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UCOF
SILVER Member since Apr 2002

UCOF

Carpal \'Tunnel


Total posts: 15414
Posted:When you are born, do you start living or dying?
If you start living, then when do you start dying?

but, if you start dying, when were you ever alive?


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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:senator kerry explains all to ucof

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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UCOF
SILVER Member since Apr 2002

UCOF

Carpal \'Tunnel


Total posts: 15414
Posted:So when do we start dying?

confused


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Durbs
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001

Durbs

Classically British
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England

Total posts: 5688
Posted:"Since I was born I started to decay" - Brian Molko wink

Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude

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Dom
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK

Total posts: 3009
Posted:The joy of human experience is that we can experience several different emotions and states of being within a single instant.



Living & dying are 'shades of grey' - while our hearts beats parts of us are doing both. Our conciousness grows and fades, our cells divide and die. Parts of your body will keep on growing once your conciousness has faded to non-existance.



It's fun being human smile


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UCOF
SILVER Member since Apr 2002

UCOF

Carpal \'Tunnel


Total posts: 15414
Posted:Sio are you saying that we start dying at conception?

and living at the same time???


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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:you can't be living unless you are dying and you can't start dying until you are alive.

simple umm

this argument relies on you being a strong pessimist.

saying you start dying at birth is like looking at a glass you just filled and saying 'this glass is 0.0001% empty'.


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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UCOF
SILVER Member since Apr 2002

UCOF

Carpal \'Tunnel


Total posts: 15414
Posted:But Cole, you cant have filled the glass if it is 0.0001% empty.

and are you suggesting that being alive and living are the same things?


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ado-p
GOLD Member since May 2004

ado-p

Pirate Ninja
Location: Galway/Ireland

Total posts: 3882
Posted:The Buddhists say

All life is suffering

What ever isnt growing is dying.

I would read that as. Living is growing, growing is approaching death, approaching death is suffering.

So.... when do you stop growing?


Love is the law.

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Tao Star


Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1662
Posted:they're not that same thing at all.
dying people can be living or just being alive. but someone in a coma or something can't be living a life i guess - just being in a state of aliveness.


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:Written by: Unsaturated Carpets Of Freedom

But Cole, you cant have filled the glass if it is 0.0001% empty.



the water starts evaporating as soon as you pour it - just trying to show the bias you need to place in order to see birth as the beginning of death.

Written by: Unsaturated Carpets Of Freedom

and are you suggesting that being alive and living are the same things?



only as far as you are suggesting that getting older and dying are the same things.


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Dentrassi
GOLD Member since Apr 2003

Dentrassi

ZORT!
Location: Brisbane

Total posts: 3044
Posted:apparently we stop growing at about 23ish. then its all downhill.
apart from the nose, chin, ears, wrinkles, and white hair that is - everything else starts deteriorating.

when do you start dying? your body or your mind? its more apparent when the physical side becomes aged.

personally i beleive that as long as you continue to learn, develop, change, and experience - the mind will never grow old.
meditate

id write something more comprehesive, but at present my liver is dying and im in no state to be in this thread!


"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.

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onewheeldave
GOLD Member since Aug 2002

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: sheffield

Total posts: 3252
Posted:Written by: Unsaturated Carpets Of Freedom

When you are born, do you start living or dying?
If you start living, then when do you start dying?

but, if you start dying, when were you ever alive?



Living and dying aren't mutually exclusive.

As you commence living, you also commence dying.


"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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ado-p
GOLD Member since May 2004

ado-p

Pirate Ninja
Location: Galway/Ireland

Total posts: 3882
Posted:Isnt Dualism great smile

Love is the law.

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nearly_all_gone
SILVER Member since Aug 2004

nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton

Total posts: 1626
Posted:Living and dying - the same thing! You can't have one without the other, and (in my opinion) each follows the other. Life and death are very human notions. Survival instinct is universal, because of the nature of the world, but death is a part of life, as life is a part of death.

Beginning is universal, ending is universal - all universals are part of the same thing, and that is existance.


What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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Mistress_Maledicti


Heaven doesn't want me, and Hell is afraid I'll take over
Location: Wolverhampton

Total posts: 192
Posted:Until I've done all the things I want to do with my life, I don't have time to think about dying!

I'll be diving with sharks next weekend so if they come too close with all those big teeth, I might have to start thinking about dying then...or at least having a little panic...


