Forums > Social Discussion > Your Opinions on the Paranormal?

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PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
I don't want stories actually.

What I am looking for is do you believe?

If so, what do you believe in?

Do your beliefs stop at ghosts or do you think demons, werewolves, vampires are real?

What about possession?

UFO's and alien abductions?

What about those things that people can supposedly do? Magic (real, not David Copperfield)? Telepathy? Clair/Audiovoyance?
etc..etc...etc...


I ask because I recently resumed my role as a paranormal investigator. I did it years ago, and recently resumed it because it is something I really loved doing. I work with a group of people who seem to be more embracing and *want* to believe in it so much that I do not think they apply as much logic and science. Me, I apply logic and science until I run out of ideas and then still won't definitively say yes, just that it *could* be.

What I have noticed is that those who want to believe, find explainations for their exsistence where they don't really exsist. On the other hand those who choose not to believe will make up stupid explainations that make no sense to debunk something.
It can be quite hard to deal with.

So...where do you fit into all of htis and what do you think?

Thanks!
P~

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


spiralxveteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
It certainly doesn't explain everything, but it's certainly a good start and shows that scientific explainations are possible for paranormal phenomena smile

"Moo," said the happy cow.


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
All paranormal is, is things that happen beyond the norm. I sat last night and looked up craploads of definitions in a standard webster's dictionary and I found that what most people concider definitions of things, are not what they really mean at all (oooohhhh, what a non-suprise that is!).

The actual definition of paranormal is "of or pertaining to events or perceptions occurring without scientific explaination."

So, it does not solely apply to ghosties and such, but also to many illnesses and psychological disorders.
How about why Lisa Marie ever married Michael Jackson? That is definately creepier than chasing a ghost!

Back to my other question. How do you think/feel media has shaped the social p.o.v. of the "paranormal"?

Thanks!

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


MandSILVER Member
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada


Posted:
Well, Ive come into this conversation a little late, and now it seems that the questions are starting to rack up.
So Ill use this post to answer the question of what I believe in. Ill come back to the other questions in a while, to stop this post from ending up pages long.

I used to be a complete non-believer in anything paranormal (but strangely, at the same time had a fear of ghosts).

Thats changed now. Mainly because of one of the places I lived and worked at. So many things happened to lots of the staff there, that it turned my thoughts on the matter right round.

In my own head, Ive tried to explain occurrences by the (pretty basic) use of science- the light shining in a certain way, a crack in the window where the wind might have got in, etc.
Ive found that some things can be explained this way. In some instances this is indeed the correct answer. In others, I think its just an excuse to make me feel better.
But there have been more and more things since I worked there that are completely unexplainable by any scientific measures that I know.

Im pretty settled in my own mind about the existence of ghosts, because of many first hand experiences, but I dont know how broad a spectrum of existence they take up.
For instance, the difference (if any) between a ghost and a spirit. What defines a poltergeist, other than their ability to move objects- and why they seem to have that ability. Or the phenomenon of orbs- something I hadnt thought too much about until my mum started asking me about them.

I think possession is entirely possible- just as humans have very different levels of intellect and power (of many different varieties) I believe ghosts do too. After all, they were human at some time or another.
But to be dead certain (no pun intended) I think Id need more proof than Ive seen- which I admit isnt a lot (and is always hard to get).

Things such as werewolves and vampires (the blood sucking, feeding and living forever kind) are myths and legends that have grown up through the years. I believe that they have spawned the people who claim to be vampires today- people who do indeed drink each others blood (in small quantities), either through an act of sex or some form of ritual- but I dont think theyre linked in any way to the paranormal.


