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pinkbuddha


member
Location: uppsala, sweden

Total posts: 12
Posted:i would like to have my tongue peiced but was wondering if this would cause any problems with fire blowing or eating, like will it affect my ability blow a fine spray? or will the peicing heat up and burn me? (i like to let my eating torches burn a bit in my mouth) pinkbuddha

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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:I researched this, as there are several people I know with oral piercings who would like to do oral fire and here is what the four piercing artists I conferred with told me (and one is a registered nurse).A tongue piercing, because it is through a muscle, is classified as a constant open wound. Unlike flesh piercings, which heal over in time and after a certain amount of time will never close back up (as in: I have had my ears pierced since I was 4. The holes in my ears are now flesh covered on the inside as well and so will never close) muscle piercings will close back up relatively quickly. They do not heal fully while the ring is in place and so are more suseptible to absorbtion, infections, hot and cold, etc. My friend Eric has 3 tongue piercings now and every now and then he forgets to let his drink cool down and will burn himself. When I spoke to the piercing nurse she said that the fuel would be absorbed through the opening, just as it would go into a wound on your skin when trailing and she highly recommended against doing any oral fire arts with mouth piercings at all, including lip rings (of which Eric has 3 of those too!).In my humble opinion, neither is really a necessity but if, knowing what I know about fire breathing (and I do it professionally), I had my heart set on doing both but had to choose one, I would pick the tongue ring over the breathing...in the end it is far less dangerous.
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Hope this helps!------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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.draevon
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

.draevon

member
Location: Androgen

Total posts: 92
Posted:Stae and I both have our tongues pierced and Flint has his labret pierced and we haven't ever run into any problems with fire breathing (either with technique or infections etc). Obviously I wouldn't recommend fire breathing too soon after being pierced, but later on you shouldn't have any problems.None of us do any sort of fire eating though, so I can't really help you with that.raevonof Incendiumwww.incendium.org

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FyreKat


member
Location: Portland, OR USA

Total posts: 3
Posted:PinkBhudda,Never fear! I also have oral piercings and have not had any problems eating or breathing fire. Now eating pizza is another story, darn thing gets in the way quite often!FyreKat >
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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:I have to say that the blatant disregard for health is very irritating and depressing, especially that it is being more than encouraged here. While it is your health, I am the type of person who cares whether or not you become ill. If you read what was written, it is obvious it will have no effect on technique nor have an initial reprocussion, but the fact of holding fuel in your mouth with a tongue ring being the equivalent to mainlining it should really be examined.Just my opinion.------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Auspoiboy


member
Location: Melbourne Australia

Total posts: 219
Posted:Knowing nothing about fire breathing i thought i would just add this little tid bit about piercings.My aunt is a piercest and tattooist and she was telling me that the only hole that eventually won't close over is the nose piercing between the two nostrils (bull ring style). all others will close up within a certain time period.With the tongue all you have to do is rinse with listerine (or any other mouth wash disinfectant) and it will close naturally and you will have the same old tongue.Of course this is only of any interest if you decide you didn't like the piercing.CheersAPB

Good on usGood on us all

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s-p-l-a-t


member
Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia

Total posts: 383
Posted:hmm ... I'm with Pele... for *obvious* reasons... I think getting a tongue piercing and breathing fire fairly regularly is a great way to absorb a superdose of carcinogens, whether it becomes infected or not. I think its great people ask questions here about this stuff... its definitely the intelligent thing to ask if you do not know. Especially health issues. Interesting lysterine comment.. I wonder how that works on a molecular level.

The beautiful thing about learning is that no one can take it away from you.- B.B.King

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Ignis Devoco


member
Location: Prato, Italy

Total posts: 67
Posted:Pinkbuddha.....Your mouth in general is the fastest way for anything to enter your body...Some medications are taken and placed under the tongue to disolve in stead of swollowed because this is the fastest entry to the body....I have spoken with a doctor recently at my annual exam about the hazards of having this stuff in your mouth along with an oral piercing...I myself have my lip pierced.My doctor told me that piercing or not I just should not be putting Lamp oil in my mouth...But...if I am going to do it anyway that piecing or not makes little difference it is all bad, bad, BAD. Just becuase I have a lip ring or a tongue piercing does not mean I am going to die any faster then John Doe who blows fire and does not have any oral piercings. Get the piercing..and then if you are ok with dying a slow horrible death by drowning from petroleum pnemonia then go ahead and blow fire....I guess what I mean is that piercing is not the question...Blowing fire is...It is the most dangerous fire technique there is...the ability to hurt, mame and even kill yourself is great...You probably know all this so I will address the other questions you had...My tounge ring does not heat up from blowing fire and niether of my piercings get in the way of creating the fine mist for blowing....Ewwe.. i just read this whole thing and it sounds like I am getting down on people for Blowing...hmmm...You have probably done all the research you need to do to know blowing is bad....Treat yourself go get the piercings!!!! Donia LoveIgnis Devoco Industrial Fire Circuswww.ignisdevoco.com"Where there is sorrow, I seek the flame."Rumi