"Abashed, the Devil stood and saw how awful Goodness is"

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The Real Fryed Fish


God's illgitament son
Location: state of confusion

Total posts: 1489
Posted:Well UCOF you need to take dif cultures into consideration. Biologicaly you are slowly dieing, but spiritualy, you are only dieing when you stop learning and enhanceing you spirit. Plus some cultures don't believe you have a spirit for 6 mounths AFTER you are born, so they don't start "liveing" till then........but it's like the band Spiritualized said "Don't ask for time in you life. Ask for life in your time"

p.s. good topic


You can't avoid pain by fencing yourself from it.
Some times you need the help of others more than anything else
But you have to let them close enough to help......
People want to be needed, I found that out too

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Faberg
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

veteran
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Total posts: 1459
Posted:Written by: onewheeldave

Written by: Unsaturated Carpets Of Freedom

When you are born, do you start living or dying?
If you start living, then when do you start dying?

but, if you start dying, when were you ever alive?



Living and dying aren't mutually exclusive.

As you commence living, you also commence dying.



as with the Yin & Yang symbol, the 2 opposites are not completely black or white, just as things in life are not completely black or white, and they cannot exist without each other.

the black, or Yin, contains a white, or Yang, (fisheye) dot,
just as the white, or Yang, contains a black, or Yin, dot.

together they express the interdependence of opposites.


My mind not only wanders, it sometimes leaves completely smile

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Posted:Written by: Faberg
together they express the interdependence of opposites.



And the transcendence of opposites! hug hug


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Domino
SILVER Member since May 2004

UnNatural Scientist - Currently working on a Breville-legged monkey
Location: Bath Uni or Shrewsbury, UK

Total posts: 757
Posted:"Life is a fatal disease and we're all dying of it one day at a time."

On a happier note, Pratchett mentions in one of his books a belief that someone doesn't die untill everyone that knew them has forgotten them, every clock that they have wound has wined down and when every ripple they made in the universe has faded away. I like this idea.


Give me a lever long enough and a place to stand and I can beat the world into submission.

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wouac
GOLD Member since Jul 2004

wouac

Poi-tato
Location: Iceberg 319

Total posts: 183
Posted:as soon as youre born youre old enough to die- John Lennon

philosophically speaking chairs have legs
what I'm really trying to say here is death as we know it truly death or the next stage of birth so really do we ever begin to decay for merely our physical body turns to dust but as the the mind quite possibly it could go on to exhibit extreme potential as pure energy, life itself as it were so I say as soon as youre born you begin to grow and live until youre mind exceeds youre physical capabilities and must discard the body for higher purposes... but then I may have just wondered back into my mushroom patch, no one really knows


It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potato's.

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Puk
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

Puk

Sweet talented nutter
Location: Brisbane Oz

Total posts: 2615
Posted:I was just thinking am i sleeping waiting to wake up from a monmotus dream.

that shrewd and knavish sprite

Called Robin Good Fellow ; are you not he that is frighten of the maidens of the villagery - fairy

I am the merry wander of the night -puk

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nearly_all_gone
SILVER Member since Aug 2004

nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton

Total posts: 1626
Posted:Perhaps we're all at the moment of death, and this is just our life flashing before our eyes.

But probably not. smile


What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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MiG
GOLD Member since Apr 2004

MiG

Self-Flagellation Expert
Location: Bogged at CG

Total posts: 3415
Posted:i read about a good one- we dont truly die until all the memories of our life fade from existance, that while someone is around to remember us, we live on in that memory. so elvis isnt dead, cos he is remembered. neither is jfk, or marylin munroe or a lot of other people, because they are in our memories.

"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie

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roarfire
SILVER Member since Jul 2004

roarfire

comfortably numb
Location: The countryside

Total posts: 2676
Posted:I don't really know this one, physically I believe we start dying at about 18-20, our organs just degenerate and our brain cells just die...Our immune system gets weaker...I don't know actually....>__< -runs away-

But it's a weird concept, that you're dying as soon as you were born...I guess in a way it's true. I think mentally you can control it, whether you choose to just have fun with your life, that's truly living, but if you sit at home in your room..and you're lazy, then you're just aiding to your own waste away


.All things are beautiful if we take the time to look.

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Mags The Jedi
GOLD Member since May 2004

Mags The Jedi

Fool
Location: Cornwall, UK

Total posts: 2020
Posted:How does all this explain people like Iggy Pop, who has clearly been dead since about 1977, yet still manages to move around, do gigs and drink JD?

"I believe the cost of life is Death and we will all pay that in full. Everything else should be a gift. We paid the cover charge of life, we were born."

Bill Hicks, February 1988

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simian


simian

110% MONKEY EVERY TIME ALL THE TIME JUST CANT STOP THE MONKEY
Location: London

Total posts: 3149
Posted:i'm not going to start dying until it's absolutely necessary for the good of my health.

"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:Written by: xabandonedx

I don't really know this one, physically I believe we start dying at about 18-20, our organs just degenerate and our brain cells just die...Our immune system gets weaker...I don't know actually....>__< -runs away-




It's called "planned obsolescence", and there is a good reason for it - things only get done when a deadline is looming. in this case, the "dead"-line is literal and things like reproduction and maybe careers are what get done in the face of it.


-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

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