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Forums > Social Chat > The Problem with new spinners today...

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Carpal \'Tunnel

Member Since: 17th Apr 2002
Total posts: 15414
Posted:Ive been spinning poi for a good two years now, and I am always more than willing to teach anyone who wants to learn.

Now a bit of background info: Sunbeam, Konsti (troubled badger notjingt to lose) and I (and also another friend) are all at University together.

Here there are many spinners.

The number is growing as well...

however, there is one thing that for some odd reason annoys me (well, not reallys annoys, more like its me being a bit grumpy)


I had been spininng for two years before these dumbfounded contraptions of moves were invented.

I learnt the "moves" in poi as most people do (2 beat/ chase, butterfly, corkscrew, 3 beat, 4, 5, etc) and then i learnt hyperloops.

But nowerdays people are wanting to learn Hyperloops straight away.

But I say NO!

My question to you is:

Is my saying NO! justified?

Should people, when learing this Poi malarky, start with easy moves or go straight into hard technicalised stuff?

Is there even a correct order in which to learn spinning?

*mandoratory suck up to not offend anyone coming up*

This post isnt aimed at ANYONE on here and i dont not mean to cause offence. If you dont like what im saying, then print up a t-shirt and tell the world. I dont care. wink

*mandatory suck up finished*


lovable smart-ass
Location: vineyards, Vienna, Austria
Member Since: 16th Oct 2003
Total posts: 785
Posted:OI ucof smile
i feel that this post is adressed at me. yes im the newbie that skipped everything and went staright to hyperloops. go ahead throw rocks at me.............
ok enough rocks
i opnely admit that the only thing i can do with poi is the 3 beat weave, some alteration of that that i dont know the name of and yes i am getting better at hyperloops (slowly but surely).
i am more of a staff spinner so that is what i spend most of my time practising. im getting better at juggling as well.

i have no time to read the entire thread but i just wanted to confess.

"is optimism in austria just a lack of information?"
-Alfred Dorfer

Tao Star
Tao Star

Location: Bristol
Member Since: 30th May 2003
Total posts: 1662
Posted:this is kind of urelated but kind of related... anyway...

this thought i had this weekend when i was trying to learn to juggle (i've been trying for 12 years and i'm 1/2 way to mills mess with 3 balls rolleyes)

if you give 2 people a set of poi and teach them a weave, then put them in 2 seperate rooms and tell the to get on with it, they will probably come out with something pretty similar at the end of, say, a week. Prabably along the lines of reverse weave, possibly a windmill or something, you get the idea. if you did the same with juggling balls or a staff (bearing in mind that these people have seen stuff but not learnt before) they will probably come out at the end with completely different stuff. This is what happend to me & john - he ended up throwing under his arms and mixing it with contact, while i was trying to thrpw them over the top and play around with those kind of patterns.

the POInt is, poi isn't necessarily easier to learn, it's just that there's more basic principles to get hold of (weaves, butterfly, wraps, stalls etc.) so the progression is very linear to start with until you get them all, then you can experiment, as opposed to juggling and other stuff where you learn one or maybe 2 basic moves and then there's a whole network of tricks to move on to.

maybe we poi spinners get a bit worrried when someone breaks out of this linear progression, because they haven't yet learnt all the other basics. You never seem to hear juggers telling someone that they can't learn one thing because the haven't learnt another thing first.

just a thought anyway...

I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.


Carpal \'Tunnel

Member Since: 17th Apr 2002
Total posts: 15414
Posted:cheers for the replies eeryone...they make great reading.

I appologise if anyone took offence at eth title. It was indeed a huge generalisation.

and Konsti, I explained yesterday to you that you are not the ONLY person. wink


old hand
Location: In a van
Member Since: 30th Jun 2003
Total posts: 1092
Posted:include me in the generalistional black list!!

konsti... want to set up a rebel body?? arghrrrhrhhr mad

passing through, this world still lives.


Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Oxfordshire/Wiltshire
Member Since: 10th Jan 2004
Total posts: 3276
Posted:I agree with alot of people on this thread that basically oldies are getting the hump on about the newbies ability to perform. I know alot of people can be like "o.. this is my hobby - and now its getting all mainstream its crap" but at the end of the day thats going to happen with everything eventually. I havent been spinning that long and i wouldnt even want to say im that good because i know im not. Im slowly picking up the basics and in all fareness this site really has been a great help to me. I live in the middle of knowhere and have been spinning on my own. The only person i know who spins poi is seriously advanced and refuses to teach me because im not good enough!! vicious circle i say... how can i get better if no1 teaches me! Even out of the few moves i have managed to perfect thru practise there will always be one of my mates making me teach them so they can look "cool" and i understand also that that is irritating. But i think its unfair of people to judge just on how well they can perform... it doesnt mean they are going to be any less dedicated or trying!

tHeReS gOoD aNd EvIl iN EaCh InDiViDuAl fIrE, iDeNtIfIeS nEeDs AnD fEeDs OuR dEsIrEs.