UFOs- the possibility for them is most certainly there. Theres so much we dont know anything about outside of our solar system, that the miracle of life could indeed have also started somewhere else.
Alien abduction though No. Sorry, I dont buy that. As Pele said do I believe they are kidnapping our toothless hoards and sticking probes up their butts and noses? Not at all.
ubblol

Im interested in the question of how the media has affected peoples views of the paranormal. I think they have a huge influence.
But let me come back to that one in a while

Lets steal a spaceship and head for the sun, and shoot the stars with a lemonade ray gun.


stickmanWorld Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||


Posted:
well pele, i havent given the idea of the media and related influence of ppls perception/belief of the paranormal, but heres the first thing that came to my mind..

i dont know when this happened, but there are some famous "photos" (could be doctored, who knows) of ufo sightings in mexico city.. in these pics the shape of the ufo is surprisingly similar to the shape everyone would imagine when talking about ufo's: a disc shaped craft with a bulge on the top.. now these were probly (also) released by the media, and in that sense it is possible that that helped shape our ideas on the shape of them..
pls correct me if im completely wrong with these facts.. youd probly know them better than me..
as for other forms of paranormal events and behavior, well, let me sleep on it.. however the media always has an enormous influence on most things the masses believe, so why not on the paranormal?

PrometheusDiamond In The Rough
459 posts
Location: Richmond, Virginia


Posted:
The media, especially in the U.S., has always been a devil's advocate, looking for new diseases, scandals or controversy.

I think they are just beginning to make the paranormal more socially acceptable, even popular. Many current television shows, including lame reality phenomenon, touch on the unknown. In years past, paranormal topics were always looked at as semi-silly and often reported with tongue firmly in cheek.

The sci-fi channel has one show I really like, called Proof Positive, where they objectively take three specific cases relating to UFO's, ghosts, ESP, legendary monsters, etc. and pits it against true scientific investigation. They take what evidence exists and literally puts it under the microscope.

What shows like this do is expand people's curiosities, and the paranormal is now being approached in a more sincere manner.

Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.


spiralxveteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
I'm not sure whether the media is to blame as much as it seems to be part of a wider movement which is rejecting science and logic and returning to mysticism and faith. This climate makes it easier for things to be taken uncritically, and so genuine mysteries which could foster further understanding of the world get lost in a sea of pseudo-science and fakery.

Just look at all the people who don't even understand what science is about before dismissing it as a "modern myth" or "anti-human" or "opposing spirituality". Blugh.

"Moo," said the happy cow.


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
Very true Prom. Yet in that vain we also are plagued with shows like Ghosthunters, which is lame attempt at filming a paranormal investigation team who attempts to film paranormal with little science to support them. It is pretty crazy catch 22 and watching these idiots run around screaming and fighting might make for good tv but I truly feel it does two things...

It gives people the idea that paranormal investigators are cheap crack-pots who really don't know what they are doing and it gives them the impression that there really is no science involved.

Then there are all the movies, the tv shows, the fiction books (my favorite are the people who believe in the White Wolf /Vampire roleplaying books) which for some reason the brainwashed masses. Now, somehow, people expect to see something that resembles tv or somehow dump every unexplained occurrance in their lives as some source of Amityville evil. It is rather annoying.

I also think that because of media, and the current tech availability, people automatically assume everything is an elaborately set up hoax, even when they can not prove it. Something which I find incredibly annoying. I could set up a hoax, but it is a waste of my time and my money. I would rather take science and apply it to something "real".

Now, I am going to go back to Mand.
I also wondered the difference between the ghost, spirits, poltergeist, etc. stuff. It seems there are a million words out there which people use interchangably, and if you actually start to research them you will find that they are not interchangeable at all. I think that media had a large part to do with this as well. (for example: on Charmed they used the terms "Witch" and "Wicca" interchangably, which they absolutely are not).

The answer to the wonderings you had about this goes something like this...

-A poltergeist is a spirit who manifests its presence by use of noises.

-A spirit is the incorporeal part of humans, and so in
the "paranormal" it is an incorporeal being which has character (not just a hovering one).

-A specter is a spirit of a terrifying nature, with intent to cause fear.

-A ghost is a disembodied spirit, often of a vague evanescent form, among the living.

-A phantasm is the image or representation of a real object.

-A phantom is an appearance without material substance.

-An apparition is something making a remarkable appearance.

However, popular useage would have you believe these are all the same, and some of them are not used at all in common vernacular.
Obviously, some things people believe the experience can fall under many of these but part of what I do as an investigator is rule out what science can explain then plug in the symptoms and theorize which of these would be closest to the victims experiences. I research the history of the place, the geology, look at the home schematics, etc. Then I look into history and see if I can pinpoint what is being dealt with (as there is an enormous native american population here, we deal with some interesting beliefs). I have to be open minded enough to believe and skeptical enough to rule everything else out first. That is how those "classifications" come into play.
Did that make sense?

