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Llamas are larger than frogs.
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Member Since: 28th Feb 2004
Total posts: 319
Posted:Okay, we were having a debate/seminar thing in English the other day, and, as these things usually do, it turned into a political discussion. Now, I usually enjoy these, especially since I always have way too much too say, but then somebody made THE STUPIDEST comment I have ever heard. He was like, "people are always critisizing Bush, but it's not like he's doing anything that really affects your lives" It took all of my self contlol not to start screaming at him! Right- like I don't go to school, need healthcare, like spending time in national parks, need clean air to breathe, or care about all the people dying every day in Iraq. If the president doesn't affect us, then why do we even need one? Luckily, I don't think anyone else agreed with him either. For the most part, my class is a pretty rational bunch, thank god. mad mad mad mad mad mad mad spank

"I know a good deal more than a boiled carrot."
"Fire!" "Where?" "Nowhere, I was just illustrating the misuse of free speech."


Location: nottingham, england. cornwall ...
Member Since: 28th Aug 2003
Total posts: 469
Posted:ouch thats a bit dumb.

theres an advert on uk tv at the mo that makes the point very well that politics does effect everyone and that you cant just go, well the line was 'i dont do politics'

and the guy ends up not being able to talk about anything because, at the end of the day politics affects everthing.

especially if you have a mental defective in charge of the country.

my original signature was tooo long.
this one is shorter

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: sheffield
Member Since: 28th Aug 2002
Total posts: 3252

theres an advert on uk tv at the mo that makes the point very well that politics does effect everyone and that you cant just go, well the line was 'i dont do politics'

I'm pretty much in the 'don't do politics camp', and the reasons behind it are: -

1. I consider what individuals can do to bring about worthwhile change in their own lives and attitudes to be more relevant, both to themselves and the world as a whole, than anything that can be achieved politically.

Most evil in this world is caused by misunderstanding, fear and insecurtiy, much of which is amplified by the politicians to influence the masses. I feel that individuals would do better spending their time learning to see that these insecurities are illusions, rather than politically trying to eliminate them.

2. To change things politically necessitiates, for many, becoming part of the very system they would like to change. In the West, to be successful politically requires money, charisma, being ruthless, willingness to compromise excessively etc, etc. By engaging with and devoting time to it you are effectively supporting it.

3. Many individuals who get heavily into politics are clearly doing it because they have some major chip on their shoulders i.e. political activity for many is a distraction and an excuse to not have to deal with issues within themselves.

It's difficult to explain this attitude in a way that's not going to be misinterpreted, but I have developed a strong belief that, with many things, if you don't like what they're doing, the best way to bring them down isn't to fight them, but for everyone to simply stop engaging with them.

I look at the verbal games played by the suited politicians in the Houses of Parliment and while they obviously do affect what happens in my, and everyone elses lives; I nevertheless feel that I'm not in their world.

The available parties have way more in common they differences, and the kind of parties I may want to support are unlikely to have representatives in the House within my lifetime.

For example, all the major parties support economic growth; I see the pursuit of economic growth, as an end in itself, to be a cause of much the suffering in this culture- it is directly responsible for the pervasive marketing of goods and services that are basically purely for status, that is rife here; as well as the unemployment situation.

Anything that any party with an underlying committment to economic growth could do is, to me, similar to pushing down bumps on a carpet- you may be able to make one bit nice and flat, but the mess will appear elsewhere.

"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."

"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!


Location: London
Member Since: 11th Oct 2002
Total posts: 3149
Posted:that was a fairly political post for someone who doesn't do politics... There's a very large difference between being politically aware and voting.

i broadly agree with everything you say, particularly your points about economic growth as an end to itself.

but i think you're too cynical about the possibilities of our present sytem of government. People in the UK are more liberal, politically aware and better educated with every passing generation (well, i think so anyway. There are those who'd disagree). This has been, and will continue to be, reflected by the political parties who want our votes.

Things do change, often for the better, but always very slowly. But i think that's a strength of our system, not a weakness.

Talking about better representation of views in government: The Liberal Democrats want to introduce Proportional Representation don't they?

"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."


Location: nottingham, england. cornwall ...
Member Since: 28th Aug 2003
Total posts: 469
Posted:yes i do agree with you lightning in a lot of ways.
the point about having to become a part of the system the very thing that is causing the problems is accurate .but sadly thats the way the world we live in works. you have an identity and a number and you always will have this is the way that the world we live in works.

trust me lightning if i thought i could change the world i would, but i really cant see it happening.
nor do i want to be a cog in the big machine. im going to set up commune away from all this [censored] and eat me a lot of peaches.
thats the grand dream a world on your rules, because if you made the rules up the world would be perfect.
by 'your' im not implying you lightning or simian or anyone else but everyone else. if you get me.

the main problem is that life sucks people hate each other and everything comes down to capitalism is not possible without continued growth which makes it inherently unstable. but now were getting to areas i know practically nothing about so i just wont go there.

i think most humans are worse than animals.
you dont see animals screwing each other over for a percentage
(i know simians going to disprove me on this one, percantage of meat gained i suppose but im interested to hear it)

my original signature was tooo long.
this one is shorter

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