Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:So we all know what the videos are, and if you don't, you are much better off.

This thread is not to debate whether or not they are exploiting or whether we approve or disapprove please.

However, I worked a GGW party the other night (not as a girl to be on the video, but as a hostess) and was really disgusted by the guys they sent to film.

I seriously thought they would be somewhat professional,that they would be nice, charismatic (I mean, I thought you would have to be), etc.

They were less than.
They showed up looking like something the cat coughed up and were over an hour and a half late.
They did not know how to work a crowd.
They could not have charmed the paint off a peeling wall.

And I was disappointed that they really gravitated towards the same looking women all the time (ones that looked like mannequins).
In the end, they didn't get the girls (all 12 that showed up vs. over 100 men) to do anything. I did, but that is a story for another board wink

What I felt the most bad about is that the club actually paid these people to show up and do a job that they did not fully do, but they did just enough to get away with it. The club took a hit that night, both financially and to its reputation, which really sucked.

The only thing I was impressed with was how they handled the legal issues and the "waivers". That was really freakin' awesome.

BUT beyond that, I was dually impressed and disgusted by the men who showed up. I had a body guard assigned to follow me around to make sure no guys were inappropriate with me. A few were but I was able to sweet talk my way around them so there was no roughness necessary. But these guys were PIGS. Holy crap, more than what I expected. I was hired to work and they treated me like one of the potential girls, and as if I was meat. It was insane. I feared for the girls walking out to their cars. Luckily the bar staff is *amazing* and watched them all to make sure they were safe.

But then there were guys who were awesome. They weren't lewd or crude. They were there to see if there were any "sights", absolutely, but when it didn't happen much they were just there to have a good time. And when the icky guys were pressing, these patrons were there offering to step in as well. I was really impressed with that.

Honestly, I did not expect to see the latter at all. I know not all men are dogs, but I thought that the ones who would pay $20 to go to a GGW party would be.

I am so happy to admit I was wrong. It absolutely reaffirmed my faith in men.
So yeah, just thoughts I wanted to share.


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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KaelGotRice
KaelGotRice

Basu gasu bakuhatsu - because sometimes buses explode
Location: Angel's Landing, USA
Member Since: 21st Jul 2003
Total posts: 1584
Posted:As long as men are stupid, selfish, horny, and have money, sadly things like those videos are still going to exist.

But, nice guys do exist! They're just in hiding. wink


To do: More Firedrums 08 video?
Wildfire/US East coast fire footage
LA/EDC glow/fire footage
Fresno fire

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ubbrollsmile.gif" alt="" />

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Havokist
Havokist


Location: Manchester
Member Since: 20th Dec 2004
Total posts: 2530
Posted:quite a lot of guy's are lonely, sexist pig's, but as Mr. Kael says, there are actually nice guys out there, it's just they tend to be outnumbered by the idiots by about 50 to 1

We are the music makers, We are the dreamers of dreams,
Wandering by lone sea-breakers, And sitting by desolate streams;
World-losers and world-forsakers, On whom the pale moon gleams;
We are the movers and shakers of the world for ever, it seems.

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Fine_Rabid_Dog
Internet Hate Machine
Location: They seek him here, they seek ...
Member Since: 26th May 2004
Total posts: 10530
Posted:ouch. But its true. We can be right arses... all that testosterone... it clouds are judgment...

Im not defending them. thos guys sound like a bunch of asses. Cos im a brit, ive never seen a show like it.. but i know its about a bunch of girls getting real drunk and doing "outrageous" things like moon and stuff.... sounds like crap.. but i can see how it sells.

Im glad there were some guys to give us a good name... god its depressing when I think about..


The existance of flamethrowers says that someone, somewhere, at sometime said "I need to set that thing on fire, but it's too far away."

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Prometheus
Prometheus

Diamond In The Rough
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Member Since: 30th Jun 2002
Total posts: 459
Posted:When you have an event that appeals to the basest of male instinct, you are going to get the lowest common denominator.

Have faith, there's plenty of us 'good guys' out there...


Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:I'll even set aside my usual liberal and feminist viewpoints to say that I don't even get GGW from a male pig standpoint.

Drink chicks on spring break flashing boobs for a second really doesn't do much for me. But I'm weird that way.

Then again, I've actually seen boobies live before so maybe I'm not their target audience. wink


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Hmmm...I think the point was missed.

I expected tonnes of pigs and found that most of the men were awesome there. I was really surprised, and thankful, that only a couple were pigs. By far the good guys outnumbered the pigs...by way far. It was weird, I saw the best of most of the men at the event, not the worst.

And of the girls who did do stuff there (two of them) they were both sober. The whole drunk this is a *sort-of* misconception. Yes several of them are drunk, but *many* of the girls on the videos are sober.

This was a GGW party. Everyone paid $20 to get in, including the girls, so everyone knew what was expected.


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Valura
Valura

Mumma Hen
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Member Since: 25th Apr 2002
Total posts: 6391
Posted:'scuse me ignorance, but whats a girls go wild party? what are the rules and expectations etc?

