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Tao Star
Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol
Member Since: 30th May 2003
Total posts: 1662
Posted:what actually is isolation with poi? confused

i do a spot of contact juggling where isolation is where you move your hads round the ball so it looks like your hans are moving but the ball is still and completely frictionless.

as far as i can tell, this can't be what poi isolation is, cos poi aren't clear like contact balls, plus they have a string which would make it pretty hard. all of which leads me to the question - WTF IS POI ISOLATION??????



thank dudes! peace


ps - we really need a 'frustrated' emoticon to demonstrate the aaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrgggghhhhhhhhhh!!! of not being able to master a move.


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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DeepSoulSheep
DeepSoulSheep

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Berlin
Member Since: 25th Sep 2002
Total posts: 2617
Posted:Quote:
aaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrgggghhhhhhhhhh!!!


What, like this one mad

An isolation is basically moving the centre of from the hand up the poi, toward the head. When people talk of them here they generally mean the centre of spin is the middle of the poi chain and the head and hand are orbitting edge of the circle. Chasing each other.

A good example is the buzzsaw where it feels like your moving your hands on a bicycle peddle. Best practiced one hand at a time.

If you want to know about something the best thing to do is search using the search tab. There's loads of threads with hints, tips and variations.... smile


I live in a world of infinite possibilities.

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coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:nice article on isolations by the lovely nx? over on poiinthepark here.



i recommend one hand doing 'shopping bags' and gradually turning them into solid isolations by taking the movement your hand does all the way round in a full circle to isolate the middle of the string/chain.



then work on both hands ubbangel


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Tao Star
Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol
Member Since: 30th May 2003
Total posts: 1662
Posted:thanks guys!

i think mad is a bit too angry for me - i don't look like that very often ubbangel. I guess i'm a bit more ubbcrying than mad but occasionally spank.


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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Tao Star
Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol
Member Since: 30th May 2003
Total posts: 1662
Posted:OMG!!! i think i might have just figured out what i'm doing wrong.

do you mean that the cantre of the poi stays still (i.e. 1/2 way down the handle) not the actual weight on the end?

(i was trying to get my hand to go round the end of the poi which is why i thought my arms weren't long enough!)

i can't wait to get home and practice now!!!!


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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MillenniuM
MillenniuM

Hyperloops suck

Member Since: 10th Jul 2003
Total posts: 595
Posted:Exactly. If you do a "perfect" isolation, halfway down your chain there should be a spot that doesn't swing in a circle at all, but simply rotates around. With ballchain, if you did a perfect isolation, one of the balls would stay perfectly still. Now go practice and be very frustrated for a while! ubblol

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Tao Star
Tao Star

Pooh-Bah
Location: Bristol
Member Since: 30th May 2003
Total posts: 1662
Posted:Quote:
Now go practice and be very frustrated for a while!




that was mean. But sadly true.


I had a dream that my friend had a
strong-bad pop up book,
it was the book of my dreams.

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Stone
Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne
Member Since: 13th Jun 2001
Total posts: 2830
Posted:Ive had some late night thoughts on isolations, which could be way off-track, as I havent got anywhere near perfect isolations.

Anyhow, I thought Id bump this thread on isolations because it asks the direct question What actually is isolation with poi? Which Im not sure has ever been answered. Like there is a lot of information on how to do isolations, but not much about what they actually are.

The answer I suggest is that a poi becomes isolated, at that point in space when the poi is suspended for a fraction of a second (apogee) between a forward and a backwards circle.

This is for outside isolations because it seems more obvious with them, but they shouldnt be any difference to inside ones,

Does that make sense?

smile


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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MikeIcon
MikeIcon

Pooh-Bah
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Member Since: 27th Mar 2003
Total posts: 2109
Posted:In most isolations the poi never becomes suspended because the point of rotation is actually somewhere on the chain, not the head. The only real way to do what you describe, Stone, is to do a toss where you swing the handle over the head and catch it.

An isolation, to me, is simply when the point of rotation moves up the chain. A throw as described above would then be an isolated toss/throw.


Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.

-Me

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SpitFire
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Member Since: 2nd Dec 2002
Total posts: 2723
Posted:Icon's right on this one...if you watch the spin, the poi heads move, as do the hands.
The center of rotation is somewhere along the chain.


Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Unless you're Dom... and do "real" isolations. smile

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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SpitFire
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Member Since: 2nd Dec 2002
Total posts: 2723
Posted:YEs but Dom is super human when it comes to spinning!
wink


Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.

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Dom
Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK
Member Since: 19th Dec 2001
Total posts: 3009
Posted:I was going to post post something here but feel silly now. Oh well. wink



Total, or 'Point' isolations are possible for most of a rotation without throwing - just move your arm instead. Sometime soon I'll have to do that video I've been meaning to do for ages.



Stone - if you're in Melburp do you kow Cass - she can do them. She'll state she can't, but she can. smile


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SpitFire
Mand's Girl....and The Not So Shy One
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Member Since: 2nd Dec 2002
Total posts: 2723
Posted:Sorry, Dom, didn't mean to make you feel silly.

I look forward to seeing the Point Isolations....


Solitude sometimes speaks to you, and you should listen.

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bluecat
bluecat

geek, level 1
Location: everywhere
Member Since: 15th Dec 2002
Total posts: 5300
Posted:mmmm. point isolations are lush.
got two full rounds of flower points when i practised them(as talked about on PIP). now i'm [censored].

but not worth going for unless you've a heeeeeeeeeeeap of time spare, cause theyre way more of a headfuck than normal iso's.

R


Holistic Spinner (I hope)

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nearly_all_gone
nearly_all_gone

Pooh-Bah
Location: Southampton
Member Since: 3rd Aug 2004
Total posts: 1626
Posted:Fookin ell, point isos sound amazing. It never occured to me to throw. *goes outside*

What a wonderful miracle if only we could look through each other's eyes for an instant.
Thoreau

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Cody
Cody

That guy from Reno
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2003
Total posts: 556
Posted:Point Isolation?? is that when the poi head itself is isolated? I was going to start a discussion about what % isolation everyone does, with 100% being "Point" if I'm understanding you guys. When I first heard of Isolations, I thought it was just the poi head and tried to do that. When I discovered it was the chain, it clicked. I usually do 50% isolated weaves, but sometimes I do 75%. I use long chain poi so it's quite the thing to see. When I was working with Orbit and Skunk on isolations at burningman, it appeared to me that they were doing 25% isolations. ??

Your thoughts. biggrin


Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada

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MikeIcon
MikeIcon

Pooh-Bah
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Member Since: 27th Mar 2003
Total posts: 2109
Posted:I personally think 50% isolation is perfect and so thats what I aim for but it all depends on your style and equipment. Longer chains = less isolation because you have to move your arms in a bigger circle to get the same effect. On the other hand, shorter chains means you have to move your arms faster to keep up.

Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.

-Me

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Cody, Skunks isolations are only 25% cuz his chains is so damn long.

And yes, Dom is not only the greatest poi spinner, but the greatest human being of all time. He was ranked third for many years but has recently moved up the polls to #1.

All Hail Dom.

(I only do it cuz it embarasses him so.)


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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Dom
Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK
Member Since: 19th Dec 2001
Total posts: 3009
Posted:Hmmmm, I don't know if I like using percentages or not. It makes sense, but we're going to have to use negatives as well (go work it out).

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MikeIcon
MikeIcon

Pooh-Bah
Location: Philadelphia, PA - USA
Member Since: 27th Mar 2003
Total posts: 2109
Posted:Nah, negatives become positive percentages of extension smile



But I agree. I just dont see much point in putting a value to how isolated something is aside from maybe a difference between regular isolation and point isolation.


Let's turn those old bridges we crossed into ashes.
We'll blaze a new trail,
and torch the rough patches.

