Above all their parents set an example for them to follow.

This can be damaging in the case of the parent who is selfish and aggressive and violent, but in the case of the parent who follows their dreams and shows compassion and energy it can be the most valuable thing in the world.


Magnus... pay it forward

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TheBovrilMonkey
TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2001
Total posts: 2629
Posted:I agree with all the definitions posted up here so far.
I'm also going to leap to the assumption that someone's said you're unfit to be a parent.
This, I completely disagree with.
It's pretty clear from your posts that you hold Noah sacred above all else - I don't have time to look up anything to reference on this, but it's damn obvious that you fall into Magus' first group of parents:
quote:Originally posted by Magnus:

I'd say that the ideal parent creates a world of awe and wonder for their children, such that the child sees life as awesome and wonderful, and the world as a place where they can be effective and fulfilled.
Anyway, I may be completely off the mark so I'll leave it at that - if I am, I apologise.


But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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vanize
vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas
Member Since: 21st Aug 2001
Total posts: 3899
Posted:that was beautiful Magnus.

Pele - if someone said you were an unfit mother, tell them I told them to stuff it up their @$$!

I once had a girlfriend that was hounded by child protective services for years because the estranged father of the child reported her to them out of spite (and nothing else). What a huge pain in the ass it was for her, and what a waste of effort and tax payer money. She was a good mother and all child protective services was doing was adding stress and discord to both her and her daughter's lives. Sometimes these watchdog organizations are too zealous and manage to screw up more than they help (oh, don't even get me started!).


-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Call my mom.

And if you get through, give her my regards.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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Raphael96
old hand
Location: New York City
Member Since: 8th Sep 2002
Total posts: 899
Posted:Anyone has kids out of selfishness and thinks that being brought into the world somehow means that the child owes his or her parents is an unfit parent.

The problem is that to most parents, their children are born and exist for the glory of the parents, not the glory of the children.

It bothers me quite a bit.

Raph


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Bram....
member
Location: the arms of the Ganja Goddess
Member Since: 17th May 2002
Total posts: 1551
Posted:My mom

You. Its whats for dinner!

As time passes, you realise all the mistakes you amde and the ones you wish you never did make.

The wave crashing on the beach

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Rozi
100 characters max...
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Member Since: 11th Jan 2002
Total posts: 2996
Posted:My parents have made mistakes. Sometimes I think they brought me up with too much fear in my life, too much worry about what could be wrong. Then again, that was how they were brought up. But they love me, and they are far from unfit parents. I love spending time with them now, and adore them both. They are great people.

I think maybe we should ask what makes a "fit" parent (exercise routines? diet? Yoga? ). For my money, a fit parent loves their child. They may make a few mistakes, but their expression of their love supports their child so that this new little person can walk out into the world & interact, and come back to a safe space when they need to. A fit parent doesn't have to be perfect, in fact it is better when they aren't cos it is less intimidating


It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.

What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...

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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)
Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

Enter a "Title" here:
Location: San Diego California
Member Since: 31st Dec 2001
Total posts: 2905
Posted:If a parent refuses to let their children make their own mistakes and lets the avoid the consiquences then they are unfit.

I think there are two sides to unfit, the abusive side and the side that cradles the child.

Yes protect your kids but dont put them in a bubble.

Spanking is not abusive, beating the kid is. Not punishing the child is just as abusive as beating the child. Becuase when the child gets older they wont have any respect for authority. A little fear is a good thing. Trying to instill the wrath of God in your childs arse isnt.

I hope you understand what I mean.


Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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master sodium
member
Location: carson city, nevada
Member Since: 13th Apr 2002
Total posts: 536
Posted:from what I'm seeing, most people think an unfit parent is one that doesn't do what they should for their kid, but I see that more as a bad parent, because they have the ability to do so, but dont. I think an unfit parent is one that CANNOT provide for their children.

and mental abuse would be anything that affects the childs personality or emotions in a negative way. you cant say a spanking is good punishment and not mental abuse because some kids are negatively affected by doing that, and some just dont give a damn if they get spanked. the best sign of a good parent is one that can create punishment that teaches their child in a way that is probably unique to that child. example: raymond phule is being a bad boy, so we force feed various drugs to him. he (probably) won't do that again, cause we know how ray feels aboot drugs. now lets say bender is acting up. if we force feed drugs to him (I dunno if it would be FORCE fed, but since I really don't know bender to well, I cant say for sure) he'll probably do it over and over and over. but if we take away all bender's fire weapons for a month, he'll be sure not to do it again.

at least thats how I see it.


you can't have a war against terrorism because war IS terrorism.it's not about worshipping fire. its about making the fire want to worship you.

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Flynt
Flynt

Intrepid Penguin

Member Since: 12th May 2002
Total posts: 5635
Posted:nice point master sodium!

bender wouldnt take em tho, he's given up that stuff.

An unfit parent is a parent who cannot provide the basic needs for their child:
Shelter,
Warmth
Food
Love
Discipline
Communication.

I see so many kids grow up with the first four things on that list.. and turn out to be absolutely wretched ppl, because their parents neglected to instill and form of belief or faith or wonder about this world in them.

My parents were probably unfit, when i was raised. They provided everything except communication. They are wonderful ppl now, and i love them dearly, but when you are raising a child, you need to be healthy within yourself.

Pele, i would hate to think that someone has accused you of being an unfit mother. It is apparent to all on HoP how much your child is cherished and cared for. Its also obvious that you are instilling a beautiful sense of wonder about the world in him, and thats something that will hold fast throughout his lifetime!