TAJ "boat mummy." VALURA "yes sweetie you went on a boat, was daddy there with you?" TAJ "no, but monkey on boat" VALURA "well then sweetie, Daddy WAS there with you"

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Sakura_Moon
Sakura_Moon

Hop's Kitten Jester.
Location: Wonderland igloo, Vic, Austral...
Member Since: 12th Jul 2004
Total posts: 1803
Posted:See whats wrong with that is, that if i tried to be a hostess at something like i would end up starting a brawl. I'm not exactly the friendliest of people to sexist pigs.
You could almost call me a feminist, i dont liek it when girls are looked down at because we're the "weaker" of the sexes. Infact, we used to be considered equal...back in neanderthal times, that was until men found out they had bigger muscles and egos!
Go amazons!!!!
Love form the nasty hopper wiht a sad past with abusive men and nothing left to lose, except maybe my vow not to break another bone in a fight.


.:Pink Exocutioner:.

I am Jack's Raging Bile Duct...

Loving you from the deepest part of my loins.


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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Valura, technically girls show up and if they feel so inclined to flash portions of their body or act naughty for a camera, then they are allowed to. Men pay to watch women do it.

I have had abusive relationships as well. One *extremely* bad one. It is no excuse to propigate the negativity or blame every man for the actions of few.

What was happening at the party had *nothing* to do with viewpoints of women being weaker or victims or as anything less than men. They went to a party called Girls Gone Wild. Everyone there simply paid to go to a party and expected to see girls going wild. No big deal. They didn't really.

Feminist arguements don't work when women *paid* to come to this party knowing exactly what it was about, and they were sober doing so. Those who do not approve simply would not have been there. I was because I can work a crowd, calm down the pigs without a fight and get people to have a good time and because I have extreme issues with the feminist point of view.

Which is why I said that this is not to be a discussion about whether you think it is right or wrong, or the morals behind it, and now I am going to add that it is not to be a discussion about how men are pigs....

Because this party proved that given the "acceptible" chance to be a pig, the vast majority of the men at the party opted not to, even when they were drunk. *That* is what this is about, a positive, uplifting topic about men *not* being pigs and *not* treating women as less than when given the chance.

That is uplifting and inspiring, and I am saddened that so many are coming back to the negative.


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Sakura_Moon
Sakura_Moon

Hop's Kitten Jester.
Location: Wonderland igloo, Vic, Austral...
Member Since: 12th Jul 2004
Total posts: 1803
Posted:Pele, not meaning to eb negative. Sorry for that.
I think thats okay that the girls are doing that, its their choice. I just got a bit over zealous because i dont like it when people are unprofessional in their jobs when it is really needed. And the way that some men treat women.


.:Pink Exocutioner:.

I am Jack's Raging Bile Duct...

Loving you from the deepest part of my loins.


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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Written by: Sakura_moon

Pele, not meaning to eb negative. Sorry for that.
I think thats okay that the girls are doing that, its their choice. I just got a bit over zealous because i dont like it when people are unprofessional in their jobs when it is really needed. And the way that some men treat women.



No sweat! wink

I absolutely agree, which is why I did not spend any time with the film crew, or encourage any women to. They were just icky. smile


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Klowny
Klowny

Disco Inferno
Location: Remote Western Australia Karra...
Member Since: 12th Nov 2004
Total posts: 160
Posted:im not sure but girls seem to get conned so often by the jerks they cant tell between the next guy to want a piece of a$$ and the guys who are genuine and sincere, which makes it hard for,( i consider myself a fairly nice guy most of the time) us to get anywhere with a girl because they just cant be too sure. but what i find amusing is that alot of the guys that are jerks win over girls regardless!

"Only fools are positive! are you sure? Im POSITIVE"

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UCOF
UCOF

Carpal \'Tunnel

Member Since: 17th Apr 2002
Total posts: 15414
Posted:Iv got a few of their videos and I totally side with NYC:
"Drink chicks on spring break flashing boobs for a second really doesn't do much for me."

Its true.

umm


Pele: Is ths jist of what you are saying something along the lines of: I thought all men were bastards. But they're not... ?

smile


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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Not *all* men UCOF. I know scores of wonderful men. I thought all the men who would pay to go to that event would be...absolutely.

It was a pleasant surprise.


FireBug, jerks get the women on three accounts.
1. They are relentless and wear the women down to agreeing to a date. Absolutely.
2. They come across as strong and protective. Most women are rarely in a situation initially with a nice guy where she will have the chance to see that side of him.
3. Sometimes there is even that "danger" aspect, where the girl wants a "bad boy".