Thanks!

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


spiralxveteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
Written by: Pele

my favorite are the people who believe in the White Wolf /Vampire roleplaying books



Oh I love those people! ubblol Truly the lamest group of people in the world EVAR ubblol

"Moo," said the happy cow.


Posted:
Written by: Pele

Back to my other question. How do you think/feel media has shaped the social p.o.v. of the "paranormal"?



Thanks!






If it wasn't for the popular media, I might never have known of such skeptics as James Randi, Carl Sagan, Issac Assimov, or Harry Houdini. Or for that matterCSICOP

I had posted some of this earlier, and then deleted it, but people have pm'd me wondering why.

Why is it that the person who started this thread is allowed to call James Randi an ass and a blowhard? Besides him not being here to defend himself, it doesn't address the fact that no one has successfully taken him up on his million dollar challenge. Beyond claiming that its rigged?

I thought that social discussion was about just that, "Discussion". Yet threads like this are put up and we are told its not being meant for debate. Why?

Posted:
Written by: Pele


Please keep in mind I do not want a debate on the topic. It is one of those weird ones that can get quite heated.



HoP used to be a place where we could discuss things with respect for others opinions and such. frown frown frown And even if they got a little heated, that's what the mods were there for.

ASTRO FAERIEBRONZE Member
ummmmmmm.............
724 posts
Location: Rotherham, UK


Posted:
I beleive anythings possible, but i beleive the media has hyped it up, making it seem more unbeleivable.
The more something is hyped, the more it is questioned and dissected and starts becoming detached.
Ive had a few experiences, ive had a few between me and my twin, ie. him knowing id been hurt even though no-one had told him. etc. So i beleive in phsycic links etc.
Ive also had experiences that are only known to me as they are very personal.
BUT programs like buffy and x-files as good programs as they may be can overhype things and distort them.
Newspapers distort things dramatically, and the experiences that people may have had, end up resembling nothing near the truth and people start to be more disbelieving.
Im open minded to all things, and most ill beleive in until they are disproved. The world is an amazing place, anything can happen, and has lol wink

Only when the last tree has died
and the last river has been poisoned
and the last fish has been caught
will we realise that we
cannot eat money.

Cree Indian, 1909


stickmanWorld Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||


Posted:
speaking of the world being an amazing place, what are the thoughts on things like the bermuda triangle?

ASTRO FAERIEBRONZE Member
ummmmmmm.............
724 posts
Location: Rotherham, UK


Posted:
Just that its bloomin weird!

Only when the last tree has died
and the last river has been poisoned
and the last fish has been caught
will we realise that we
cannot eat money.

Cree Indian, 1909


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
Written by: Patrick the Randi Badger!





If it wasn't for the popular media, I might never have known of such skeptics as James Randi, Carl Sagan, Issac Assimov, or Harry Houdini. Or for that matterCSICOP

I had posted some of this earlier, and then deleted it, but people have pm'd me wondering why.

Why is it that the person who started this thread is allowed to call James Randi an ass and a blowhard? Besides him not being here to defend himself, it doesn't address the fact that no one has successfully taken him up on his million dollar challenge. Beyond claiming that its rigged?

I thought that social discussion was about just that, "Discussion". Yet threads like this are put up and we are told its not being meant for debate. Why?






Perhaps, Patrick, it is not a debate because I asked for opinions. For a true debate their needs to be facts on both sides. With many paranormal beliefs it is theory, and so therefore no hardcore facts. Also because it treads on many people's deep beliefs. Because I stated things specifically when I started this thread that you really have not answered nor replied to other than simply posting links.



If you haven't noticed, several forms of skepticism and science have been brought into this thread. But you know what, these people do so in a non-confrontational manner. Others have managed to approach this in a non-confrontational manner. If you can not do so, please do not comment in this thread.



To your list....