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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:So, I did some checking around today on this topic. I wanted to get this straight.I called a few doctor's I know, one is my mom's, one is a high school friend and two are my dr's. (Dr. Keun Oh, PhD in general family practice, Dr. Miguel Santiago, PhD in Ear, Nose and Throat, Dr. Sandy Licatta, PhD in Chiropractics, Dr. Roger Trifthauser,DDS in Orthodontics- not that is is of importance to you but....)All of them first of all gave me the where and whatfore's of firebreathing, let me tell you! I didn't get such reeming's from my mom!!!! But this is what I got from them, if you have gum disease, dental work, missing teeth which have yet to heal fully, etc that fire breathing is an even worse risk than normal due to absorbtion of toxins into the system. Where piercings are concerned, all flesh piercings can heal after time, including cartilidge(sp??) piercings, and the hole will remain open. This takes longer time for cartilidge though. Cartilidge being the flexible, bony feeling stuff in our ears and nose (so bullring piercings fall into this category...with time they WILL heal).Tongues, and all muscles, do not heal so easily, because they are sinewy. Muscles, I was told, will not heal completely while there is an obstruction in them, which is why the disolving stitches are used when sewing them up. It is classified as a permanet open would, which means not necessarily that they are bleeding all the time, but that the membrane which surrounds the obstruction is not flesh, such as with an ear piercing , it is more of a thin layer of protection (like when you first get a cut and the white platelettes coat it over but it isn't healed). This helps to keep some bacteria's and such from entering the wound but it does not close it, which means toxins and things can be absorbed readily through it. Bringing me back to it is like mainlining fuel. None knew how long it would take to suffer poisoning from this since there are so many variables (how long you hold it in your mouth, what fuel you use). What I was told was that if I ****had**** to do such a thing then it is best to do it with no mouth wounds or openings at all.In the Dr's humble opinion. ------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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.draevon
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

.draevon

member
Location: Androgen

Total posts: 92
Posted:Miss Pele,Simply because you do not practise oral fire performance with oral piercings does not make doing so a 'blatant disregard for health'.In the same way, I do not do any form of fire eating or trailing because I do not consider that the risk:effect ratio is high enough (ie. is it spectacular enough to put myself in this type of danger). But my choice not to do these things does not mean that I can go around labeling people who do. Everyone has a level of danger they are happy to go to and that must be respected as a personal decision.I did a lot of research before having my tongue pierced, and everyone I spoke to informed me that tongue piercings heal in around 14 - 21 day. They actually heal faster then most other types of piercings. I was also told that fire breathing with a tongue piercing would be no more dangerous then without. After my personal experience of having my tongue pierced, I would agree with this.raevonof Incendiumwww.incendium.orgOn a side note, most septum piercings ('bullnose') are done through the flesh in front of the cartilage in the nose, not through the cartilage itself.[This message has been edited by Draevon (edited 20 December 2001).]

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protozoa
BRONZE Member since Feb 2001

member
Location: Baltimore, MD USA

Total posts: 148
Posted:I don't think there's any major cause for concern, above the normal range of health and safety issues for people who practice these arts. The "burning yourself" problem is only an issue if you're applying hot stuff directly to the barbell itself..it's metal and it'll conduct heat as quickly as any metal object will. Sometimes if I drink coffee that's hot enough to burn my tongue, it also heats up the barbell and burns the inner parts of the piercing as well. Not pleasant, but certainly no more dangerous than burning any other part of your mouth.I don't know what kind of crazy piercings they have going on up north, but my tongue piercing is nothing like an "open wound". Yeesh.-prote

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Frenzie
BRONZE Member since Jan 2001

member
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia

Total posts: 515
Posted:I think the points raised about the increased risk due to piercings are valid.I do not firebreath and dont want to, this having nothing to do with the fact i have a tongue piercing and a lip ring. Ive never considered this to be a risk, its been there for about 4 years now, but after reading and thinking about this topic, i would have to agree that the risk may be enhanced. Ive seen people with piercings continously have troubles (not myself), but the risk of the wound opening may be slight, but still there.Ultimately it is everyones individual choice whether they do or not, but receiving all possible information about the risks beforehand is the best way to go.If i was in your position and wanted the piercing, i would get it and wait at least 2 months before i started breathing to allow the maximum possible time for the piercing to heal and avoid problems. (starting earlier could lead to infections of the piercing and believe me that aint pretty *thoughts of puss in tongue*)

