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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:I've already tried doing a search on this topic and couldnt find anything to help. I cant do behind the back weave to save my life, if i smash the back of my legs in one more time i think i might cry! Has anybody got any really clear videos or a totally uncomplicated explanation!!!! Theres not much point in learning any other moves til i get his one sorted! x

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:Written by: Vixen


Theres not much point in learning any other moves til i get his one sorted! x





umm there are lots of other things to learn that are far prettier than btb weaves.



but fair enough cos i had exactly the same attitude recently with 5 ball juggling - get the cascade nice and solid (100+ catches) before learning any other 5b tricks.



so anyway, go to this thread then scroll down until you see a post from a lovely bloke called 'simian'.



there in his post you will find handy links to some threads on starting btb weaves.



if you read them all, i apologise in advance for the link that i put up that doesn't work any more (it was a link to some advice about using a pendulum motion to start off the weave btb).



and when you've sorted it forwards and backwards and can turn, i recommend searching for and learning about waistwraps too (wallplane btb weaves) which are infinitely more beautiful than your regular btb weaves ubbrollsmile





in fact, here is the only thread you should need for waistwraps: glass breaks it down oldskool clubswing style.



good luck and happy spinning weavesmiley





juggle





[edit: for some reason the board doesn't like me linking old threads today frown]

[second edit: malcolm fixes all biggrin hug]

EDITED_BY: coleman (1089131718)


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:Thank you so much!!! Its not that i want to be able to do it to impress or anything its just i read on another thread about people getting carried away and only wanting to be able to do all the harder moves. I want to be able to do this properly and as a result am trying to learn each move one at a time and on every plane etc so i dont have to go back later and learn it. x

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:those are some great reasons smile

i adore clean planes so you'll get no more raised eyebrows from me wink

like i said, i had exactly the same mentality with 5 balls but i was also working lots on 4b tricks at the same time - working on one thing over and over kills me so i have to have a few new things to be trying at any one time.

still, taking the time to really understand the basics can never be overvalued.

hope you can still get to those threads even though the links don't work... ubbrollsmile


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Dunc
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

Dunc

playing the days away
Location: The Middle lands

Total posts: 7263
Posted:The only advice I can offer that I heard when learning but didn't understand till after I learned is that it's exactly the same as infront of you. Your hands move over/under each other the same way but it's behind your back. That probably won't help but I couldn't not post it! (this is coming fromthe guy who took 1 week to nail forwards BTB and 6 months to nail backwards! rolleyes biggrin

Let's relight this forum ubblove

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:here bug - this probably won't help anyone trying to learn but if you want a geek explanation of why btb weaves are *slightly* different to weaves in front of your body, take a look at this.

like i say, it doesn't really help when you're working them out but now you can do them, it gives you a nice confirmation of why they were so bloody hard to learn ubbrollsmile

for btb wevaes, the hand motions are pretty much the same but the timing on the crossover from left side of the body to right side is opposite to how it is in front smile


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Dunc
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

Dunc

playing the days away
Location: The Middle lands

Total posts: 7263
Posted:read it...tried it...don't get it...



read it again, properly without skipping through it ubbangel and yes I get it. Good point! I never noticed...no wonder it took me so long to nail backwards! If only I'd bothered searching properly eh!



Editedness for idiotness rolleyes biggrin

EDITED_BY: Custom Bug (1089049144)


Let's relight this forum ubblove

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native
SILVER Member since Jun 2004

native

sleeping with angels
Location: anaheim CA usa

Total posts: 508
Posted:ok im not shure if they have it on this sit but have you tryed
www.fireninja.com
they also show a lot of other fire poi moves


SLEEP WITH ANGELS muckieha

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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:There isnt poi on there tho... is there?

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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Penguin Sven
SILVER Member since Jun 2004

Penguin Sven

member
Location: Australia,Vic

Total posts: 185
Posted:I can't do reverse behind the back weaves for anythin.

But my cousin gave me some advice and said that I should try leaning forwards slightly when doing btb weave forwards.....Its helps so much.