I am affiliated with CSICOP, and in fact one of their Senior Research Fellows..Joe Nickell..will be coming out with *another* book about sideshow arts, which will be featuring *ME*. That's right, I worked with him on some of that book. I taught them how to fire eat. I have used their library. I am friends with several of the members and talk with them frequently. I actually get alot of my scientific inspiration from them. Their global home office is actually about an hour from me and I have been there numerous times. One of the other fellows there, Ben Radford, is a friend of mine and I have performed at his parties.



I have met James Randi through a CFI event, and he is an ass. He will disprove anything, and not use "the utmost" science to do so. There are things he has "studied" that he can not prove nor disprove. He has loopholes a herd of elephants could go through on that challenge and so therefore..it is rigged.



Houdini was a skeptic *in some areas*, but he left room for belief in many things. He primarily debunked seances and true defined psychics. He also did not believe in an afterlife at all, which is not skepticism but all out disbelief. I admire him greatly, and as well two of his biggest fans...Penn and Teller.



Isaac Asimov believed in the realm of possibility but wanted undoubted proof.



I asked for personal opinions...not that of every other person in the media in the free world. And these men are skeptics, they are not scientists who have fact to prove otherwise. BIG difference. I know their opinions. I have researched them, and those who are authors, read their works. Please, either contribute YOUR OPINIONS instead of consistently quoting others and linking to others. As the person who started this thread, I have the right to ask this.
EDITED_BY: Pele (1100733075)

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


Posted:
Written by: Patrick the Randi Badger!


My opinion is that I believe in verifiable facts! smile




And my further opinion on the Paranormal is that anyone who joins a group or club can call themselves a Paranormal Investigator.
As requested I will take my Ouija board and go play somewhere else!

ASTRO FAERIEBRONZE Member
ummmmmmm.............
724 posts
Location: Rotherham, UK


Posted:
Well, i would assume that anyone that was to investigate paranormal activity, could technically call themselves a paranormal investigator, wether it is an official organisation or not. Or is this not true??

Only when the last tree has died
and the last river has been poisoned
and the last fish has been caught
will we realise that we
cannot eat money.

Cree Indian, 1909


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
I took Paranormal Psychology at Genesee College with Professor Tim Tomscak.



He is the one who told those who passed the class that we could be called that.



But yeah, anyone could I suppose. But then, anyone can put on a suit and call themselves a professional as well.



Anyone can pick up a set of poi, flail them about and call themselves a fire dancer, or worse, a performer.



Intergrity is what keeps people honest. And I am. If Patrick, who is an instigator, opts to question that about me...again, so be it. Many people have been foiled in these types of attempts. It is up to the people getting into the groups to investigate the group they are getting into and if at least some of what the group does works for them.



And, it is a crapload of fun.



Coming back to the Bermuda Triangle in a bit...I saw a fascinating science show on it a little bit ago!!!



But I have to teach dance now wink

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


nearly_all_goneSILVER Member
Pooh-Bah
1,626 posts
Location: Southampton, United Kingdom


Posted:
Discussing ghosts and the like... we had a conversation the other day about auras and how traces of aura vibration could remain locked within physical objects and redisperse at random.. and be interpreted by human minds as the presence of the person who left them... but this is just an idea we had whilst trying to freak each other out.

Has anyone heard of Old Hag Syndrome (perhaps not the actual name)? Where people wake with sleep paralysis and see an old, hideous woman in the room who walks over to them, kneels on their chest and tried to strangle them whilst they can't move? People get this whilst awake. I was talking to my sister-in-law about it before, she's had it several times.. once the figure was just composed of darkness, and she saw it coming towards her and tried to cry out to her boyfriend, but she couldn't make a noise.

I can see how these mental processes affect superstition, but they're so flippin weird it's hardly suprising.

I just believe that there is a lot of internal processes we don't have a full understanding of, and there are energy emissions from our bodies (through heat, light and sound if nothing else, call them what you will but they maintain the principles of an aura in various ways) and until we have a fuller understanding of how these affect the universe that surrounds us, and our objective interpretations of that experience, we won't be able to comer to a proper conclusion. But I'd like it to be true that these things aren't just mental phenomena, and they have a grounding in something other than glitches in perception.

