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Forums > Social Discussion > Ineffective "Anti-Drug" campaigns.

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NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:[Preamble: Please don't turn this into a discussion of drugs or drug use. It would be inappropriate to do so on this site. The administration of this site has stated previously that discussion of illegal activity is not welcome. I'm not advocating drug use, nor am I chastising those that do. I'm only discussing and critiquing the effectiveness of the 'anti drug' movement.]

OK, I know I'm walking on eggshells here but this is a topic that has been bugging me for a few years now. I'm a high school teacher in a public school so I get to see all of the 'anti drug' messages that are out there. Frankly, I think most of them are horribly ineffective. It makes me angry to see some 'anti drug' ads that are so bad they're almost counter productive. They make kids that don't do drugs look like total geeks and sometimes even make the kids that DO drugs look cooler.

I'm gonna barf if I have to see another: (actual anti-drug slogans)
Winners don't use drugs
Crack is Wack
Drug Free I Can B Anything I Want 2 B
Get Hooked on Healthy Choices
Game Over When You Play With Drugs
Don't Monkey With Drugs
Drugs are unBEARable

What kid getting offered a line of coke by a hot girl in the parking lot is gonna feel comfortable saying "Gee, I would... but Drug Free I Can B Anything I Want 2 B"

I blame people who THINK they're doing their job by printing up 1000 "Don't Monkey with Drugs" buttons when actually they're making a mockery of the entire "anti-drug" viewpoint.

I'm 31 and have never done an illegal drug in my life (gasp!) and the most I've ever had to say was "No, thanks." I never got a weggie, I never got stuck in a locker, and I still got invited to all the cool parties.

I know that some of my adult friends use drugs regularly which is fine with me, I'm not taking issue with adult drug use... but it bothers me that my 14 year old students are getting the message that you have to be a total dweeb to not do drugs. The anti-drug student advocates are totally out of touch with the main stream kid in my school. It's almost taking away the child's option NOT to do drugs.

Kids should be educated so that they can make their OWN informed decisions. I think that my tax dollars can do better for drug education than sicky sweet slogans and t-shirts for the two kids who were already not going to do drugs anyway.

[Crosses fingers and hopes that the thread doesn't veer off topic.]


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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Looper
GOLD Member since Feb 2004

Looper

grasshopper in training


Total posts: 124
Posted:Totally agree. They are Safe. Thats all they have going for them. It is something that has often accurred to me and seems so obvious that i wonder who actually designed these ads and how they got so out of touch.
You seem to really enjoy your role as a teacher but have you ever thought of actively taking steps to become more influesual (sp?). Politically, or within your school - principle and board of education stuff.
It is the only way to change it fast. Active discussions with like minded people (such as this) will get the ideas out there, but someone has to do something to actually design better campains. You sound like you are passionate about this and the wellbeing of wee ones. I would feel much more comfortable raising children if people who were actually in touch with reality were running the schools.
Sorry, not trying to corner you or suggest how you should run your life, just suggesting an option without knowing you at all.
smile


There is a world made of air, one of earth and one of water.
And there is one made of fire, and all of them fight for supremacy. They are fighting now, in my head.

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Rovo
GOLD Member since Jul 2003

Rovo

(the person actually known as Chris Bailey)
Location: Austin, TX, USA

Total posts: 544
Posted:I comepltely agree with you even my friends that have never done anything not even drank or tried a cig think the commercials that are on tv are ridiculus. They are really out of touch and I never thought of the fact that it makes saying no look geeky but what you said makes perfect sense.

Peace, Love, Circles

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Prometheus


Prometheus

Diamond In The Rough
Location: Richmond, Virginia

Total posts: 459
Posted:I always liked the messages at the end of the video games that said "winners don't use drugs," because the 97% of the kids who aren't any good will never see that message...

Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.

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Stone
GOLD Member since Jun 2001

Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne

Total posts: 2830
Posted:Just say No to Drugs.



I said No, but the Drugs wouldnt listen wink



The best campaign I saw was by the Victorian State Gov, as opposed to the crap Howard and our Federal Gov introduced in their National campaign - Tough on Drugs. Talk about a waste of money, they even sent a brochure of useless information to every house hold in Australia. The State campaign was much more realistic without the big stick approach. The web site doesnt have the impact of some of the telly ads.