- Industrial design knows of no article more useful than the milk crate -

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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:AHHHHH...the computer ate my 1st response!What I meant by disregard for health was that very few people were recognising that there are health issues combined with breathing and with piercings of all kinds seperately, let alone combined. It had nothing to do with personal choices. I do all the close proximity fire acts and am not adverse to body art (I have some myself). It is the combination that needed to be looked at. Oh, and Draevon, I know you mean to be polite but can I please remain simply Pele? I'm not that much older than you and being called Ms. or worse...Ma'am by anyone makes me feel soooooo old!
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Prote....the new thing in tongue rings here are hoops that go from the center to over the tip and under. Some even have bangles on them, or chains that go out the nose and attach to other piercings! MMMMM boogie flavored chain! One kid I saw had a forked tongue from one of these being yanked out!
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Nice to see you back, btw.Amen Frenzie, I couldn't agree more.------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Auspoiboy


member
Location: Melbourne Australia

Total posts: 219
Posted:When i said that bull ring peircings don't heal....i just meant that the hole doesn't close over, as it is a cartilidge tingy majingy
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Sorry for the misinterpretation.CheersAPB


Good on usGood on us all

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Cantus
SILVER Member since Jul 2001

Cantus

Tantamount to fatuity
Location: Down the road

Total posts: 15965
Posted:Bull ring = septum

"I'll carry this....It's harder to spill a hat" - Chellybean
"...like a rabbit caught in a lighthouse?" - Chellybean

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Charly


member
Location: Seattle, Washington, USA

Total posts: 68
Posted:Although I do occasionally breathe fire, in general we don't do it much. Too risky.Fire eating, however, is something we do more often, and my stainless steel tongue piercing does get pretty hot when I do long retentions or dragon's breath.The concerns about fuel absorption and the open hole in my tongue are interesting... thanks for mentioning that, Pele. I discussed fire eating with my dentist three years ago, and he didn't say anything about the piercing being an issue as far as an entry point for fuel absorption. Maybe I'll ask him again, though... scary stuff.I've got too many wonderful friends and relatives to die of oral cancer twenty years from now...!~*Charly*~The Cabiriwww.cabiri.org

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pinkbuddha


member
Location: uppsala, sweden

Total posts: 12
Posted:thanks to everyone for the info, i think i'm going to get the peircing. i fully realize the health aspects involved but i think i'm going to cut down on the amount of breathing i do anyway. i eat well and i don't drink or smoke so i guess i have some leeway to abuse my body.pinkbuddhap.s. charly how does the dragon breath work?

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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:PinkBuddhaA dragon breath is a fire eating trick where the performer retains flamey *fumes* of a torch in his or her mouth and then releases them, which looks like a small jet of fire coming from your mouth.I can see where it would heat some metal bits up, but no more than really hot coffe or soup would, right? That is where most of my tongue burns come from anyway, not fire eating!
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------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com[This message has been edited by Pele (edited 21 December 2001).]


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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Frenzie
BRONZE Member since Jan 2001

member
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia

Total posts: 515
Posted:The times ive tried eating, ive taken my barbell out, cause i have a plastic ball on the end (i prefer it to break than my teeth). So im always scared the plastic will melt!!!hehehehe

- Industrial design knows of no article more useful than the milk crate -

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PK_
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

PK_

Lambretta Fanatic


Total posts: 4991
Posted:all pierceings will close up either flesh, cartilage or muscular pierceings..unless u have an inch and a half flesh tunnels in ur ears like mine..as for the topic about tougue pierceings..they are not an open wound and do heal after many months not 2 weeks like body piercers tell you..its months before it is fully healed. and will not cause you any problems with fire breathing..fire eating maybe! but i have a large guage bar though my tongue and have never had any problems...but with a labret pierceing or several like i used to have then you do notice that the paraffin seeps in to the pierceings and can cause u some irritation or a nasty infection.. not happend to me as yet.. but when the cold weather comes here paraffin does bring me out in coldsores around my mouth or if i use lamp oil... thats enuf of that....peace..pk

PK.

"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."

*Francois Couperin.