*hopes this isn't too much like a story as he's trying to contribute something to the discussion*

What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau


PrometheusDiamond In The Rough
459 posts
Location: Richmond, Virginia


Posted:
It's a phenomenon closely related to waking dreams. During REM sleep, your brain becomes very active, but if you begin to wake, and you're still in that dreaming state, it can produce both a visual hallucination (the 'old hag') and a sense of immobility or paralysis. Add to that that your bed is a 'safe haven' since childhood, and being attacked in it, helpless, makes for a very terrifying experience.
I've experienced sleep paralysis, but I never saw an old hag, just felt a prescence. which to me is probably worse than seeing something specific. My mind is too creative in the dark...

Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
Prom..I can turn that last phrase around on you soooooo many ways wink

Sleep paralysis and experiences also effect hospital patients pretty wildly. Along the lines of sleep as well, or lack thereof, many people who burn the midnight oil are prone to "visions" and "experiences" due to a chemical imbalance in the brain brought on by lack of sleep and, more specifically, lack of REM.

Not at all nearly_all_gone. In all honesty I find it absolutely fascinating that you believe in aura's but hope for paranormal.

About the Bermuda triangle. I don't remember all of the details as it was awhile ago that I saw it but several scientists, especially geologists, figure that the "mystery" has been solved by explaining what volcanic fissures which open up under the ocean can do. They did studies which show that the bermuda triangle has some of the most dense numbers of these fissures, which will cause a tremendous amount of methane bubbles to rise, which as we all know effects the boyancy (sp??) of items in the water and cause them to sink, and in some cases, even break or blow up. They tested the theories in hydrodynamic pools in universities and then also in a lake with an outboard motor boat. It was incredible!
Then they explained the whole plane thing as the bubbles burst and release the gasses into the air, which effects the mechanisms/air intake and causes engines to stall. There was also some part of it that effected their dials, so their directions were screwed up.

They tested these theories in plane testing and training areas, and even sent the gas through a couple of old military plane engines to prove it. I don't remember so much of how the plane stuff worked, but it was similar to the boats.

Wreckage was not found because the fissures would beat up the sinking pieces.

The fissures are only that strong sometimes, which is why multitudes of people can pass through the BT without incedent, and others just disappear.

I was sooooo fascinated. Of course, they tested these, geologists found the fissures, but it is still a theory for a few more years until something else disappears down there with scientific gauges on board and they prove it.

It was fascinating. What was paranormal, moves into the realm of science yet again. I didn't lament over this as much as when Spontaneous Human Combustion was prove to be neither spontaneous nor real combustion. frown
wink

Thanks!

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


SpitFireGOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada


Posted:
I actually saw a documentary that presented the Methane Bubble Hypothesis, Pele, and it was quite interesting.

Being a geologist, let me note that the methane gas may not be related to a "volcanic" vent, but can often be related to oil deposits and natural gas. An oil rig in the North Sea was virtually destroyed by such a pocket of methane gas, but there were no volcanic fissures near by.

Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
I recall something that they mentioned that on the show, and about the tanker, but that they felt bcause of the density of them and some other stuff that I didn't quite catch, they felt they were volcanic in nature. But you are correct, they did say those things do happen without it, and that is what spurned them into looking at the gas bubbles as a possibility in the Bermuda Triangle.

So then, since we are on the topic of science to explain "paranormal", what about things that move on their own? I mean, not telekinetically? For generations people have claimed to experience non living material objects moving of their own accord.

What form of science do you feel would apply there? Would it be a physical science or psychology?

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


stickmanWorld Champ Procrastinator
580 posts
Location: ||...lost...||


Posted:
wow, interesting stuff pele.. i never knew about those 'volcanic' emissions...as far as i knew it was still unexplained..

and about those objects moving by their own, i really dont know much about it so i cant really give any scientific explanations or theories on it.. but i do think that it would be a physical science... dont know why exactly but i think that jedi power to move objects by the will of the mind is completely absurd.. then again, its also absurd that they would move on their own account.. one theory i can give (and this is spontaneous thinking) is that there might be a sudden and drastic change in that objects magnetic field and gravitational pull (as all objects have their own gravity) and that they might move for that reason.. but this is just brainstorming and im worn out and my mind is incapable of doing any proper thinking without my vision going blurry.. ubbloco but that amazing jedi power and from that movie with the little girl who can do the same..something with an M, i know that, but cant think of it right now.. i told you my mind is mashed potatoes right now.. hihi.. that is just cr@p.. i think the mind can do amazing things such as telepathy and mind over matter things and transferring energy to a single part of the body, but to move an object simply by wiling it? that goes a bit too far.. for me at least..

i was gonna say something else too.....ummm, oh yea.. i thought of this when reading that post about half dreaming paralysis.. do you think, at pele mostly, but also at everyone else, that astral projection is possible.. and would you consider that paranormal too?

