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Forums > Social Chat > A thought on gay marriage

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Doc Lightning
GOLD Member since May 2001

Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA

Total posts: 13920
Posted:So I was thinking about pounce's "HOP Wedding" thread and then free-associating (because I'm supposed to be studying).

So suppose that gay marriage becomes legal: what happens to some of the traditions? It's a similar conundrum to what happens if two gay guys go out on a date: who pays? (Generally, we go dutch). But in the absence of traditionally-defined gender roles and traditions, what exactly do we do?

For example, in the absence of a bride, is the wedding party to be only groomsmen? Or can we opt to have groomswomen, too? And which groom picks the Best Man? Does a lesbian wedding get a best man? I'm sure that everyone here can think of another similar issue...

I think it's going to be interesting to watch how this tradition comes together over the next few years, but I predict that there will eventually be some conventions formed.


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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spritie
SILVER Member since Sep 2001

spritie

Pooh-Bah
Location: Galveston, TX, USA

Total posts: 2014
Posted:Why can't you both have a best man or a best woman? I've been to traditional weddings where the groom had a best woman and the bride had a man as her "man" of honor.

I think the wedding party should contain whoever is most dear to you, be it male or female. I also think that is a trend that is happing to regualr marriages anyway.


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mcp
PLATINUM Member since May 2003

mcp

Flying Water Muppet
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom

Total posts: 5276
Posted:I thought George W. %**$ was banning gay marraiges in order to get the conservative vote for his coming re-election campaign?



Haven't there been plenty of like joining ceremonies / vow things to set a precedent anyway? Seems like they do that sort of thing all the time in California... ( But my only experience of this is the british televisual service )



ubbrollsmile


"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade

I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.

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zwitterion
SILVER Member since Jul 2003

zwitterion

member
Location: Iowa, USA

Total posts: 52
Posted:it's funny i was having almost exactly this conversation with a friend about an hour ago... she's a classics student and said something interesting, that while there's been countless societies throughout history that have held homosexuality in respectful (if not high) regard, none that she knows of formalised homosexual relationships in the sense of supporting gay marriages or gay families. so if/when these traditions do develop in our society, it might well be a first in the truest sense of the word.

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SpitFire
GOLD Member since Dec 2002

Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada

Total posts: 2723
Posted:Yeah I've already had someone request to be my best man. *waves to vanize* biggrin

I think we'll follow some of the classical "marriage" traditions, but....alter them to make them fit who we are personally.

But then...I plan on whatever ceremony I have to be hosted by my wonderful friends here in Houston....and it'd be anything but traditional.

biggrin


Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.

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pounce
SILVER Member since Jan 2003

pounce

All the neurotic makings of America's lesser known sweetheart
Location: body in Las Vegas, heart all a...

Total posts: 9831
Posted:ya i think this same problem goes for heterosexual marriages too. i plan on having all women in my bridal party (whenever that's gonna be!!) but that's only cause i want my sisters (don't have any brothers) and my bestest friend (who is also female). but if i wanted to expand it, i have a few male friends who i would want to be in it. and i don't think it should be limited by gender on who you want in your wedding. and like a few people have already said, i've seen the traditions changing as well.

I was always scared with my mother's obsession with the good scissors. It made me wonder if there were evil scissors lurking in the house somewhere.

Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and good with ketchup.

**giggles**

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telic


I don't want a title.


Total posts: 940
Posted:I have a straight male friend who promised I could be his best man.

That's all I really wanted to add. ^^


E pluribus unum, baby.

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Jello


ambiguous
Location: Mpls, MN, USA

Total posts: 646
Posted:yeah, one of my female friends wants me to be in her wedding somehow, don't know if thats still being considered though.