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Sol


member
Location: Melmac

Total posts: 33
Posted:Yeah, I must agree with vain-ego: I don't think fire breathing with a piercing is more dangerous than without. I happen to have three of them in my tongue and never have had any problems. And I know that the doctors always tell you how risky and pointless it is, but I think that if you treat your piercing properly and look after it well and with respect( not fiddling with it all the time before it's healed, for example), then it can stay with you for a long time without giving you any complications.It should be fine to fire-breath after a few months,but you certainly have to wait until it's properly healed. Go for it and enjoy the experience!

Sol

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Frenzie
BRONZE Member since Jan 2001

member
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia

Total posts: 515
Posted:I guess one of the things that most people seem to have missed about what Pele has said, is not about the short term affects on your piercing, but the long term affects of the fuel perhaps getting absorbed straight into your body through your tongue and the piercing.But as it has been said before, it may not be any more risky than it already is, but then again... it may be. The research that Pele has done seems to suggest that the risk is higher, if not on your immediate health, but perhaps on your health over time. A build up of the chemical in your blood stream cant be healthy, and the carcinogenic properties of fuel can make that even scarier.Decisions on whether to fire breath or not are pretty hard when you really think about what could happen. But hey, arent you more likey to get killed in a donkey accident than have a vending machine fall on you *grin*------------------ - Industrial design knows of no article more useful than the milk crate -http://wickeffect.cjb.net

- Industrial design knows of no article more useful than the milk crate -

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Ignis Devoco


member
Location: Prato, Italy

Total posts: 67
Posted:I don't think any one is missing the point...In my research and speaking with a doctor and more recently a dentist...The mouth in general is the fastest doorway to your body.... Your mouth is a big open wound in you face....to put it more bluntly.I think what people are trying to say that piercing or not, you run the risk of serious effect in the long run....Piercing or not..Fuel in your mouth is BAD. If it can eat away your gums then piercing or not, blowing fire is BAD....I think what people are trying to say is forget about the piercing..it is small beans compared to what you are doing to your body and the risk you take, when you blow fire..so if it is your desire to blow fire take the risk of putting fuel into your body and the risk of blowback into consideration and don't even bother about the piercing...Though the piercing question is a valid and good question I think it has been demonstrated that just because John Doe is blowing fire with a piercing and Doe John is blowing fire with out a piercing..John doe isn't going to die any quicker....Donia LoveIgnis Devoco Industrial Fire Circuswww.ignisdevoco.com"Where there is sorrow, I seek the flame."Rumi

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PK_
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

PK_

Lambretta Fanatic


Total posts: 4991
Posted:Ignis Devoco, i think u explained that well...i totally agree....its the risk of fire breathing with or without a pierceing is a big step.not something to go into likly.. i dont breath an awful lot because of the long term dangers associated with it but its fun and seems to be a better crowd pleaser than any other fire performance such as poi even though poi is so time and effort demanding, allways learning and progressing to be good and look good. and to any one that hasn't done fire breathing before, read up on the facts first before you attempt it"full stomach""drink milk before and during performances""drink a few pints of pure OJ afterwards"i generally use those 3 steps or you can feel a lil ill afterwards which isn't very nice....peace
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Dr Vain-eGo lol


PK.

"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."

*Francois Couperin.

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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:I actually agree with Frenzie in that you aren't reading what I explained as heal and not heal and are still using the more accepted definitions for what I explained. Thanks for the back up Frenzie and Donia, the point is not that it is dangerous, we all know that, it is why compound the danger any more than we must? It is personal choice though. Anyway.....Unhealed does not mean an open wound with blood, rawness and such. It means it is not a solid barrier, but more of a fine, thin easier to penetrate barrier of flesh that forms around the piercing in a tongue. When a tongue, or any other muscle, heals...there is no hole, no rip, no anything.With flesh and cartiledge healed refers to the point at which you can take out the piercing and let it go for sometime, even years, and the hole will still be there. Unhealed is the time up until that point.Using these as a guideline, so long as there is an obstruction, ie a piercing, they do not "heal".And...for the record, the OJ after breathing may only help to cleanse your pallette but actually will increase irritation to your stomach, whether you feel it or not. You are adding acid to a compounded acid (fuel mixed into stomach acid) where you should be using a base to neutralize the acids to keep your stomach lining from ulceration, which fire breathers are prone to. Starchy items, such as bread, crackers, potatoes work well. Mineral type "drug" items like tums or maalox (sp?) work, or even a dairy product which is not really either but acts as a coating and buffer. If none of that appeals to you try a marshmallow. Or if that isn't your thing, try a charcoal caplet, which is a vey strong base used in hospitals and available at any pharmacy over the counter. I have tried them all and I like the charcap when I will be doing a load of breathing, maalox for moderate amounts and I always eat something after any breathing I do, usually something containing bread or potatoes, but not fried foods.------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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