Location: Nacogdoches, TX
Member Since: 18th Jun 2003
Total posts: 82
Posted:I've been spinning for about a year now, and I'm really not even close to the level that I should be when it comes to technicalities. My friend just started learning poi as of this week, and I'll be the first to admit that it's irritating when he can do things that I still can't. But I also know that if I had practiced with my poi more then it wouldn't be that way.

My problem is I get distracted and want to experiment with other toys, not just poi. I've recently been playing with fans, which in my opinion are much more fun than poi. So I can understand why newbies would be so excited to broaden their horizons.

I think it's more of a safety issue than anything. More power to the newbies that can handle difficult moves, just don't light anything on fire until you KNOW it's safe. But it's comforting to know that this is becoming a big thing nowadays.

I remember being so disappointed that there weren't any fellow spinners in my area, and now there are at least 2 people that want to learn, and as irritating as it is to see them do complicated things that I still have trouble with, it's also a beautiful thing as long as they're being safe about it.

Alrighty, I'm getting of this soap box!!!

I'm fixing a hole where the rain gets in to stop my mind from wandering....


Location: Oxfordshire
Member Since: 31st May 2006
Total posts: 1237
Posted:/gets the spade out.../

personally I think it's all relative.

start someone on hyperloops and then they'll think 3 beat is hard.

They're all just tricks, the ones you find 'easy' are the ones you've spent time to learn and practice, you find others harder later as they're breaking the muscle memory and 'rules' you've built up.

Start with antispin flowers on a new student, changes their perceptions, you'll see what I mean, and they'll be a different spinner for it and maybe less of a clone wink

Blinded by Hyperlights, please donate generously grin


Macaque of all trades
Location: wombling free...
Member Since: 27th Apr 2005
Total posts: 8735
Posted:maybe someone should try teaching a "newbie" the complicated stuff first as a social experiment? maybe a staff spinner or a juggler, you can explain the reason and see how they develop, I'd offer to be the guinea pig but I can do some of the basic (butterfly, 3 beat etc) already even if I don''t often do poi

A couple of balls short of a full cascade... or maybe a few cards short of a deck... we'll see how this all fans out.


HOP Lord of the Pirate Admiralty
Location: Canterbury, UK
Member Since: 5th Nov 2002
Total posts: 1079
Posted:i think walking before running is the key

X x X x X

Ship off the starboard! sound general quarters! noise and light discipline! man the cannons! GET ME THE RUM!

Master of the Free Hug Program


Location: Sunshine coast, Queensland
Member Since: 17th Aug 2006
Total posts: 51
Posted:So i've been poing for roughly 6 months and have learnt all the basics, butterfly, thread the needle, weave 3 and 5 and behind the back. When at woodford folk festival i started learning hyperloops/tangles/isolations, now my bf the biggest carny on the face of the earth has decided to learn and it was the same with him strait for the hyperloops (not happy jan) and now he can do them better than i can. but i must admit its pretty cool having someone to twirl with constantly.

Living is loving & Loving is Living
Lying is Dying &
Dying can be Lying if you let it...


lapsed spinner
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Member Since: 28th Apr 2004
Total posts: 412
Posted:Personal rant: soapbox

While working in Juggler's Rest, I would often be found in the garden, playing (and frequently failing) with hyperloops. And other such tricks that I had no-one to teach me (except for the videos on HoP and Spherculism of course smile)

Guests would frequently pick up a random set of poi lying around, and try to copy what I was doing. Usually i would ask them if they had ever spun poi before, and if not, show them the weave, butterfly etc, and other such basics.

Most people would understand that you have to walk before you can run, and be glad of the help. However, on many (surprisingly many) occasions, I got the response "but I don't want to learn that, I want to learn that thing that you were doing". Usually said in a very sulky tone.

Grrrrrr mad2

It's one thing if someone who's been spinning a short while gets a bit ambitious, possibly before mastering the basics, but to me at least, it is something different altogether (and infinitely more annoying) if someone who has never even seen poi before is trying to insist that you teach them butterfly hyperloops, which in my case at least, I can't even do properly. Especially when I'm on my time off, and just trying to have a play myself.

:end rant:



EJC Ireland 2006 Organisational Team


Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Cambridge UK
Member Since: 29th Jul 2004
Total posts: 2895
Posted:it always seems to be isolations I get asked about..

Because ActiveAngel sounds like a feminine deodorant

Like sex, I'm much more interesting in real life than online.

'Be the change you want to see in the world around you' - Ghandi

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