_________________________________
Fuzzy Dice.......................................

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NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:I'm so upset with my President's recent comments on gay marriage I can't even comment on that. mad

As for traditional weddings... I was in the wedding party of a female friend of mine. It was nice because she had two guys and two girls so we kind of "coupled up" around her. It looked cute.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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bender
GOLD Member since Nov 2001

still can't believe it's not butter
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Total posts: 6979
Posted:walk your own path mate! smile
just make sure there's twirling at teh ceremony and a wedding singer that sings that infamous adam sandler song... wink


Laugh Often, Smile Much, Post lolcats Always

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Valura
SILVER Member since Apr 2002

Valura

Mumma Hen
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Total posts: 6391
Posted:arsn and I got married but we had a pagan wedding... no piece of paper or anything, but we dont need one cause our love is enough to proove to anyone that we are together. but when I do have a piece of paper wedding (for my mum) I will make damn sure I have a best man...KEVVIE!! and bridesmaids as well ( ric and jac)... DO what you feel is right.. then it always will be right for you!!





on a bit of a tangent

I approve of gay marriages. Bush and ole mate muscle bound arnie need to pull their fingers out and GET OVER their backwards darkages way of thinking.

This makes me sooo angry.

People are in love. They are in the same kind of body.... SO WHAT? its the soul that recgonises the love...the body is just a shell that is a vechile for the spirit to get around in...and if the president of the united states of america is such a close minded person that he will say such a things as it is "unnatural" then he needs to put in some viagra eye drops and have a long hard look at himself. mad mad mad



ohhhhhhhh that makes me cross. I just stood there dumb founded when I saw him saying that on the telly this morning!

EDITED_BY: Valura (1077845173)


TAJ "boat mummy." VALURA "yes sweetie you went on a boat, was daddy there with you?" TAJ "no, but monkey on boat" VALURA "well then sweetie, Daddy WAS there with you"

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Ade
SILVER Member since Mar 2001

Are we there yet?
Location: australia

Total posts: 1897
Posted:You could do whatever you wanted to do at your own wedding - whatever was important to you, you could draw on one tradition, many traditions, one culture, many cultures, or make up your own smile

Quote:
But in the absence of traditionally-defined gender roles and traditions, what exactly do we do?




Celebrate that we can all be PEOPLE of the world getting on with life without reference to gender roles defined by some creaky old bloke who claimed to have been handed the one true source of the truth or some such nonsense like that ages ago.....
ubbrollsmile


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Doc Lightning
GOLD Member since May 2001

Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA

Total posts: 13920
Posted:NYC, gay marriage is going to be legal. It might take 3 months, it might take 30 years, but it will happen. It's as inevitable as women's sufferage (did I spell that right?) or interracial marriage.

The exact same arguments were used to oppose interracial marriage. We've heard all this before. "Unnatural," "an assault on the institution," etc.

To get back to the subject (since I really didn't want to talk about "Junior"), I guess I'm very much a traditionalist in many ways. In spite of my political views, I conduct and carry myself in a very conservative way. I guess I always wanted to have a traditional wedding, but that's not happening.

So I get to be creative. But one thing is for sure: at my wedding, neither groom will be wearing a dress. ubblol


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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Dentrassi
GOLD Member since Apr 2003

Dentrassi

ZORT!
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Total posts: 3044
Posted:hi all,
although im far too busy to post at all at present, i couldnt miss this opportunity.

this was a cartoon in todays Sydney Morning Herald....


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"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.

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zwitterion
SILVER Member since Jul 2003

zwitterion

member
Location: Iowa, USA

Total posts: 52
Posted:that's 100% awesome

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Silvur
BRONZE Member since Sep 2003

Silvur

sumthin sumin smmnm....
Location: home sweet home, USA

Total posts: 372
Posted:Quote:
Quote:
But in the absence of traditionally-defined gender roles and traditions, what exactly do we do?




Celebrate that we can all be PEOPLE of the world getting on with life without reference to gender roles defined by some creaky old bloke who claimed to have been handed the one true source of the truth or some such nonsense like that ages ago.....
ubbrollsmile



I couldn't have said this any better nyself. For the record, I approve of gay marriage, realizing that love is love regardless of the sorce. So who are we to start dictating who can and cannot express and celebrate their love? What really pisses me off, though, is that you can't adopt a kid if your gay. I think that is the biggest load of crap I've ever heard. mad mad mad


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Rozi
SILVER Member since Jan 2002

100 characters max...
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia

Total posts: 2996
Posted:I was reading an article a couple of weeks ago about a study into how same sex couples who have adopted children arrange their lives and the parenting of the kids. The study showed that male-male couples tend to end up forming a more "traditional" family structure, ie. one partner becomes the breadwinner and the other stays home and looks after the kids. Female-female couples, on the other hand, tend towards a more organic structure, sharing the responsibilities.

