Forums > Videos > Wildfire Entertainment of Oklahoma VIDEOS!

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
Regardless of teh spinning technique in the video, there's a few other really cool things about it that really stand out to me.

1 - the use of zooming out, panning, and just motion photography in general. It really adds some depth to the production rather than looking like people spinning in front of a stationary tripod. In most television productions today you see a lot of this.

2 - the music, but that's just cuz it's a personal favorite of mine

3 - clever editing!

4 - inclusion of everyone. We had several newbies (see the practice section of the vid) who have really been able to bring some exciting new skills to the table in areas such as movement and dance. Check out our moonwalker, breakdancer, bender-backer ( ) and the guy whose style of dance can only be described as "the tornado." People best watch out when these kids get great with the poi too!

5 - FUN. As opposed to the hyperloop video, which was primarily technical/instructional, this one was just us being goofy and having a blast.

Please feel free to point out any positive elements from this video, or anything you would like to see in the future, so we can turn out exceptional stuff for everyone to enjoy!

What hits the fan is not evenly distributed.

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
is your site down dan? i cant get any thing on my screen.

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
its up right now pk (i'm dl'ing as i type).
but its real slow right now...

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
from browser i got 1.56kb/s last night got to 10mb and cut off.
got fresh download tonight, getting 5.60kb/s but times out ever 15 or so minutes. this is on dial up though.

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
you mean MY site is timing out or YOUR server is timing out?

It my site it timing out I could maybe talk trash to the company and force them to not time out people.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
I just checked it, I am getting 120 kb/sec
not to shabby huh? It may be the trans-Atlantic satalite conection you are using. Download took me 3 minutes.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 24th Feb 2003

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jkare:

Both the hyperloop, and the "super staff" were founded by these guys

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The superstaff OK.....but hyperloops??

there may have been a couple of guys down in New Zealand that did them and heaps of other cool moves a long time ago.....and they where training war-skills...a bit more serious than spinnig for the fun of it....

A move is like a country.....you discover it....you dont invent it, cause the move/country is allready there....

I like Fire.. :)

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
And Michaelangelo (or one of those ninja turtles )said "the statue was already there inside the stone, I just chipped away the excess rock". It is still a work of art though.

*edit for spelling*

[ 25. February 2003, 11:53: Message edited by: santanatrue ]

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
As far as I understand traditional poi only has a few basic moves.

So no the hyperloop and a handfull of other moves were not invented in new zealand.

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
lately i feel like we should leave the flaming on the threads. we're all human and capable of misunderstanding each other, and resolving it.

okay i dig all you guys dearly, chain brothers, [edit: and sisters ], i mean that, but this is getting silly. you are almost (not quite) embarassing yourselves, revealing your naivete and vigor. it's sweet . i'm no jet li but if you wrap a weapon, like a sword, with a chain, like a chain whip... you get an airwrap. rope dart masters could walk all over me. and i know hundreds and hundreds of airwraps. and both glass and i _at least_ have known about airwraps for a couple of years. and i know a few new zealanders and kung fu masters that could show us _ALL_ a thing or two. airwraps are nothing more than a natural evolution stemming from a certain level of plane and timing awareness and style. if you don't immediately know at least 50-70 airwraps just from seeing one, then i would say simply practice the basics more and they will fall into place. they should flow, or you are missing some prep work. i've found them a while ago, but i don't lay any claim to them, either. patience, padawans, i'm working hard to share, typin my fingers off, really i am.



sorry, but i felt we all need some perspective...

and glass, you have to admit, the whole "slicing through the knot" thing does have some cool jedi type metaphorical qualities ... hyperloops ARE gordian knots until you figure out the secret... plus i guess you could say _i_ have alexandrian megalomaniacal qualities ...

so bow down before the gordian knot!!
seriously, though, aren't hyperloops actually a mathematics term, describing a vertex created by two intersecting planes? and i think it has some theoretical astrophysics ties, too, right, like with transdimensional cosmic threads or something? okay, yeah, it's a cool name too...

[ 25. February 2003, 20:40: Message edited by: arashi ]

-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
50 to 70? Damn bro, you've been holding out on us....

I can only do fifteen or so

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 24th Feb 2003

quote:

---

Originally posted by arashi:
hyperloops ARE gordian knots until you figure out the secret...