In Australia, the current debate is over drug testing. The community and police say kids are at great risk because they dont know whats in the pills they are taking. However, when people recommend drug testing at raves for example, the police say that encourages kids use drugs, and the police have banned any personal drug test kits. Which to me seems a contradiction. But the police want it three ways, as in Victoria, they have just introduced drug driving tests.





ubblol Prometheus, your sig - Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.






EDITED_BY: Stone (1101960037)


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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Konsti


Konsti

lovable smart-ass
Location: vineyards, Vienna, Austria

Total posts: 785
Posted:alrighty then....
my fav drug is ..... just kiddintg NYC wink

Well I went to an american high school here in austria, and we didnt have any of these posters. I think they realised that they are useless and also that by hanging them up they would admit that there is a drug issue. My school wanted to stay prototype american.... with happy girl scout and pta meetings and no sex, drugs, rock and roll.

The only useful campaign we had was a this ex-junky who talked to us. He was cool,cause he took a normal approach to us. He didnt preach about how bad drugs are but sort of explained the choices and decisions we were making by taking drugs without telling us not to do it. I think that that was the only usefull drug eductaion i haver ever got without researching myself, cause it was based on information and not scare tactics.

But still i think that as long as the drugs are out there, ppl are going to be curious and as long as ppl are curious there will be drugs out there....

ill go skin up now
biggrin wink


"is optimism in austria just a lack of information?"
-Alfred Dorfer

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Socks
BRONZE Member since Nov 2004

Socks

Arf! Can I have a biscut?
Location: North America, Mid West

Total posts: 288
Posted:Actual anti-drug slogan from when I was in high school.

"I'm getting high on self esteem".

Yep.

Getting high is cool, but only if you're high on self esteem....

By the gram, apparently....


I'm weird. Just work through that and we'll all be fine.

"If you are a dog and your owner suggests that you wear a sweater suggest that he wear a tail." - Fran Lebowitz

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nearly_all_gone
SILVER Member since Aug 2004

nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton

Total posts: 1626
Posted:And if you want to talk about ineffective anti-drug campaigns making a mockery of intelligent, useful projects, look at the way the government (well, the UK government at least) hasn't actually responded to the proof gained in the 1920s that fear appeals ("Smoking Kills" style health promotions) have little to no effect on those they target. And now they're going to impose a ban on smoking in public enclosed spaces (ie pubs), which will go some way towards helping the problem but will still not help the people who smoke in their own homes to quit.

Instead it's suggested they employ simple, effective advice. Appealing to fear doesn't work.. (I think) it's to do with Freudian defence mechanisms. We recognise a threat but because we can ignore it and protect ourselves from feelings of guilt or fear, we take the latter option.

Or so my A-level psychology led me to believe.


What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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Pink...?
BRONZE Member since Apr 2002

Pink...?

Mistress of Pink...Multicoloured
Location: Over There

Total posts: 6140
Posted:Drug Education in my high school was awful!

We had 2 women who had never done drugs (or so the claimed) making us link the drug to the effects every single year was the same thing we had to do.
I don't think anyone paid attention. Except in my last year there.

We had a man come in to talk to us, who was actually still in prison for drug use, but was on one of those re-hab programmes. He spoke the truth, about how it was fun, and he started of having a great time, but then he got sucked into the addictiveness etc...
I actually think some people really paid attention.


Never pick up a duck in a dungeon...

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_Clare_
BRONZE Member since Oct 2002

_Clare_

Still wiggling
Location: Belfast

Total posts: 5967
Posted:We had no drug education at all. Apart from when the PE teacher told us that heroin was bad - but that was in the same lecture that she explained cigarettes were bad (we were all 17/18 at the time).

Getting to the other side smile

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MiG
GOLD Member since Apr 2004

MiG

Self-Flagellation Expert
Location: Bogged at CG

Total posts: 3415
Posted:some of the anti smoking ads here, that i havent seen for ages, coincedentally, were rather good. a guy cutting a brain open and showing the blood clot from a stroke, caused by smoking, an aorta getting all the gunk squeezed out of it, someone pouring a glass of tar over a pair of lungs. very graphic, slightly disturbing, and a lot more effective than 'dont monkey with drugs' or 'Crack is Wack'.

