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master sodium


member
Location: carson city, nevada

Total posts: 536
Posted:so I just got this thing in the mail from the U.S. navy, and on the front one of the only words it has on it besides the address is "NUKE". doesn't make me feel good with this whole war on people that have oil. oops, I mean terrorism. no wait I do mean what I said first.

you can't have a war against terrorism because war IS terrorism.it's not about worshipping fire. its about making the fire want to worship you.

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alterego
BRONZE Member since Jul 2001

alterego

Warm beer is infinitely colder than no beer
Location: Boulder, Co, USA

Total posts: 222
Posted:Unless you are seriously interested in defending your country I wouldn't recommend joining the military.

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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)


Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

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Location: San Diego California

Total posts: 2905
Posted:*High Fives PWB*

An elevator way to go man!!

Look I take the brunt of things becuase I have the remarkable tendoncy to ask for them. True I blow up when I get what I ask for but thats just me. Dun take too overly much offence to it.

I like the idea of public humiliation, a crack on the nekid arse from a kane would definatly deture someone from stealing that candy bar. Just think of what you would want to do to that person who steals your Nutilla ice cream!!


Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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IdubI


HoP Lurker
Location: Medway, Kent, UK

Total posts: 272
Posted:Ray. Just out of curiosity have you read Robert Heinlens 'Starship Troopers' (the film doesn't count) as you caning comment reminds me of how society is set up in that 'world'.

Rather off topic I know but still...

Regards,
Drew.


*Oh, just for a minute,* my bed said.
"Don't lie to me," I grumbled.
*But you're so tired...*

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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)


Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

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Location: San Diego California

Total posts: 2905
Posted:In all honesty, I did not know of a book. I think I need to make an unschedualed trip to a book store.

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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toneman


member


Total posts: 195
Posted:Just a quickie:
watch what you ask for, Ray, because I think you admitted to doing something against the law in a different thread. Aren't laws kinda like orders? Why didn't you, of all people, follow them? Do you pick and choose what you follow?
<<<<<<smoke clears>>>>>>
Ray's just like the rest of us!!! (hyppocrite)
it's so easy to be self rightous, I am guilty myself, occassionaly. if you deny being a hyppocrite, then you should probably examine what you hold true a little more often. self conflict brings self change. Sometimes it helps to have unidentified self conflict brought to light by 3rd parties...

Narrow-minded is a type of person who refuses to acknowledge viable options.

As for locking up innocents to get the bad ones, too, doesn't seem so bad until it's YOU that's locked up, and the peeps on the outside are saying tough.

Just my .02, but we all know the value of pennies these days...

(just so we all know, "you" is being used generically, not singling Ray out!!)

[ 20 June 2002, 03:32: Message edited by: toneman ]


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Dom
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK

Total posts: 3009
Posted:Also with a single order Ray will also break one of the Ten Commandments and one of his religions fundamental tenements: Thou shall not kill. It's all very well to get on a moral high horse, but to go against your morals that easily makes them pretty shallow, surely?

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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)


Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

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Location: San Diego California

Total posts: 2905
Posted:First off Dom the Comandment is Do not Murder, there is a difference.

Toneman, I cant win this. I am imperfection trying to be perfection. It cant happen. I am a hypocrite and so is the rest of the world.

Do I pick and choose what orders I follow? From a certain point of view, yes.

You must sometimes decide what is the lesser of two evils. Sometimes you must choose to do something illeagle to prevent something else from being done. Example, We have whats called two person integrady at the Armory. I and another Marine were opening the armory, he was late (thus unotherized absence IE illeagle), I went into the armory (breaking the two person integridy order) to call him to wake him up to get his butt to the armory so he would not get into trouble.

I could have A. Let the Marine be late and get in trouble possibly even demoted
or I could B. Risk myself getting into trouble and help out my fellow Marine.

You tell me what the right call would have been.

If preventing that Marine form getting into trouble, makes me a hypocrite then so be it.

I am not perfect never said I was. I strive for perfection, I know I cant obtain it but I strive for it none the less.


Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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toneman


member


Total posts: 195
Posted:WoW!
it's okay to break the rules when it suits you? Sounds like a lot of the people making the drug arguement. You decided that, since the good outweighed the bad, you broke the rules you SWORE to uphold, with integrity and honor. At least the drug activists didn't swear not to do something and did it anyways.

Don't get me wrong, I do not necessarily disagree with your actions (hypothetically), however, I wish you would see that you and the activist are not that different. The difference is, the activist isn't claiming one standard and living another. They live life by their rules, not necessarily by what's legal, just like you do, except you SWORE not to break those rules, but do it anyways. THAT is what irks a lot of people.

By your own admission, you would be a victim of your own bullets. You committed an act of treason against the military, regardless of the moral justification, the rules are the rules.

And that's the exact reason you can't be so heavy handed. No one would be left (except for the rich people who seem to wiggle their way out of everything).

Look up empathy and really try it.
Those poor Columbians you want to kill are starving to death, with their only option to survive is to cultivate drugs. They don't have plumbing or clean drinking water or dentists. They barely survive. And you want to kill them for it. Would you not do anything you had to to keep your family from wasting away before your eyes? You do what you need to do today to live and make that choice again tomorrow.

Everything is not so cut and dry.


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Dom
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK

Total posts: 3009
Posted:Point well avoided.

Exodus 20:13 clearly states 'Thou shalt not kill'

Kill, not murder. Also by this reasoning all good Christians who follow the ten commandments, dictated by God himself, should be vegetarians.


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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)


Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

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Location: San Diego California

Total posts: 2905
Posted:Your starting to put words in my mouth Toneman I would advise against it. There is a differance between breaking the rules to save someones career or life vice breaking the rules to get your next fix.