---

okay i can't argue with that man

as an aside - please, please pweeeeeeze list your airwraps!
i've only worked out a total of 10 and i can only do 4 of them

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Posted: 24th Feb 2003
airwraps

#1 from a weave,

air wrap and hyperloop 4, 5, 6, 7 beat

add beats on the inside 2, 4, 6 beat

put in a double arm wrap, or one arm one leg

hyperloop one and air wrap the other at the same time. (usually on accident)

hyperloop outside 2 beats, bring it inside two (or four) beats, then back out to the original side for 2 more beats, then inside for two more (or four) and finally outside to the opposite side for 4 beats to unwrap.

there are variations within this.

also, technicaly, arm and leg wraps that do not recoil are air wraps. wrap on leg and bring it across to unwrap.

#2 Butterflys

one beat inside hyperloop

two beat inside hyperloop then outside and back inside on opposite side to unwrap

two beat then mutiple beats on outside then unwrap

butterfly inside hyperloop and recoil on arm while inside to reverse direction and unwrap them.

These can be done forwards or reverse on teh left or on the right, in front, above the head, or behind the back (btb? not yet for me)

so...what did I leave out Arashi?

PS, shouldn't we be posting this in the hyperloop thread or jedi thread?

Oh yes, and the corkscrew/butterfly hyperloop

and the windmill in front hyperloop (last move on my video)

[ 25. February 2003, 17:02: Message edited by: santanatrue ]

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 25th Feb 2003

quote:

---

Originally posted by santanatrue:
And Michaelangelo (or one of those ninja turtles )said "the statue was already there inside the stone, I just chipped away the excess rock". It is still a work of art though.

*edit for spelling*

---

ofcourse it's a work of art
what I meant was that the moves are there for all of us to discover...michaelangelo statues are not... And I do believe that we are far from the first to explore the wonderfull art of Poi...
+ there is a difference betweeen the laws of physic's and creation that's not following any laws......(I'm not talking bad about your HL's santana.....they are inspiring.... )

What I heard when I was in NZ was that the men started using Poi's to train war-skills but the woman took over and used it for dancing ....and was not only practiced in NZ but samoa ,fiji and other places to.-.....

And my spelling?
English is my second language....so bare with me OK ?

I like Fire.. :)

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
lotsa larfs
the jokes in this thread are still funny after rereading them, multiple times, *ahem* honestly... i think you are all


nuts.


passes around popcorn with "spice" butter
geez, really, it's like this. there is now a WHOLE UNIVERSE of movement opening up right before our eyes. it is here, fremen, it is come. i myself have only seen galaxies, and they are good. every day more and more and more. there are so many ways to go from here that it staggers my mind. so many it scares me, because i know myself, i know i will want, NEED, to do them ALL without effort, and there are so many and to explain, to let you teach yourself, so we can teach each other, i have to start over, to show you more fundamental theory. but take heed, our actions define our universe, and some of our ancestors were wiser than we acknowledge. we only rediscover what the infinite universe has already become, this is now transdimensional theory manifesting in the material plane Santana... been carefully and methodically trying to show you theory that would help you see how to teach yourself, and look how much you've found, with just some well timed theoretical help! the moves are not new tho, i knew where you would go, and you are a bada$$ who works hard! i've just been showing you how to teach yourself the moves, and not laying more than a couple out on a plate for you. isn't it more fun this way?!?! the thing is, guys, there are so many moves, it's unbelieveable really. REALLY. so rather than try to teach you each little one, which, really, i can't do because there are
so
friggin many it would take forever...
plus i can't do them ALL, at all, i'm only human, teaching myself, and i'm no jet li.. REALLY
so what i'd rather do is teach you the theory, cause you need the foundations to be able to dance with it right? sorry if that's a bit maniacal, wanting to show you that way, but it is more fun to discover than to copy. don't you think? even the 7 beat no elbow, i showed one version, and other freaks are finding their fractals, figuring out 9 beats, it's fun! and when i said in the "jedi" we were working on the same move (double handcuff "inside butterfly", another translation misnomer don't get me started and ask cuz it's crazy) at the same time, santana, i meant it... which given the mathematical chances really was cool... coincidence? or the man behind the curtain?

does a fiery jig with an trickster cackle

-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
I like a big ARSE !