-Me

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Cody
Cody

That guy from Reno
Location: Reno, Nevada USA
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2003
Total posts: 556
Posted:NYC, my chains are as long as Skunks, just ask him. It is possible to do a 50% or greater isolation with them. It's pretty extreme though. (I gotta post some videos) biggrin

I don't think negatives would be neccessary. It's the center point from your hands out no matter how your spinning. ubbidea We don't have to stick to the % thing, it was just a way to communicate my question

I just know I put alot more movement into my isolations than I see others doing and I wanted to push the envelope. Come on guys, try it with long poi. biggrin


Cody Canon
Controlled Burn, Reno Nevada

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Stone
Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne
Member Since: 13th Jun 2001
Total posts: 2830
Posted:Thanks everyone for all the helpful responses, and to Tao Star for starting the thread smile

And, the introduction into to the mind boggling world of total point isolations, percentage and negative isolations, reel" isolations and real isolations wink

Anyhow, just so you know where I was coming from, I had this idea about reciprocating motion and isolations.

Reciprocating motion being where large masses oscillate back and forth in harmonomic motion. Which is a bit of a hang-over from me motor biking days when I played with reciprocating motors, and pistons and though about degree before top dead centre, instead of poi.

Dom, I hope to be in Melburp tonight, and will try and catch up with Cass.

Cheers everyone biggrin


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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Glåss
Glåss

The Ministry of Manipulation
Location: Bristol
Member Since: 8th Nov 2001
Total posts: 2523
Posted:Think one arm, its all the same series:
Shoulder circle
Elbow circle
wrist hand finger circles
Isolation (half weigh between handle and centre of mass of the poi)
powered isolations - moving towards the head (much more effort, you're forcing the poi
Head isolations - not seen or done continuously yet but a beat or two is fairly easy for a bit of expression

Stone: if you want more info. Search back through my posts about Isolations. yes quite a lot like the first link you posted.
Normal isolations are not a trick that I like to do with clubs,
explore snakes with clubs to walk in the same medow
Also OT from other thread: stone: what sort of online instructional dance videos were you after, I may be able to help.
smile


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Stone
Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne
Member Since: 13th Jun 2001
Total posts: 2830
Posted:Thanks for the good advice Glass. Ive gone back re-learnt a few things, and Im happy with my poi. I suppose this a bit rhetorical, but you mentioned snakes which got me thinking that with powered isolations you are pushing, so there should a pull isolation as well, like the draw spiral snakes?

The dance stuff was running man/caterpillar type stuff eek But, Ive given up on dance videos, and Im applying club knowledge to my toes and feet, so one day Ill be able to walk on rice paper smile

Cheers


If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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Orbit
Orbit

enthusiast

Member Since: 17th Dec 2003
Total posts: 270
Posted:With weave isolations, I think it's more important to get the chains parallel and have your body move gracefully rather than worry about the % of isolation. Still, with my short chains I think I get pretty close to 50% without changing styles too much.

For point isolations, it definitely helps to have very heavy poi heads...


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zenimus
Member
Location: Montreal, QC
Member Since: 31st Mar 2006
Total posts: 2
Posted:Can someone please post/post a link to an isolation video? I'm trying to pick up isolations as well as isolation weaves and would like an example to study if at all possible...

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Richee
HOP librarian
Location: Prague
Member Since: 15th Jan 2002
Total posts: 1841
Posted:
Ok, flash light,

:R


POI THEO(R)IST

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WaterBoy
newbie

Member Since: 18th May 2006
Total posts: 2
Posted: Written by: Richee



Ok, flash light,

:R



I like that flash presentation of isolations...

But isn't it possible to make the poi head basically stay in one place?


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Sporky
Sporky

addict
Location: Glasgow
Member Since: 25th Jul 2005
Total posts: 663
Posted:Yes. If you have very long arms, very short poi or a trampoline.

Have faith in what you can do and respect for what you can't

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Geeza
Geeza

addict
Location: Leeds
Member Since: 14th May 2006
Total posts: 694
Posted:an image or even better video means a thousand words

http://www.motsplace.com/poi/Isolation.html


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