Feedback from men who stay home looking after the kids, is that although they find it very rewarding, they feel a loss of status associated with no longer having an income.


It was a day for screaming at inanimate objects.

What this calls for is a special mix of psychology and extreme violence...

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Rouge Dragon
BRONZE Member since Jul 2003

Rouge Dragon

Insert Champagne Here
Location: without class distinction, Aus...

Total posts: 13215
Posted:i dont really know how weddings work (having been to only one myself and that was someone i didnt really know and i was too busy not understanding all the religious mumbo-jumbo)...but perhaps, in same-sex marriages they could have a best man and a best woman each? *shrugs* i dunno. that also leaves out the problem of having friends you want involved but cant gos of convention. or am i talking complete crap? probably spank

also, i agree with same-sex marriages being like interracial marrigaes. now its "OMG SINFUL ARGH YOU ARE ALL DISGUSTING" but in a few years time it will be "what? ur married to someone of the same sex? and thats a problem because???"

a bit like churches and gay priests. which is a bit like marriages and interracial. women priests used to be oh so wrong. but now noone really cares. i think its just unfortunate for current gay people that they will see the next generation with rights that they were denied.

i rambled so, so much didnt i?


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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Tao Star


Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol

Total posts: 1662
Posted:i think like people have been touching on, having a non-traditional wedding is becomming generally much more acceptable these days.

i don't know who i'll end up with, it could be a man or a woman, but i want my wedding to be special and personal, so even if i do end up with a bloke i might not stick to the whole church wedding thing anyway.

i guess one of the main factors in all this is religion, because even if you 8church8 (or whatever) accepts the fact that you are gay it is the religious ceremonies which often pose a problem for same sex couples.

for secualar marriages, people very often do whatever they want and so there are not so many specific ceremonial aspects that will be 'wrong' if you do it your own way.

*phew*


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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pounce
SILVER Member since Jan 2003

pounce

All the neurotic makings of America's lesser known sweetheart
Location: body in Las Vegas, heart all a...

Total posts: 9831
Posted:i say just go to vegas and get married there. when you're married by elvis, all the other stuff about traditional really tends to fall to the wayside. ubblol

I was always scared with my mother's obsession with the good scissors. It made me wonder if there were evil scissors lurking in the house somewhere.

Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and good with ketchup.

**giggles**

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WryTerra


WryTerra

The reason we say "European"
Location: Cheltenham

Total posts: 912
Posted:Frankly my thoughts on this whole subject are that any couple should be allowed any service they want. Regardless of genders, ages, races, traditions.

It's a moment for two people and between two people.


"We have done the impossible and that makes us mighty" - Mal Reynolds

"I can't tell the difference between an electron and a cat" - Brother of a friend

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Doc Lightning
GOLD Member since May 2001

Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA

Total posts: 13920
Posted:Quote:
i say just go to vegas and get married there. when you're married by elvis, all the other stuff about traditional really tends to fall to the wayside. ubblol



She's got a point, yanno... ubblol


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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pounce
SILVER Member since Jan 2003

pounce

All the neurotic makings of America's lesser known sweetheart
Location: body in Las Vegas, heart all a...

Total posts: 9831
Posted:biggrin

I was always scared with my mother's obsession with the good scissors. It made me wonder if there were evil scissors lurking in the house somewhere.

Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and good with ketchup.

**giggles**

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Doc Lightning
GOLD Member since May 2001

Doc Lightning

HOP Mad Doctor
Location: San Francisco, CA, USA

Total posts: 13920
Posted:Ok, I know I didn't want to get into the politics of it, but last night on "Real Time" with Bill Maher, Christine Whitman of all people said that she felt that the government should do civil unions for everyone and define "marriage" as something done in a religious establishment. She said "that way, people can decide for themselves whether gays can get married or not."

In other words, she came down basically strongly in support of gay Marriage. This is a Republican, folks. The future is bright. biggrin


-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella

"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura

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SpitFire
GOLD Member since Dec 2002

Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada

Total posts: 2723
Posted:Oh. My. Word.

I wish I could have seen that!!

There is hope. A small spark, but a spark, none the less.



Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.

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