Forums > Social Discussion > US Gay marriage questions

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Cole and Meg agreeing with me? I must be wrong.



And Cole, I don't know what you mean by 'sanctify'. Does a Catholic church need to sanctify a Jewish wedding?

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.

 Written by: NYC



Cole and Meg agreeing with me? I must be wrong.







And Cole, I don't know what you mean by 'sanctify'. Does a Catholic church need to sanctify a Jewish wedding?





we didn't agree with you - we simply answered your loaded question





santify "to give religious sanction to, as with an oath or vow"

(source:www.thefreedictionary.com)



the reason i referred to the catholic church specifically is because your question was directed at drudwyn, who was defending a catholic's standpoint on the issue.



however, your question suggests a more general version of my question:



does the word 'marriage' in america imply that the union is recognised (sanctified) by a major religion?



if so, which religions are leaglly approved as being allowed to sanctify a marriage and would they be forced to santify same-sex marriages if those unions were made legal?





cole. x

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Spin, bounce, be one with the world, because it is yours to enjoy...

 Written by: coleman


 Written by: faithinfire


i want one that says "keep your laws off my religion"



surely its a bit late for that - divorce is already legal in the u.s.

and as i understand it, catholic dogma states that a marriage under god is indissoluble?

source

cole. x


that is a secular thing, just like civil unions, which i am not against

the catholic equilvalent which sadly is becoming more common is annulment

and it is hard to be homophobic when you are bi yourself
like i said before i am not revamping the old discussion, it's all there just go back and look

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...

 Written by: faithinfire



 Written by: coleman



as i understand it, catholic dogma states that a marriage under god is indissoluble?





that is a secular thing, just like civil unions, which i am not against



the catholic equilvalent which sadly is becoming more common is annulment



and it is hard to be homophobic when you are bi yourself



like i said before i am not revamping the old discussion, it's all there just go back and look





annulment to my mind is simply a modern way of side-stepping the catholic dogma.



some discussion on the topic



annulment essentially means that the 'marriage' was actually never a real marriage at all in god's eyes, which to me a very questionable reconsideration - it had all the related ceremony and, for its duration, was treated as a wholly sanctified marriage would be



by referring to divorce as 'a secular thing' you seem to be implying that 'marriage' is a specifically catholic union and that all other marriages are simply 'civil unions'?



what about jewish or muslim weddings or even other christian sect weddings - do these not result in marriage?





i have read the other discussion and it doesn't tackle my question of why marriage is considered by some (including yourself if i've understood you correctly faith) to imply that the union is sanctified by a religion and in some cases, implies a union that is sanctified by the catholic church.





cole. x

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Spin, bounce, be one with the world, because it is yours to enjoy...

thank-you.



as i suspected, making same-sex marriage legal would have no bearing on what marriages the catholic church deems worthy of sanctification.



i do not think that a union between two people should require a religious element to be referred to as 'marriage'.



the bond of marriage is just as sacred to me whether it is recognised by a god or not - for me, its about the union of two people, not about whether the union was made in the presence of a deity.



 Written by: flying_on_fire



but thats personal beliefs which i try not to thrust at others!





amen to that.



its fine by me if people believe that homosexuality is a sin and therefore choose not to partake in homosexual acts on moral grounds.



as long as they do not try to force others to abide by these rules, i can respect their views.



of course, i'm sure that gay catholics have a problem with it, but that's for them to reconcile for themselves - i imagine that belonging to a faith that precludes your sexual orientation is a very confusing situation to find yourself in.





cole. x



[edit: drudwyn - i wrote this before i had read your post! thanks for sharing your experiences ]

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed

the bumper sticker "keep your laws off my body" is saying "don't legislate against abortion as this is dictating what i can and cannot do with my body".



a bumper sticker that says "keep your laws off my religion" says to me "don't legislate for same-sex marriages as this reduces the sacredness of my religion".



laws that allow same-sex marriage have *nothing* to do with religion.

the catholic church would still be free to choose which unions it chooses to sanctify so the same-sex marriage laws are totally apart from 'your religion'.



apologies if i've misunderstood you faith but i'm guessing from his post that jeff read the meanings of those bumper stickers in a similar way to me.





on marriage:



that clears things up for me - we have opposing opinions on what marriage means and so our views are irreconciable.



i don't think the union of marriage has to be linked to religion whereas you do.



you are against same-sex marriage because, for you, marriage is linked to religion and your religion abhores same-sex relationships.



i consider marriage to be a union that can exist apart from religion and thus, a same-sex marriage is as acceptable as an opposite-sex marriage.









cole. x

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Love is the law.

 Written by: faithinfire



abhor is a strong statement





i don't think abhor is too strong a word for the catholic church's and baptist church's stance on same-sex relationships and same-sex marriage.



why do i think that?



for a start, that image nyc posted was displayed by baptist church members at a funeral (source: the story behind the picture).

and there's a horrible website that goes with it: do not click this - its very unpleasant hate mongering





that's definitely the extreme/fanatical end of the spectrum as far as attitudes go, but its very clear that the catholic church isn't prepared to 'love thy neighbour' if thy neighbour happens to be actively gay



for those too lazy to search:

catholic bishop's to vote on whether or not to condemn scorn and hatred whilst still opposing same-sex unions - why in the world should they need to vote on whether or not to denounce hatred, in any form?!??!!

what to do if you're catholic, gay and american



we have same sex unions in the u.k.

however, i see no reason that we shouldn't refer to them as marriages (as they are in spain).

the law should not discriminate between men and women and the relationships they build.

i also think it should be up to individual churches to choose whether or not they will host same-sex marriage ceremonies or sanctify such marriages.





cole. x

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Spin, bounce, be one with the world, because it is yours to enjoy...

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...

According to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Quantum Dynamics, we may already be making love right now...

The problem with religion and with any particular religion is this: How can you prove your version is the right one?

If you're a Christian, then I have news for you: that chap with the "GOD HATES FAGS" sign (I take it God doesn't smoke, then? ) would also say that he's a Christian. And what's more, he would argue that you aren't!.

And he can show you biblical proof that he's right!

Oh lord... what a mess we have.

-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed

-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

Faith
Nay, whatever comes one hour was sunlit and the most high gods may not make boast of any better thing than to have watched that hour as it passed