Now, this is not always the case, and it only captures the girl initially. Other things keep her with a jerk. But what I can tell you is that we grow out of it, and nice guys do win in the end. Honest wink


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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polythene
veteran
Location: London/ Surrey
Member Since: 15th May 2003
Total posts: 1359
Posted:A lot of girls like the attention from a jerk, seeing him treat her more nicely (at least to start with) than other people makes her feel special. Of course he's nice to you, he wants something!Personally I like to see how nicely a guy treats the people whose pants he isn't trying to get into, I think it helps give a much truer impression of that person smile

I've been pleasantly surprised at certain venues too, but maybe I shouldn't really, after all I don't picture myself as 'that' kind of girl, but I'm there, so it's logical that not all the guys there will necessarily be 'that' kind of guy either smile Still, hope for the best, be prepared for the worst!


The optimist claims that we are living in the best of all possible worlds.
The pessimist fears this is true.

Always make time to play in the snow.

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Tao Star
Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol
Member Since: 30th May 2003
Total posts: 1662
Posted:Written by: FireBug24

im not sure but girls seem to get conned so often by the jerks they cant tell between the next guy to want a piece of a$$ and the guys who are genuine and sincere, which makes it hard for,( i consider myself a fairly nice guy most of the time) us to get anywhere with a girl because they just cant be too sure. but what i find amusing is that alot of the guys that are jerks win over girls regardless!



this seems to be a really common misconceptions. I know some girls do get conned, but we're not stupid you know...! some girls actually like being with morons, and it might be bad for them, but it's not as if they haven't realised that.

give us some credit dude, i've been out with some really bad guys, but that doesn't mean i didn't choose to be with them.


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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Orbit
Orbit

enthusiast

Member Since: 17th Dec 2003
Total posts: 270
Posted:First of all, I keep telling my girlfriend that I'm a dangerous man, but she doesn't really beleive me.

The reality is that people are complex, and relationships are complex. So when we look at things at a surface level, we're often surprised that our stereotypes and models of the world fail.

I have to admit that for much of my 20's I was coerced into believing that nice guys win out in the end. That's NOT the whole story. I know too many nice guys that blame their lack of luck with women on the world -- "oh, why aren't women interested in me, even though I'm such a nice guy," etc etc. Women just don't see nice guys as dating material... because they aren't, as Pele pointed out, seen as strong and protective, or as I like to think of it, they're not seen as dangerous guys.

Anyhow, if you're a "nice guy" try bringing out some of the other aspects of your personality as well. And if you don't ask, you won't get. So don't be shy about making your intentions a little more clear. Be nice, be polite... just don't be a wuss. Guess what? All those guys you dismiss as being crass or crude or somehow "not a nice guy like me"... some of them are actually really nice despite what the movie stereotypes will have you believe. Plus they're getting more attention from the girls.

Women aren't just looking for one thing... there are many complex factors involved. So just being nice isn't gonna do it. There needs to be a hint of tension and excitement somewhere. I mean if you can appeal to the desire for security, for a little bit of excitement, and for a little jealousy from their friends (this is part of where the nice guy bits come in)... oh yeah, and don't come across as desperate... that's the magic formula right there.

So yeah... people are complex... and "normal" or even "nice" guys might actually check out something like a Girls Gone Wild party. Maybe it's a male bonding thing they're doing with their buddies. Is it exploitative? Yeah -- DUH.. it's GGW... but it's kind of openly exploitative so women at the event have security, etc etc... I'm much more concerned about other situations which are less controlled. Is it stupid and silly and maybe even PATHETIC? Yeah -- DUH... it's GGW. It's a room full of guys that are sooo desperate to SEE a little T&A that they go to this thing. I'm sure a few of those guys realized this after they'd paid and were in the door.

Sorry Pele, I'm sure my ramblings have violated a few of your warnings about what this thread isn't supposed to be about...

For the record, I've never been to one of these parties... but I am a dangerous guy. Really, I am. I mean fathers hide your daughters, here I... oh, wait, I have a girlfriend. Which for some reason makes me more attractive to other women too... go figure.


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Pele
Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA
Member Since: 15th Dec 2000
Total posts: 6193
Posted:Actually Orbitz, I think your "ramblings" weren't at all. It was very interesting and very truthful.

I am not so sure it is about a dangerous seeming man for me though as much as I like someone with a strong personality. I have a strong personality and if someone comes across to me as if he would let me walk all over him, I can't do the relationship with him. I can be friends but I need someone to tell me when I am being really silly or stupid too.

I've done the dangerous thing, and it was too much for me wink

Though you also hit on the other 4th thing. Here's a secret and if the "gal club" finds out I slipped it, then I think my membership card is going to be revoked but...what the hell. Women (and men) like the chase, and some even find more interest in what they can't have. Ever notice when you are in a relationship that suddenly the opposite sex seems more interested? Yup. That's the secret. Shhhhhhhh...;)
That happened at the GGW party too, with women there with their men. It was funny actually.


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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StonedCat
newbie

Member Since: 6th Mar 2005
Total posts: 12
Posted:Written by:
This thread is not to debate whether or not they are exploiting or whether we approve or disapprove please


Written by:
Hmmm...I think the point was missed



you sound pretty one sided and dont want anyone to rebut you. doesnt sound like a social discution worthy thread. i dont mean to be a jackass or anything just thing you should know the tone of you thread.


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