Well you know what I broke the rules yes that is a fact and there is no rationalizing around it. I would in fact have to suffer the consiquesnces. Dont do the crime if you cant do the time right??

How did America become the technological giant that it is? We worked, why then cant your starving Columbians do the same? We didnt get much help from the outside now did we? Nope in fact we still have the majority of Europe that still owes us money for bailing them out. If America can go from a virtually uninhabited continant to what it is today I am sure Columbia can overcome its problems if they work at it. And drugs arnt the answer. We did it without the drug trade so can they!

Ohh another thing Dom... The ten commandments are found in what part of the Bible? The Old Testiment. The Church is no longer called upon to live under the Old Testiment Laws. Jesus simplified things into two Laws 1. Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind, body and streangth. 2. Love your neighbor as yourself.

Now I know you are going to say well how is killing and fighting loving your neighbor? My country man is just as much my neighbor as the guy on the otherside of the ocean. I am putting my life on the line for my Neighbor just as I would want them to do for me. Nobody makes me fight them but if they are gonna shoot at me, dun unto others right? The door swings both ways you can damn me for doing what the other guy who doesnt believe the same way as I do, is doing.


Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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IdubI


HoP Lurker
Location: Medway, Kent, UK

Total posts: 272
Posted:Somewhat off topic I suspect (and please don't take this as a direct attack on your world views just my opinion is all)

I really didn't want to butt into this but,...

I feel the need to point out that tobacco and alcohol are drugs. And I think that America might possibly have had something to do with the world-wide proliferation of these substances, and also please note the effectiveness of the Prohibition of the 1920's, hmm, I see that worked well.

So using the conclusion of the prohibition as an example I can also not see the 'War on Drugs' being terribly effective.

Plus quite a few illegal substances are rather natural and somewhat more ancient that say beer, or whisky.

Next point, oil and fossil fuel use. Innovated by a few disperate groups of people, passed onto the world by the good 'ol U.S of A.

I have otherpoints but cannot be bothered to make them fully.

1, most world markets are now covered, there are very few markets(sorry no thesaurus at hand) left untouched. Most of them different money making ideas (ones large enough to support a country) are already cornered by one group or another.

oh apparently I can be bothered and I only have one point (that's what drugs do to you kids )

Anyway that's about it for the moment.

Laters,
Drew.


*Oh, just for a minute,* my bed said.
"Don't lie to me," I grumbled.
*But you're so tired...*

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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:Hey Ray, speaking of putting words in mouths....
Why did PWB get the high five for something I said? (not being nit-picky, just jokin' 'round )

Hypocritical contradicts. I think we'd be hard pressed to find a single human who is not.
So then let me ask, would you be willing to take the humiliation for the crime you committed?

I would and I think it would work.
I also think my town would be absolutely littered with stockades and that there would be very few left to actually run the town!

[ 20 June 2002, 14:06: Message edited by: Pele ]


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)


Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

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Location: San Diego California

Total posts: 2905
Posted:Well Pele you sounded pissed about the PWB's high 5, *whipes sweat from forehead* I also just figured you wernt the cheating type and I would off a high five to any guy with the gusto and the fortitude to drop trough in an elevator, I know I wouldnt do it hehe, any how.

Ask a guy who robbed a store if he wants to go to jail. Honestly I would and do not want to be punished, for anything I do wrong. It doesnt matter what I want though now does it?

I really dont think the US passes out oil seen as how we buy it from other countries.

Ohh and one more point about the Columbians, I recant what I said, let them sell their drugs and make their profits but dont do it in America, dont bring it here dont route it through America dont come with in 500 miles of America with it. I think the other countries around the world are big enough to handle the drug trade with their own policies. They can take care of themselves.


Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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IdubI


HoP Lurker
Location: Medway, Kent, UK

Total posts: 272
Posted:sorry about oil comment meant to say

the innovation of fossil fuel based combustion engines began in numerous locations (I suspect) however the process was refined and improved on in America, tanks/jeeps etc. for world war one.

This knowledge then allowed the development of personal self propeled vehicles that were relatively cheap to produce and easily available.(Henry Ford - Model T)

This knowledge then was passed to the world. thusly propagating the use of oil throughout the entire world.


*Oh, just for a minute,* my bed said.
"Don't lie to me," I grumbled.
*But you're so tired...*

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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)


Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

Enter a "Title" here:
Location: San Diego California

Total posts: 2905
Posted:Gee sub it would seem that you have your history a bit backwards

The tank was made post WW1 by a German born gunsmith in England, the Jeep was made in Butler Pennsylvainia also post WW1

The Modle T built by Ford was built way before WW1 now you are right however on the fact that the primitive combustion engin that was the base design for our modern internal combustion engin and most of the proppeler driven planes that now fly.

Little History 101 for you.


Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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master sodium


member
Location: carson city, nevada

Total posts: 536
Posted:ok ray, the first prototype tank was manufactured in 1915 by great britan, it was named "little willie". it was very heavy (almost 20 tons) and was designed to cross the nmerous trenches on the battlefield. the first production model was produced in 1916 and shipped to france. they were first seen in action at the battle of the somme on september 15, 1916.

I wont get started on the jeep.


you can't have a war against terrorism because war IS terrorism.it's not about worshipping fire. its about making the fire want to worship you.

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Raymund Phule (Fireproof)


Raymund Phule (Fireproof)

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Location: San Diego California

Total posts: 2905
Posted:Eh we all need a bit of history every now and then.

Some Jarhead last night: "this dumb a$$ thinks hes fireproof"

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