/me steps up onto the soap box, taps mic a couple of times*

If anti drug campaigns showed the horrible side effects of doing drugs, like, for instance, jail terms for theft (to buy more), or living the rest of one's life as a vegetable because one cooked one's brain on X, or some such similar thing, then campaigns would be a lot more effective. and show the kids. sure, the uber conservative parents will bleat about how they dont want little jimmy being scared by an advert showing a big scary man mugging some poor little girl for 20 dollars to go get a hit, but the same parents probably dont want little jimmy to turn into aforementioned big scary man mugging girl, so stuff them. show it graphiic, show it bad, show it worse than it is, in the hopes that little jimmy says to himself 'gee, i dont want to turn into that'. show the junky being rejected for jobs, show the addict digging through a bin for food. scare people, revulse people, make it effective. for gods sake, dont coat it in sugar and only show it during the daytime soapies when the people that should see it are at school, because it wont do jack.

*clears throat, steps off of soapbox*


"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie

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nearly_all_gone
SILVER Member since Aug 2004

nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton

Total posts: 1626
Posted:Written by: MiG

some of the anti smoking ads here, that i havent seen for ages, coincedentally, were rather good. a guy cutting a brain open and showing the blood clot from a stroke, caused by smoking, an aorta getting all the gunk squeezed out of it, someone pouring a glass of tar over a pair of lungs. very graphic, slightly disturbing, and a lot more effective than 'dont monkey with drugs' or 'Crack is Wack'.



Seriously, these are exactly the kinds of things they used in the experiement which proved this kind of thing does nothing to stop existing behaviour, it only acts as a preventative measure to stop new people doing it. So whilst it's useful on that front, it does virtually nothing to help those who are already addicted. It needs practical advice if it'll work.

Strange but true, and strange it doesn't seem to have been noted by those who work in health promotion!

More


What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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flid
BRONZE Member since Aug 2002

flid

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Warwickshire

Total posts: 3136
Posted:aww man, using B instead of Be and 2 instead of to, that's wack!

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MiG
GOLD Member since Apr 2004

MiG

Self-Flagellation Expert
Location: Bogged at CG

Total posts: 3415
Posted:true. prevention is, as they say, better than cure. stop all the little johnny's from taking up drugs, then help all the big ones get off them, i say.

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie

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zarkia
BRONZE Member since Oct 2004

zarkia

Member
Location: ireland

Total posts: 98
Posted:Written by: MiG

some of the anti smoking ads here, that i havent seen for ages, coincedentally, were rather good. a guy cutting a brain open and showing the blood clot from a stroke, caused by smoking, an aorta getting all the gunk squeezed out of it, someone pouring a glass of tar over a pair of lungs. very graphic, slightly disturbing, and a lot more effective than 'dont monkey with drugs' or 'Crack is Wack'.



those ads are totally disgusting... but anyway

the only thing about ads like this is that generally they are shown after 9pm or whenever, they are targeted at a much older age-group. not that i'm saying teenagers don't watch tv after 9pm, but you know. its the 9 + 10 year olds that the impression has to be made on - teenagers have already made up their minds on stuff like that.


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garthy
SILVER Member since Apr 2002

garthy

old hand
Location: Bristol, England

Total posts: 717
Posted:I think on of the biggest problem that probably is detrimental to the whole anti-drug campaign is the lumping of 'DRUGs' in to one category. The 'Daily Mail' a paper in the UK love doing that!

Basicly lying to the kids that all drugs are bad an will kill you (well that how it comes accross)

Then when somone goes out and has a splif and doesn't die and actuallty has a pretty good time giggles a bit and eats rather more chocolate that any normal person should the lies are exposed.

The kid who isn't stupid make the connection of lying and then trys all other drugs. (Well not quite but you get it)

As you were saying I think honesty would work best. Tell them about the good side and the bad side from someone they know has been there.

Basicly Don't treat kids as stupid and don't try to invent cool slogans to try to pursuade them as NYC said it's probably gonna have the opasite effect.


"**grumble*spuriouswindmills*grumble**" - Coleman
"if poi was only for girls there wouldnt be many good poi spinners...." - Nx

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Tao Star


Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1662
Posted:over here we have Frank . i think it's not bad really - certainly gets rid of the only geeks say no message. Or maybe i'm just old enough now to listen to some common sense.