PrometheusDiamond In The Rough
459 posts
Location: Richmond, Virginia


Posted:
Pele, just remember, turn around is fair play....

The volcanic fissures is a fascinating theory, and I'm researching it as soon as possible, but if I remember correctly, many of the survivors also complained about magnetic disruptions which would disrupt their compasses and gyroscopic instruments. Did they touch on that phenomenon at all?

I would consider telekinesis in the realm of the possible. Since scientists estimate that we only use a small portion of our brain power, who knows what using all of it could do? Much of our body processes are recreated in modern industry all the time. For example, we do create a diminutive EM field, what if using more grey matter produced a higher-powered field?

just food for thought

Dance like it hurts; Love like you need money; Work like someone is watching.

Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, when you DO criticize them, you are a mile away, and you have their shoes.


PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
It did talk about the disruption in the instruments, Prometheus, and when they put the theory to test in the planes and boats (mostly the planes) it was found accurate. However, as I said, I don't remember what it was that caused it.

Did you know that some people create a much stronger EM field than others? And that your clothing, when not doused in fabric soften, also does, especially in the dryness of winter.
We were taking EM readings of each other a couple weeks ago. We chose to take off our metal jewelry and stand in the middle of a room. Took the room reading, then placed the gauge near us.

Most people registered from a mere blip to a 1 on the detector. Myself and one other gentleman both registered 3's, which is quite high for mere humans. We both suffer from electro-static shocks very easily and foud that we can hear high, buzzy electrical noises that many others couldn't hear. Not that it means anything other than what I have always said...I have a magnetic personality! wink

So, here is a question that goes along with this and with an investigation I went on last night. It is really important that if you answer both questions though.

1. Can you hear high electrical sounds? Like when the tube on a tv is going, or sometimes lights will do it, occassionally overhead projectors. It is a really high squeal and it hurts.

2. Have you had what you would say are paranormal sightings or investigations?


Here is my other question...do you believe in dowsing rods and pendulums (the kind that you hold) as modes of finding energy and speaking with spirit? It was a huge discussion between myself and another investigator last night, because I do not. There is too much room for human influence for my taste. He does because he feels it needs the bonding of the two energies to (human and not alive) to work.

Thanks!
Pele

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


spiralxveteran
1,376 posts
Location: London, UK


Posted:
Written by: Prometheus

I would consider telekinesis in the realm of the possible. Since scientists estimate that we only use a small portion of our brain power, who knows what using all of it could do? Much of our body processes are recreated in modern industry all the time. For example, we do create a diminutive EM field, what if using more grey matter produced a higher-powered field?



The thing about us using only a small part of our brain isn't true - it's an urban myth. We use pretty much all of our brain all the time, as things like PET scans will show you smile

Dowsing rods are a good example of people remembering the successes and forgetting the failures IMO.

"Moo," said the happy cow.


SpitFireGOLD Member
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
2,723 posts
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada


Posted:
The hypothesis of methane gas messing with plane instruments...I don't recall them touching the issue of the compass readings, but they did do a test with pilots in a flight simulator.

Methane gas has a different density than air, so a pocket of methane would have a different specific pressure than air, I think. I'm relying on rusty science at this point, and what I can recall from the program.

When the simulator hit the pocket of gas, the altimiter showed the planes climbing in altitude, and in fact, the discrepancy in their actual elevation (in the sim) versus what their instruments said when they hit the gas poket was quite high.

Prometheus, you might have a better hunt if you look for methane bubbles and the bermuda triangle.

I don't recall them addressing the compass issue...which ties into the magnetic distruptions.

In the winter, I'm almost always getting shocked when I reach for door handles, and I do hear high pitched electrical noises that others can't hear.

