"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
Written by: owd
Taken in isolation, we see that there is no actual connection, physical or otherwise, that connects it to any other instant
"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."
Written by: simian
now i think that to think of "a single instant" is a handy mental construct we use, but time isn't made of connected up instances. It is simply a continuum, that cannot be sliced into parts by any means but our imagination.
According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...
Written by: owdso when two minds converse, they each keep up their own half of the conversation through 'coincidence' (as each half of the conversation is a series of necessarily existing possible mind states)?
UToR, in contrast, postulates the existence of the exact same two states of consciousness, including their feelings towards each other and their feelings of 'being connected' (to the other).
Written by: owd
To me, it's those 'feelings' that are important and it doesn't seem that ratifying them with intervening matter, is either necessary or useful.
"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."
Written by: jeff(fake)Written by: simian
now i think that to think of "a single instant" is a handy mental construct we use, but time isn't made of connected up instances. It is simply a continuum, that cannot be sliced into parts by any means but our imagination.
Max Plank would disagree.
"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."
Written by: simianWritten by: jeff(fake)Written by: simian
now i think that to think of "a single instant" is a handy mental construct we use, but time isn't made of connected up instances. It is simply a continuum, that cannot be sliced into parts by any means but our imagination.
Max Plank would disagree.
Would he? i'm not disagreeing that time can be measured, or that there is a theoretically smallest unit possible, but that it is a category error to conceptualize time as being constructed of a sequence of those units, like a line of blocks. This leads onto questions about how one has continuity to the next, which is a misunderstanding of terms.
According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...
Written by: simian
hmm it seems rather convenient that THIS me is the one who happens to have the perfectly ordered experience of reality, especially as this would be an extreme minority in the infinite collection of all the possible mind states i would be experiencing.
Written by: simian
by a similar token, i think to seperate the human mind from the human body, while making apparent sense, is in fact a language confusion. It's like imagining that we can take as our subject a bowl of cereal, then remove the milk, the cornflakes and the bowl, but somehow still have the 'breakfast' left behind.
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
Written by: jeff(fake)Written by: simian
now i think that to think of "a single instant" is a handy mental construct we use, but time isn't made of connected up instances. It is simply a continuum, that cannot be sliced into parts by any means but our imagination.
Max Plank would disagree.
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
Written by: simianWritten by: owdso when two minds converse, they each keep up their own half of the conversation through 'coincidence' (as each half of the conversation is a series of necessarily existing possible mind states)?
UToR, in contrast, postulates the existence of the exact same two states of consciousness, including their feelings towards each other and their feelings of 'being connected' (to the other).Written by: owd
To me, it's those 'feelings' that are important and it doesn't seem that ratifying them with intervening matter, is either necessary or useful.
well it would explain how they could actually interact with each other (physical laws), rather than independently keeping up opposite sides of an interaction, which seems a far more elaborate construction.
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
Written by: onewheeldave
I don't see it as language confusion- if you can provide proof or reasons why mind cannot be seperated from body, then do state it, because it will show UToR to be false.
"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."
"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."
Written by:
'In short, the reason we feel we are in a sequence of connected instants, is because those feeling are a possible state of consciousness and, UToR shows that all possible states of consciousness are necessarily real.'
ture na sig
Written by: quiet
Dave - a weakness of your theory:Written by:
'In short, the reason we feel we are in a sequence of connected instants, is because those feeling are a possible state of consciousness and, UToR shows that all possible states of consciousness are necessarily real.'
Unfortunately, that doesn't provide any sort of explanation at all - that is, your claim that 'the reason we feel . . .etc' just doesn't follow. This is because there is no explanation of why we have access to only those states of consciousness which are in temporal sequence. All that follows from UTOR is that the appearance of temporal sequence is a possibility; it doesn't explain why it obtains.
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. ~ Terry pratchett
According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. ~ Terry pratchett
Written by: jeff(fake)
Technically, it's not a theory - but you've probably already mentioned that.
Written by: jeff(fake)
Couldn't our minds simply emerge out of the inherant possibility of the universe's own existance,
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. ~ Terry pratchett
Written by:
In anticipation of the question 'Why, given that UToR denies the need for physical reality, do the mind states it proposes are necessarily real, co-incide so conveniently with those that would be there if the physical world was real?'
The answer is that, because UToR claims that all possible mind-states are necessarily real- obviously, the mind-states of the physicalist view are a sub-set of the set of all possible mind-states.
ture na sig
Written by: quiet
OWD: the question is *not*Written by:
In anticipation of the question 'Why, given that UToR denies the need for physical reality, do the mind states it proposes are necessarily real, co-incide so conveniently with those that would be there if the physical world was real?'
The answer is that, because UToR claims that all possible mind-states are necessarily real- obviously, the mind-states of the physicalist view are a sub-set of the set of all possible mind-states.
That's not the problem. The problem is this: given that, according to UTOR, *all* possible mind states exist, why is it that we *only ever* encounter those which we'd expect from the physicalist model? (e.g. why do we seem only to have coherent chains of memory? why no memories of future events? why no memories of other people's deeds'? etc)
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
Written by: quiet
why no memories of future events? why no memories of other people's deeds'? etc)
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
ture na sig
Written by: quiet
OWD
I still think that you're missing the point of my question.
I don't think it turns on the definition of 'you'. The question is (and you can run whichever definitions you like, the point still holds), variously;
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
Written by: onewheeldaveWritten by: jeff(fake)
Technically, it's not a theory - but you've probably already mentioned that.
A few people have said that- I'm going to admit my ignorance and ask why it's not a theory (it seems to fit the definition of theory in the dictionary).
According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...
Walls may have ears but they don't have eyes
Written by: the boy g
Falsifiablility is a prequisite of a scientific theory according to Karl Popper. UTOR is a theory just not a scientific one.
According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...
Written by: the boy g
UTOR is a theory just not a scientific one.
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
Using the keywords [ultimate theory reality] we found the following existing topics.