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:That site is pretty cool.

Except it called me a geek when I took the test.

I'm not sure if it's a bit TOO pro drug for me. I can't believe that LSD is this innocent (Frank says there's not one bad thing about it if you're a normal happy kid!)...
http://www.talktofrank.com/azofdrugs/L/LSD.aspx


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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simian


simian

110% MONKEY EVERY TIME ALL THE TIME JUST CANT STOP THE MONKEY
Location: London

Total posts: 3149
Posted:You probably can't beleive that LSD is so innocent because of the vicious propaganda of US conservatives in the fifties\sixties. Those paranoid nutters have had a large effect on western perceptions of a lot of things.

UK drug education has been really good for quite a while. They just tell the truth.

At my school in the mid-nineties, we got a government booklet going through all the different types of drugs with information about the positive and negative psychological effects, side-effects, addiction, legality, etc.

notably, alcohol and nicotine were included alongside the other drugs without any real differentiation.


"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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Stone
GOLD Member since Jun 2001

Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne

Total posts: 2830
Posted:The big problem I have with most of this "Anti-Drug" campaigns stuff, and especially the media, is inaccurate information.



To suggest that LSD is this harmless is pure nonsense. I think Frank gives a fair summery of what to expect, and states early on that A bad trip is your worst nightmare come to life.



All drugs are dangerous, and most have side effects. That includes prescription and supermarket drugs.



For example, Authorities consider new warnings for antidepressants

(the example is a late edit)





smile


EDITED_BY: Stone (1102472132)


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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Bretch


Bretch

enthusiast
Location: Cork, Ireland at present

Total posts: 247
Posted:All drugs are dangerous, and most have side effects. That includes prescription and supermarket drugs.

Is this your opinion stone, that all drugs are dangerous?? I don't wonna get on me soapbox here , but, thats a slight exageration to say the least!!!!!

I was gonna go into more details, but thats going offtopic and would cause an uproar!!!! and a spank for me!!


I used to be indecisive, but I'm not so sure now.....

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Medusa
BRONZE Member since Nov 2003

Medusa

veteran
Location: 8 days at Cloudbreak, 6 in Per...

Total posts: 1433
Posted:Actually if you want to get technical then yes ALL drugs are dangerous...including prescription drugs.

Every drug you take, whether legal or illegal, has side effects (some you notice some you don't) that can be doing you serious harm.


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Bretch


Bretch

enthusiast
Location: Cork, Ireland at present

Total posts: 247
Posted:Sorry, have to disagree... V. strongly, there has not, to date ever been one single fatality recorded soley to do with one particular recreactional drug, in fact, I'm pretty sure in saying, that, with very very few exceptions, there are no serious side effects, short and espically long term. Also to mention it has been used for over 2000 years, about 400yrs (could be more) in europe and now, it's been 'illegal' for less then a century. (Can this go in a new thread please????? or is it still too risky???)

Also, Coffee and tea could be classed as a drug... and perscription drugs are more dangerous, as you think they're safe to take - I took a perscription drug for about 10yrs, then when I was about 20 or something, the drug was withdrawn. I asked why, 'it gives you a dodgy heart'.. eek..Great.... I'll find my relief elsewhere thank you V much Mr Dr.!!!!!


I used to be indecisive, but I'm not so sure now.....

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Medusa
BRONZE Member since Nov 2003

Medusa

veteran
Location: 8 days at Cloudbreak, 6 in Per...

Total posts: 1433
Posted:You need to do your research more thoroughly...even coffee and tea (caffeine) has side effects that can be quite damaging...and if the drug you are talking about is what I think it is then please read the following:

Problems with memory and learning
Distorted perception
Difficulty in thinking and problem solving
Loss of coordination
Increased heart rate
Anxiety
Panic attacks
Daily cough and phlegm
Symptoms of chronic bronchitis
More frequent chest colds

Long-term effects:

Abnormal functioning of lung tissue
Impairment of critical skills related to attention, memory, and learning


Name any drug in the histry of man kind and there is always side effects....no matter what!


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Bretch


Bretch

enthusiast
Location: Cork, Ireland at present

Total posts: 247
Posted:Thanx for the info Medusa, I think we are agreeing on the tea/coffee bit, but, hmmm this is gonna be hard to write......