"glow bugs, to slow to resist eating, to bitter to eat more than one handfull in a sitting" toothpaste for dinner

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Twirly


Twirly

Shoryuken!
Location: Hexham, Newcastle, England

Total posts: 233
Posted:Oooh I only just got this so hopefully I can be of help. Smacking yourself over and over is a real bummer, so what I did was wrap my poi chains up in my hands, so only the wicks and maybe 1 inch of chain could move. With this, you can get the hand movements sorted out without the pain!



The hand movements are exactly the same as regular style weave, so what I did was to try and SLOWLY step through the weave (step forwards, bring hands behind back) and try to keep the same hand motions going. Possibly best to try with socks or very short chains as above.



Once you have your hands flowing nicely, slowly release the chain so it gets longer, just letting it get longer a bit at a time. If it hits you, shorten them again and try again.



Swaying slightly away from the side your poi are spinning (so you look like a little pendulem) on also prevents bruises. You can drop this later, but it helps you to get your hand all the way across your body when your practising.



And as with everything, practise with each hand individually first.



Davy



ps. Vixen's pikture is pretty smile





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kiteman


Flying high!
Location: At the beach.

Total posts: 245
Posted:If it's any help I've just started to learn them. I can do one pass on either side before I hit my legs of face.

I find that if I really exaggerate the left to right movements behind my back I can get the poi past my legs. I just can't keep them in the same plane for long though.

I know the frustration, It's been driving me mad for a couple of days.


If everything seems under control, your not going fast enough!

It's not the size of the wave, it's the length of the ride!

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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:its good to know that its not just me thats struggling!!! im having a little go in the office at work coz im the only person here! haha.

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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kiteman


Flying high!
Location: At the beach.

Total posts: 245
Posted:Got them nailed at last clap

How on earth do you do them forwards though


If everything seems under control, your not going fast enough!

It's not the size of the wave, it's the length of the ride!

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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:haha this is silly but which way is forwards and which way is backwards - i gets abit confuzzled!!!

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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borismcnorris


borismcnorris

professional pedant
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 137
Posted:the direction thing has been argued about on here before. When looking at someone from their left, a forwards btb weave would go clockwise. Or that's what i'd say anyway.

Imagine having a face on the back of you head eek, and then doing a forward weave from that face's point of view. ubbloco

That;s the way i think about it anyway.

Oh, and HOORAY 100 posts!

:shuffles of to change member status:


A warrior always returns to the fray. He never does so out of stubbornness, but because he has noticed a change in the weather - Paulo Coelho

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spiralx


spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 1376
Posted:It's the other way around! A forwards weave is going in the same direction to an onlooker whether or not it's in front or BTB. So if you're on the person's left then a forwards weave is going anti-clockwise in both cases.

Just because you move it BTB it doesn't change the direction the poi are spinning in... in your view simply putting your hands behind your back changes you from forwards to reverse and vice versa... which is confusing and not how most people refer to it.


"Moo," said the happy cow.

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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:*my head hurts*

i think i understand tho - now im confused to which one it is im trying to learn! haha


tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:Written by: spiralx

It's the other way around! A forwards weave is going in the same direction to an onlooker whether or not it's in front or BTB. So if you're on the person's left then a forwards weave is going anti-clockwise in both cases.

Just because you move it BTB it doesn't change the direction the poi are spinning in... in your view simply putting your hands behind your back changes you from forwards to reverse and vice versa... which is confusing and not how most people refer to it.



now see, that is what I always thought, but if you look at the terminology on the poi free lessons area, what you and I would call a forward BTB weave is called reverse there.

And if you look in the "articles/moves" section, you will see that most everyone there says forward BTB weave is way easier than reverse. I thought they were insane until I figured out what they meant by forward BTB is reverse BTB in my terminology.

But if you ask me, since there is no momentum change when going from a reverse weave to putting it behind the back nor do you turn, is should definitely be called a reverse BTB weave.

but whatever...


-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

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spiralx


spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 1376
Posted:I've seen the argument before on here and most people would seem to agree with us... or at least perhaps most people whose opinion I respect wink It's most definitely the most logical way of naming them.