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
any particular big arse pk?

so arashi... basically what you're saying is 'i ain't telling you shit'

evidently we all get the basics of hyps and airwraps here or we wouldn't be posting in this thread and most of the spinners that read this are @ the level where we are working out 'new' (meaning 'moves we've never personally seen') stuff for ourselves - bf hyps, corkscrew hyps, inside tangled airwraps, maxi plus hyps...

i personally have given up on bf hyps (i like my strings tight and my planes straight goddamn it!) but they did lead us to some nice corkscrew variations so it wasn't all in vain.
what i was saying (and yeah there are blatently more than 10 airwraps as they fit pretty much anywhere that you can tangle the strings) but i was hoping that someone that knows "hundreds and hundreds of airwraps" might drop a few hints as to how to get on the path to finding the kind of stuff we're not exploring right now... ie. we were goven the basic airwrap and hyperloop to play with and discovered loads from these - are there any other starting points or are you just talking lots of minor variations of these two moves?

and to bring everything slightly back on topic - the video; i love the moonwalk , the goofy clips between the spinning are great (as i liked in rubbish & morning coffee too) and some of those locations were amazing - good work i say for going out and spinning in places that do it justice - in front of my house is my regular spot and on a video, put plainly, its crap. well done the okspinners

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
Warning: this post is aimed at dan only so there for i edit this paragraph in. please no one read this and take offence as this isnt the aim from me, this post is about the video from production view only, no digs at pthers efforts, styles moves and such.

quote:

---

Originally posted by santanatrue:
well pk, what do yo think of the video? Not the most technical, but is it a good start?

---

Well dont bag me dude but you asked.

start, stupid and not funny didnt make me laugh. get in touch with steve o for more pointers.
random tripod shots worked well, totaly like that from production point of view. and nice to see larger people spinning, its totally good source of exercise.
guy doing splits, wish i could do them but the clips too long i got bored.
1.13 all chicks do this was still bored.
1.20 bad transitions, not realy danceing more frantic movements and looks like from the direction change he did he took a shot in the face.
1.36 why? made me bored after seeing a kid take pain. i like to see pain
1.50 sweet waist wraps dude fluid body motions.
2.00 spiders are kewl.
2.06 wtf? sweet.
2.10 fire spinning is too fast, couldnt see what was going on.
Dan your showing more control with your poi and i am liking your doubles.... i'm with cole i like planes and transitions, you dont have our style but its good to see what your doing latly.
3.38 real nice watery shots. nice ending.

dan i dont want this to come accross as picky, you did ask. i loved the vid as a whole and way better than any thing you have done so far, as we spoke about this before you made it, no one else is producing vids like these so much props to you.
i have alot of respect for you mate, what you do on hop and you style and knowledge of poi, though not all to my personal tastes [hyperloops] so credit where its due, nice video and a good start to more better stuff.
as we film new stuff you have vague ideas going on about the next production, bring it on is what i say.
's man.

oh and any arse is a good arse.

[ 26. February 2003, 08:32: Message edited by: 1112 ]

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
Thanks man, I needed that. I think I am starting to understand some of this "video editing thing" and I have a feeling my next one will be better.

Those people in the begining are our students, or "padawan" so to speak. 1:20 his planes do get kind of crazy, but no, he didn't hit himself in the eye . 1:30 yes, it leaves me feeling volated also (deffinitly leaves the floor feeling violated )

Hopefully our teaching will take them to a much high level, as it does reflect on us, how well we can teach. We have practice two night a week for a total of 3 hours. not much time for personal tutoring....but we try.

I looked through all my tapes and the paintball was the only goofy stuff I could find. I am going to hold a party next weekend or something, and get everybody drunk. That should make for some very entertaining footage, knowing the crowd I hang with.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 25th Feb 2003

quote:

---

Originally posted by santanatrue:
I am going to hold a party next weekend or something, and get everybody drunk.

---

may i recommend ringing 'super dave' for ideas for antics. ladders and swimming pools seem to go down well.

knocking out a bear by slapping it would be impressive too.

"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
Jackelero, your spelling is better than mine, and English is my ONLY language. I guess what I realy ment was that the statue is already inside the rock, waiting to be discovered. Just like the hyperloops are already inside the universe, just waiting to be discovered.

Arashi, a truely great teacher educates a mind on HOW to thing, not WHAT to think. If a teacher gives the student a multitude of facts to memorize, when the student encounters something new, they will be unprepared and not know what to do. There are infinit possibilities, so knowing all the possibilities is imposible. The best a teacher can do is teach a student HOW to think, that was when the student encounters a new situation, they can figure out what to do on their own.

and to leave a on a good note....

"I like big butts and I cannot lie, you other brothers can't deny, that when a girl walks in with an ity bitty waist and a round thing in your face you get sprung."

