If I could be granted one wish I would ask for all the questions of the universe.
Written by: spiralx
But it seems to me a bit of a leap to claim that this fact means that the value of the measurement you have taken is invalidated by that fact. Just because you can't know the system's current state at a given time doesn't make the fact that you measured it to be X at time T any less true...
-v-
Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!
Getting to the other side
Written by: Firepoise
"If so, what does entroy than have to do with higher dimentionality, since time also seems to be linked to this?"
Don't understand
-v-
Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!
Written by: BrandyH
I'm saying that "time" is a label that we have created in order for us to help keep some order to our little lives. I'm saying that before someone was able to "perceive" time, then no....it did not "exist". Maybe things are happening all at once now....but we have conditioned ourselves to only concentrate on the small blip of reality that we call "our time", and have ultimately trained ourselves to grab onto events only to try and prove to ourselves that we are really here right now. We make ourselves comfortable by trying to name the nameless and stopping the unstoppable. Time is a little thing that has been developed to try and make order out of chaos.
Much Love....so what is the third thing???? After dumb and lazy, that is?
"Moo," said the happy cow.
Written by: vanize
just as the effects of something done now lead to a wider and wider array of possible things in the future and have a smaller and smaller probable influence on future events, events in the past have a smaller and smaller probable influence on the now and there is an increasing array of possible ways to get from said event to now.
a measurement from the past is not invalidated, just as a video tape still shows what happened when it was recorded. But ok, that happened - so what? it has increasingly less and less to do with anything happening now the further it gets into the past, and interpretations of the measurement or the video become increasingly conjectural. On the time scale of a thousand years, precise measurements virtually become hogwash. Human memory can't be relied on for accuracy for more than a few hours in most cases. Video tapes do not tell a complete story ever.
Written by: vanize
we measure time using regular entropic processes (earth going around sun, atomic decay, mechanical mechanisms winding down).
Written by: vanize
Time seems to pass faster when more is going on around us (hence the entropy of our local system is greater) than when nothing is happening and we are bored (lower observable entropy). So then, is our tool "time perception" actually akin to a subconcious rationalization of entropy? If so, what does entroy than have to do with higher dimentionality, since time also seems to be linked to this?
"Moo," said the happy cow.
Written by: spiralx
More going on around out does not correspond to a greater entropy - a greater rate of increase perhaps, but that doesn't say anything about the actual level. And time perception is more related to psychological factors than physical ones.
monkeys ate my brain
"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA
"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie
Written by: spiralxWritten by: vanize
just as the effects of something done now lead to a wider and wider array of possible things in the future and have a smaller and smaller probable influence on future events, events in the past have a smaller and smaller probable influence on the now and there is an increasing array of possible ways to get from said event to now.
a measurement from the past is not invalidated, just as a video tape still shows what happened when it was recorded. But ok, that happened - so what? it has increasingly less and less to do with anything happening now the further it gets into the past, and interpretations of the measurement or the video become increasingly conjectural. On the time scale of a thousand years, precise measurements virtually become hogwash. Human memory can't be relied on for accuracy for more than a few hours in most cases. Video tapes do not tell a complete story ever.
Ok, but that's not a fundamental point, you're saying that there still is a concrete past. And while our knowledge of it is lacking and fades with time that isn't to say it doesn't affect us - the stars we see are millions of years old, and anyone looking at the night sky is certainly being affected by the past!
-v-
Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!
"Moo," said the happy cow.
"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA
"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie
Written by: spiralx
I don't agree with you at all I believe that the past actually occurred in a consistent manner, and that our observation or not of it has nothing to do with anything. Which probably comes from the fact that I'm not a big fan of the whole "collapse of the wave function" pseudo-mysticism and anthropo-centrism that the Copenhagen Interpretation brings into QM. I prefer something like the transaction interpretation which avoids any special role for observers...
https://www.npl.washington.edu/npl/int_rep/ti_over/ti_over.html
As an aside have you read much Greg Egan? Both Quarantine and Distress deal very much with the ultimate effects of this sort of stuff... definitely worth a read!
-v-
Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!
"Moo," said the happy cow.
monkeys ate my brain
Check t'ya bongall rass klan - Eh!
(chilltheworldout)
Lyreecalbombstylee...
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