The lessons don't seem to say anything about forwards or backwards at all - although this one

http://www.homeofpoi.com/lessons/poi_lessons.php/poi/25
br>
is of the reverse BTB weave...


"Moo," said the happy cow.

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borismcnorris


borismcnorris

professional pedant
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 137
Posted:Another argument for naming it the way i mentioned above is that the hand movements for the one in the tutorials (that you'd call a reverse btb) are more like the one's for a forward regular weave - ie. the crossing hand comes over the top of the other, rather than underneath as in a reverse weave.

my (other) $0.02 weavesmiley


A warrior always returns to the fray. He never does so out of stubbornness, but because he has noticed a change in the weather - Paulo Coelho

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NOn


activist for HoPper liberation.
Location: ffidrac

Total posts: 1643
Posted:wonderful advice and all, my fundamental problem with BTB at the moment, is that my arms just don't like bending that way!

when spinning btb are your arms further apart or as close as when you do the weaves in front?


Aurinko freedom agreement reached 10th Sept 2006

if it makes no sense that's because it's NOn-sense.

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spiralx


spiralx

veteran
Location: London, UK

Total posts: 1376
Posted:Written by: borismcnorris

Another argument for naming it the way i mentioned above is that the hand movements for the one in the tutorials (that you'd call a reverse btb) are more like the one's for a forward regular weave - ie. the crossing hand comes over the top of the other, rather than underneath as in a reverse weave.

my (other) $0.02 weavesmiley


No they don't smile Each hand still leads under just as it does in front of you smile

The difference is as coleman said in a post he linked to - the transition occurs at a different point in the cycle. But it's still the same hand leading in the same way.


"Moo," said the happy cow.

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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:ah so... you are right about the lessons - I just assumed since my girlfriend said she learned the forward btb from the lessons section (she hasn't been using poi more than a week, and she already has the btb reverse weave totallyaniled!) and I told her it was the reverse and she said that wasn't what HoP said, which is when we started looking at the poi move articles...



this is how rumors get started!!!



(...sorry...)


-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

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SpitFire
GOLD Member since Dec 2002

Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada

Total posts: 2723
Posted:btb forward weave took me for EVER to learn, and I still don't have it cleanly....I'm working on it though.

I can do btb reverse no problem, but forward? Well...it's ugly right now....plane control seems elusive all of a sudden...and I HATE That...

anyway.....practice practice practice, and you'll eventually get it...some people pick it up instantly, and boy it's the most frustrating thing in the world...to watch someone try it, and get it on their second try when you've been trying for months...

OK...rambling...bored and tired. forgive me...*wanders off*


Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.

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Vestergaard


stranger
Location: Aalborg, Denmark

Total posts: 22
Posted:When I learned BTB-weave, I first of all started out whith the backwards, as it's a whole lot easier than forward.

Then I took advantage of two good tips:

1: Lean slightly forwards at first (it helps tremendously)
2: Do kind of a light slalom-twist with your legs to avoid hitting them.

Have fun
Chr


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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:haha now ive got images of slalow skiers spinning poi down mountains! x

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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RavensHeart
SILVER Member since Jun 2004

Member
Location: Somewhere in London, England

Total posts: 21
Posted:Vixen,

Another source is Michal Kahn's book of poi spinning - available in the shop. I've got it, and it's definately in there. Haven't got to that part yet though, but it's def something I'd like to do...


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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:Thank you!!! x

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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Faberg
GOLD Member since Aug 2003

veteran
Location: Dublin, Ireland

Total posts: 1459
Posted:Written by: Vixen

haha now ive got images of slalow skiers spinning poi down mountains! x



i tried doing the 3bt weave with a pair of green electro-glos coming down the piste on a snowboard. got about 4 or 5 full rotations before i fell and nearly broke my neck biggrin

would try it again at the drop of a hat ubbloco


My mind not only wanders, it sometimes leaves completely smile

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Vixen
SILVER Member since Jan 2004

Vixen

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire

Total posts: 3276
Posted:hahaha *round of applause* do u think u win the prize for the most original poi spinning location? x

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

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