Currently on the right side up of the world.

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BurningByron
member
Location: Australia
Member Since: 10th May 2002
Total posts: 340
Posted:An unfit parent is one which doesnt exercise for at least half an hour three times a week. In that case my mummy is ultra fit parent! But in the other case... well actually I think I must have gotten the best damn mum that ever existed!!! I love my mum she's so cool. She's going to Uni with some of my friends at the moment, she's 46 they're 18. Although my mum does look 30. GO TEAM MUM!!!!

HOW TO FLY 101:
step 1. Throw your self at the ground.
step 2. Miss.

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master sodium
member
Location: carson city, nevada
Member Since: 13th Apr 2002
Total posts: 536
Posted:ooops. sorry bender, didn't mean to call you a druggy or anything. your name just seems to come to mind first when I try to think of someone from HoP.

so lets just imagine smallboy's name where benders is and hope that works out better.


you can't have a war against terrorism because war IS terrorism.it's not about worshipping fire. its about making the fire want to worship you.

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Okay..so...

I called my mother yesterday to check on my son and tell her how my doctor's appointment went. What I got was yelled at for 45 minutes about how my performing and travelling with my son is destroying his life.
How I never think of him or do anything for him. How I put everything in my life ahead of him.
How I am a selfish bitch and am driving my son to eventually be a drug addict and a violent offender.
All I care about is myself and my hopped up friends (I have had the same 5 close friends for years, and we don't drink or do drugs at all. Noah conciders them family and they love him **very** much).
I do nothing with him ever, and never concider his feelings.

Now, this all came to pass because I am moving out of my home town, away from them, to a city an hour away because there is more opportunity for both Noah and I. I admit, I get antsy. I move apartments every two to three years, until now always within my home town. I performed so I wouldn't have to have a boring 9-5 that will make me insane. Also, it gives more free time for me to spend with Noah. I travel with him, take him to museums, etc. But my parents never understood artistic endeavors at all, and they despise my beloved fire, acting and writing. I talk with Noah so that he knows what's going on and so that I know how he feels. But my parents aren't around to see this. They see what they want, and believe what they always have about me, whether is was correct or not. My friends are more of a family to me than my family, and they have been all along. Still, I spent most of the day yesterday in tears over this. Just hearing from them (and despite it all, I do love them) that I am a "great disappointment", that I should give up all my happiness for Noah (I do sacrifice alot for him), and now I am irresponsible and unfit to be a mother...from my family that hasn't really been there for me until they took Noah while I was in the hospital. It was a hard pill to swallow.

Thanks for the thoughts everyone. It gives me alot to think about!


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Huia
member
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 20th Sep 2002
Total posts: 61
Posted:woah..full on. I'd just like to add my 5 cents, and say that any kind of abuse- mental and physical is damagin. The best ting a parent can do is set guidelines and encourage their children to become 'themselves'. We each have our own human spirit and this needs to grow 'free' from negative influence.Im fortunate enough to have fantastic parents and will raise my children to fire dance, eat no meat, and be exacly like me..kidding. but you get my drift yeah?

Loving your life...loving your planet...loving yourself.

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Bram....
member
Location: the arms of the Ganja Goddess
Member Since: 17th May 2002
Total posts: 1551
Posted:awwwww... Poor Pele

You. Its whats for dinner!

As time passes, you realise all the mistakes you amde and the ones you wish you never did make.

The wave crashing on the beach

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Doc Lightning
Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA
Member Since: 28th May 2001
Total posts: 13920
Posted:Pele,

Is Noah happy? Has he told your mother that he is unhappy?

It's really amazing. Kids are generally happy when they are in healthy, loving families. If something is lacking from the family (discipline, stability, love, material needs) then kids get unhappy.

How old is Noah? What does he think about moving every few years? What will you do when you want to move (but don't absolutely have to) and Noah says that he doesn't want to leave his school and his friends?

Do you feel that Noah is mature enough to have a talk with about whether he's happy and how he thinks you could be a better mom? You'd be amazed at what even little kids can say. Sometimes, the complaint is "mommy won't let me have a second helping of ice cream." That's a "happy child" complaint. Sometimes it's "Daddy is always out of town." That sort of complaint rings alarm bells. Danny Gans, a Las Vegas entertainer, tells the story of how his young daughter drew a picture of her family, but there was no Daddy. When asked where Daddy was, she pointed to a picture of a plane flying over the family and said "there." Gans changed jobs.

In the end, the ultimate judge of whether you are a good mother is not your mother or your friends or even those of us on the board. It's your son.

I'll be honest: I can't pat you on the head and tell you that you're doing a great job because I don't know. And besides, will that really make you feel any better about it? The only person who can tell you how you're doing is your son, and IF there's something you could be doing better, then the sign of a great mommy is a mommy who will make that change.

Pele


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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Rozi
100 characters max...
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Member Since: 11th Jan 2002
Total posts: 2996
Posted:x 100,000

Sounds like they are trying to put their anxieties about you moving away onto you in the form of a guilt trip. Not fun. But, as you say, you are a responsible parent, you are working hard yet making time for your son (a balance most people don't manage to get, ever). It is their choice to worry and their choice not to do anything to alleviate that worry (like talking to you like a sensible person).

What a rotten day. You deserve many hugs, a cup of hot chocolate, and a massive relaxing bath. Take care of yourself girl...


It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.

What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...

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