I haven't had obvious paranormal sightings, but Mand and I both find ourselves looking to the door of our bedroom, thinking there is someone standing there, when there is not. (I believe she's writing a reply to this as well.)

Dowsing Rods....hmmm...my tendancy is to say no. Pendulums, I have no experience with them, so I won't answer there.

Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.


MandSILVER Member
Keeper of the Spitfire
2,317 posts
Location: Calgary Canada


Posted:
Written by: spiralx



Dowsing rods are a good example of people remembering the successes and forgetting the failures IMO.




Too true.

Dowsing rods go just a little too far beyond what I believe.



Pele, that stuff about the EM readings is interesting to know.

So in answer to your questions...

Written by:



1. Can you hear high electrical sounds? Like when the tube on a tv is going, or sometimes lights will do it, occassionally overhead projectors. It is a really high squeal and it hurts.



2. Have you had what you would say are paranormal sightings or investigations?






I can answer 'yes' very strongly to both.

1. Fluorescent lights (strip lights) are the worse than normal lights- especially when they're about to go.

Slightly lower than that is the electrical hum at my parents house (and in particular, my bedroom). I don't know why it's just that house, but if I try to go to sleep with anything electrical plugged in it will keep me awake. Just from putting a plug in a socket (eg. a phone charger not connected to anything), the change in pitch is amazing.



2. Off the top of my head (and I could be forgetting a few), I've had at least 7 paranormal occurences. (I can't classify them all as sightings- some involved sound, movement, and touch).



Edit: I forgot about the electric shock bit that Pele talked about.

I also get little shocks from things. They're usually from touching metal objects, but not always. My hand brushed off Kims one day, and we both got a static shock.
EDITED_BY: Mand (1100895644)

Lets steal a spaceship and head for the sun, and shoot the stars with a lemonade ray gun.


PsychoTronicstranger
80 posts
Location: Greece-Samos-Athens


Posted:
Hello to all! Paranormal is metaphysics.Metaphysics mean after physics...Sience untill now has offered much to humanity but science is not complete.There are many things that are about to be explained and millions or billions of others that are going to be explained in future. I do not like the term paranormal.... what is normal?Was it normal the fact of a plane back in 980?I do not think so... It was paranormal.Paranormal is a lunatic, a mad man...Metaphysics is something that is not paranormal and it is going to be explaned.I do not think that we must believe in such things always.There are meny people that take advantage of these things so they can comfuse other people.I prefere to have a quality in my life and be happy and not to keep my mind busy with that kind of stuff... Though they are interesting they cannot be answered by me.What do you think?

"For once there was an unknown land, full of strange flowers and subtle perfumes,
a land of which it is joy of all joys to dream, a land where all things are perfect and poisonous."
"Put out the torches! Hide the moon! Hide the stars!"




PeleBRONZE Member
the henna lady
6,193 posts
Location: WNY, USA


Posted:
Actually, Paranormal is not part of Metaphysics.

Metaphysics is a branch of philosophical studies, especially dealing with ontology (the nature of being), cosmology (studies of the physical universe as a phenomina of time and space) and epistomology (the study of the nature of knowledge). For the most part, Metaphysics are things which can never be explained. The nature of being can not be proven. We can not prove where the universe came from and when. We can not prove the nature of knowledge, but we can theorize and study it all the same. This is Metaphysical.

Paranormal only fits into this either as part of a discussion in the nature of being (ie: do humans have souls? Are they the core of our being?) and when studying the effects of faith on a person. Possibly, also, for those who believe in dimensions and portals and such.

However, many things thought of as Paranormal do not fit into a metaphysical study and so they are seperate but definately complimentive studies.

Normal is defined as conforming to the standard of common type or that which is regular. So Paranormal is an extremely valid term for anything that science has not yet explained and which occurs outside of what is commonly viewed as a part of regular life. Paranormal science can prove, and is usually something that has not been proven yet. As cited earlier in the thread, Spontaneous Human Combustion and The Bermuda Triangle are two of these phenomenon which have been proven scientifically.

I think you are mixing up the two terms.

All definitions come from the Encyclopedia of the Unknown.

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK


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