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
arashi i hear the teching thread coming up again dude. dan did you read or partake in that thread? was very technical though very simplistic, as most of us that participate in poi moves here were all pretty much on the same wave length and associating progression through passive knowledge shared amongst us, i've seen style and moves progress from within each and every one of you that i have had pleasure of video or personal sessions and gatherings, the more moves were thinking of now is a good sign of this progression and that were al thinking from within now, learning and sharing, this i very much like and apprechiate seeing. this will take us all to a high level which were all now starting to acknoledge. as drew points out that however much our abilities get better and better so can the videos were all getting to produce, my feelings on dans video are all pretty good as i look at things from either a beginer or a more advanced so to say spinner. dan some times it is good to hear the critics words on any type of subject wether poi or production, i am all up for and criticism towards my self, i had pele tell me what she thought of my col3 entry and whole heartedly agreed with all she had to say, i think thats good for us all, i get sick of all those pats on the back from people saying that was good but you know deep down it was crap and your having a bad day just fucking tell me ok.
any way i will leave it there and get back to my juggling now
gimme a butt one that i can get a hold on, squeeze some ass. but the butt must be attached to a fire spinning staff maiden.

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
I don't think I participated in it. I don't get to read everything that is posted here. But I do participate whenever I can. I'll keep an eye out for it.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
constructive critisism is a good thing. It helps us grow, because it is often very difficult to see our own flaws the same way other people see them. I big part of it is that we cannot see ourselves from an outside perspective (aside from video cameras)

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
Ok I'm not here to get pissy about the replys to our vid, but c'mon PK you were just alil bit to picky in my oppinion.The practice session wasn't supposed to let you think this is the extent of our moves. It was more for letting ppl know what each of us brings to the art.If it was too long for you then sorry but how else are we supposed to make it much shorter without making it to where ppl dont know what the heck we are doin on the vid.It kinda hurt when you said "1.13 all chicks do this was still bored." This kinda made me feel sad at the fact that I consider this to be my signature move, bc nobody else on the troupe can do this move with poi.It kinda also hurt whenever you made the comment about seeing "larger people" in the vid, and that it is a good source of exercise.This comment I believe was alil uncalled for and it could of been put alil better so it wouldnt have to sound so harsh and cruel to the ppl who happened to be on the larger scale.It could of been better put by saying something like "good to see many different types of people enjoying the art". It's kinda rude to assume that the only reason larger people are into poi is just for exercise and to lose weight.Did you ever stop to consider the fact that they might have been doing poi just for the sheer enjoyment and feeling of accomplishment from participating in poi? I know lots of people get that feeling and it shouldn't just be an assumption towards slender people.It should be towards everyone.I'm not here to pick any fights or to start anything, I just hope that in the future you wouldn't be so critical to judge us, bc the rest of us read the posts and dont want to read stuff about how boring we were.We try and stuff and dont wish to have ppl talk about how boring we are and stuff.We practice and do our best to bring new things to poi.It kinda shoots us 'newbies' down.We get a feeling of accomplishment and when we are in our very first vid it kinda hurts when ppl like you say we were boring.Makes me feel like I'm not that good.That my signature move is stupid and that I need to do something else to stand out.But like I said I dont care to start anything with you just for future reference tho could you please refrain from rude or hurtful comments toward us.Maybe do it alil more constructively? Ok I'm done for now I dont want you to think I dont appreciate your oppinion, I just think it would be to the best if your oppinions were alil more helpful and not to just state that we are boring and such.

RISK: Do not follow the common path; Go where there is no path and leave a trail.

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
OK, I'm a little bit ticked right now, but I'll try to be diplomatic about it.

Criticisms of our video by the community have hurt some feelings among our members, myself included. Some misunderstanding is present as to the purpose and content of this video.

This video was not a technical demonstration or anything of that nature. Nor was it a Santana showcase video with some footage of the other troupe members in it so they wouldn't feel left out. The entire video was dedicated to two things - having fun, and giving our newbies a chance to shine as members of a real team.

Some of those newbies have been doing poi for less than a month, and even though they can only do a few moves, they're very proud of them. Comments like "it was boring, it has already been done a thousand times, etc" really sting when you're proud of making what you consider an achievement. Our new members may not post often or have established personalities on the boards, but they do read these posts, and frankly a lot of their excitement has faded since they've received nothing but criticism for their effort. It's because they voiced their concerns to me that I feel I have to write this post.