The 1st 4 points, are true, but thats why its taken, the next I'm not sure what to think??? Is ithis harmful/dangerous? the next two, never expereinced, though I know that some do suffer this effect, the last three can be disregarded if the drug is ingested and not taken how it is normally.... I've never read any info that indicates the last. But you never mentioned 'drug' induced psychosis, were some people who partake in it, basically freak out and can't control themselves.. I've only seen 1 report of this though.....

Yeah, I know your right, everything in moderation is the key I personally feel.


I used to be indecisive, but I'm not so sure now.....

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MiG
GOLD Member since Apr 2004

MiG

Self-Flagellation Expert
Location: Bogged at CG

Total posts: 3415
Posted:i think it all depends on the amount used. if your consuming a pound a day, then sure, those effects are likely to be seen. if, however, you have a recreational spliff every now and then, i dont think there is a high chance of Written by: Medusa

Short term effects:
Daily cough and phlegm
Symptoms of chronic bronchitis
More frequent chest colds

Long-term effects:

Abnormal functioning of lung tissue
Impairment of critical skills related to attention, memory, and learning




side effects there are, but some shouldnt really be called side effects of the drug itself. tis like saying that needle holes are a side effect of heroin. they arent. they are an effect of your method of injesting heroin, but heroin does not put little holes in your elbow.


"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie

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grasshoppah
BRONZE Member since Nov 2003

grasshoppah

HoP is teh suxor.
Location: Tampa, Florida

Total posts: 425
Posted:
Non-Https Image Link


Once in a while you get shown the light
in the strangest of places if you look at it right.

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Stone
GOLD Member since Jun 2001

Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne

Total posts: 2830
Posted:Bretch said:
Written by:
Is this your opinion stone, that all drugs are dangerous?



Yes Bretch. Thats my opinion, and only a fool would argue against that statement.

Perhaps, someone was suffering from short-term memory loss or impaired cognition ability when the ignored the first line of the thread, where NYC said:

Please don't turn this into a discussion of drugs or drug use.

I would suggest that if u want to discuss these issues, go to bluelight.nu, but even there they maintain there is no such thing as "safe" drug use! So???


rolleyes


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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Bretch


Bretch

enthusiast
Location: Cork, Ireland at present

Total posts: 247
Posted:Well, this nicely brings us back to the original subject, the illusion that all drugs are dangerous, that the anti-drugs/war on drugs campaigners keep on about, this simply is not true. The particular drug I often talk about, has not had one recorded incident of fatilty. Too put all drugs together and label them as one, has, does and will not achieve anything but negativity... well, from the likes me anyway, and there's lots of me's out there.

Sure, no drug is safe: brand X drug has a lethal-to-effective-dose ratio of 40000 to 1, the same ratio applied to asprin is 10 to 1 eek


I used to be indecisive, but I'm not so sure now.....

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Medusa
BRONZE Member since Nov 2003

Medusa

veteran
Location: 8 days at Cloudbreak, 6 in Per...

Total posts: 1433
Posted:"A skydiving instructor who died in July while attempting to land on a pond at Skydive Chicago in Ottawa was seriously impaired by smoking marijuana within two hours of his death, according to a toxicology report released Wednesday."

Found this...so I'm sorry but the impaired judgement which was caused by the marijuana was what caused this guy to die...I can find more if you want me to....There are also a number of cases of people being high on Marijuana and crashing their cars due to impaired judgement....some fatal some not....so I'm sorry but to say it doesn't kill (directly or indirectly) is pure utter bull plop!


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Bretch


Bretch

enthusiast
Location: Cork, Ireland at present

Total posts: 247
Posted:I doubt very much that smoking M caused the dudes death... what, did he forget to open the shoot... or fell asleep.. or got the munches n was too busy eating a 1kg bar of choc instead of watching the fast approching earth???

When I say dangerous, I'm talking about the effect of the drug on the body, not on what the person is doing, otherwise you could say a guy walking down the street while smoking, gets hit by car will be the fault of the smokers, not the driver. M will impair you whilst doing certain things, thats down to the responsility of the user.. as in drinkers n drivers.


I used to be indecisive, but I'm not so sure now.....

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