I'm not saying anyone in this thread is being an ass, but I would like everyone to recognize that this video was made for the entire team - the ones who haven't been into fire very long, the ones who do not know enough tricks to go through an entire burn yet, even the ones who literally picked up the poi the night we filmed. For someone who has only been spinning a few weeks, a spot on a highlight video showing off the strides they've made in that short term really encourages them to excel. 3 of the students in the video literally lit up for the first time a few days before the video was shot. They weren't trying to compete with anyone technically, and I ask that the board please remember that. If anyone wants technical critique, I'm sure they'll ask for it.

The other comment that the troupe took offense to was the "larger people" comment by PK. I'm sorry, but pointing out to someone that they're overweight is downright rude. They deserve an apology or something, because (I do not lie) it brought out some tears.

I know that up until now, the videos advertised in the threads have been primarily demonstrative/technical, so I can see how people may have seen this production as another in the chain of videos trying to outdo each other skillwise. I thought I had made it clear at the outset what the nature of this video was, but I guess I didn't convey that as well as I intended.

What hits the fan is not evenly distributed.

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
He wasn't trying to be rude or insult anybody. I asked him his honest oppinion, and he gave it. Being politicaly correct at all times does not come naturaly to all people (I know it doesn't come naturaly to me), and we should remember to not take life to seriousely, it's not like we are going to get out of it alive. It is sometimes difficult to know what is going to hurt somebody's feelings. I have got myself in trouble many times by not treading lightly enough. Sometimes I write how I realy feel at the time, and sometimes that hits somebody in a bad way. I am not out there writing stuff just to hurt people though. I have a feeling PK wasn't either.

Mistress Aurora you should know that I can do that move also. And probably as far to the ground, but not nearly as beautifuly.

Yes Dio, it wasn't a "santana showcase video" as I would have put in a lot more footage of me if it was. I made it a point to keep my footage down to the bare minimum, so I could give all our students a chance to show the best of what they have developed so far. As to encouraging their growth...I didn't think of it like that, I thought that is what we wre here for...

It was also an experiment, a "dry run" if you will. A test of a new method of developing an entertaining video to spread the arts. I know it could have been better, for a variety of reasons, the most important of which was simply not having enough new, original footage, and and this being our first try. We will continue to grow in our abilities, and the next video will surely be better. That is why I asked PK his opinion, so we could get some perspective and guidance. Don't kill the messanger.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
right i am kinda miffed as to why when i posted the comment about larger people it was taken so harshly, this was not in any way a dig at any one, i am not going to apologise for it as it wasnt intended to be taken that way. as a source of ecercise was not implied as she needs to loose weight either, and not be taken offense by. it stood out to me as a good thing as you dont see many larger folk spin, some one else from a different back ground, i didnt imply that she was a monster did i, i actually felt proud for her if you want me to be honest. just as i am proud of my house mate as she is handicaped in a way that she cant be on her feet for long and cant walk without aid, but she spins and loves it for exercise/ rehabilitation as well as a love for spinning in general. so dont bitch to me about the less fortunate because i dont make personal digs at people for putting effort in to some thing they love.
at the end of it i was asked to post my coments on the video as a whole, if you dont agree with my coments then ok,dont ask me, but you guys choose to share it and ask me... so there you go, i have a lot of respect for what you guys are doing and acomplishing and showing what you guys are doing. newbies or not the people posting in this thread are mostly more advanced than others so take critisism where its given thats what you get for posting vids.
And about being bored by sections of the video, the clips could have been presented in a better mannor, it wasnt a personal attack at any one or their abilities some thing more than just one move would have been better, if you show me a few clips of just one or two moves i wll make the same coment, show me what you can all do before you start taking a coment personally.

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
they were all just first thoughts on the video thats all nothing personal other than towards dan on the editing.
i wish you all, all the love from my heart, i like to see newbe's spin as much as the advanced.
please just do not take any offence to any comments made towards the film as a whole.

Posted: 25th Feb 2003
so, you are saying it might have been better to show each person twirl for a longer time? I don't know if that was realy possible, as some of us can't realy do to many moves right now. But I will keep that in mind for the next one. I kind of felt it would have been worse to show longer clips, as some of our newbies can only do a few moves, and that would be repetitive and boaring. I felt it was better to show the moves that they are currently specializing in learning, because they are more "unique" moves, as opposed to watching a bunch of people do turning three beat weave. I will try and get some better footage for the next one, as they are all learning new things right now. Realy PK, I know you weren't trying to hurt anybody. You know I value your input to our community. I think it was I who specificaly requested your input.

A begining is a delicate time.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!