Forums > Social Chat > is this wrong? advice on women

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
Hi anon...(I know who you are!)Aside from everything else, you should probably take into consideration that you're not a service provider - it's not up to you alone to make these women happy...it's up to them to find happiness within themselves. Perhaps you should reflect upon the type of women you attract - are they generally needy and unhappy? If so, you need to ask yourself why...Some people Need to be Needed...

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Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
*blinx*you said that you dont want to tell them because all you want to do is give them a few moments in time wehre they were with a great guy and had fun.... if they find out that your doing this to them... the last thing they're gonna remember is the "fun" they're gonna remember how yet again they where screwed over by someone they thought they could trust..... in my opinion.... it's wrong... and COULD do way more harm than good.

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
Well - having never been in a similar situation I cant speak from experience...but anyhow...Do you think they would be as happy if they knew you were seeing all these other girls? I normally try to be totally honest with ppl, and that way there is no surprises or wierd expectations.On the other hand, if they have no expectations to exclusive rights to your funky time - then cool - go for it. As long as you are happy with the arrangements.Also - if you are happy to see all these girls, then probly none of them is right for you..as long as you are emotionally honest, and not singing your undying love to em in order to charm their pants off.and BTW - making ppl happy doesnt make you a bad person, unless you are misleading them in other ways... I think the fact that you have to ask, might suggest that at some level you dont think that you are being completely honest...or honest enough - but ask yourself...are these girls seeing other ppl without telling you?good luck - you are in an interesting, and (at least to me) unusual situation.Josh

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
damn flash, must be the moderator thing, or the other thing...yeah, it does kind of seem like i am providing a service. most of them are really well rounded succesful women. all of them are very well educated with degrees in different fields. most of them could have any thing they wanted, material posessions and other men. but for some reason, i intrigue them. i have nothing to offer them except who i am, and to help them look at life a little different.sometimes i cater to womens needs, i guess that is another thing that gets me trapped...well, i am still not sure what to do.

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
you just gotta be honest with yourself and with your women. What do you want from these relationships and what do they want?Personally speaking, if I was under the assumption of exclusivity within a relationship, I would mentally castrate a man if I found he was seeing other people. Women don't generally like being in a harem.

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AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
They dont????shite...and all this time I thought I was the only guy having trouble forming a harem Josh

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
josh, i have read your posts and as always you bring interesting points to the table.i have not mislead any of them. they have all conveniently not asked if i am seeing any one else. i know a few of them do see other people, we actually talk about that and i try to help them with their problems.hart: yes you are right in some aspects. that could get them very pissed, but most of them do not care. they know that i am staying single and doing what i want. i would even venture to bet that if most of them found out they would just say they did not care as long as we still got to see each other.no, i have not put my heart into any of these women. it is not my time to get involved in long relationships. i have not found the one person that is right for me. any ways, dont get too mad at me. i dont like what i am doing sometimes, but i cant tell these people that i do not want to have anything to do with them because they are all very great people...very confusing...

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
yeah flash you are right about that. i have never cheated on any woman that i was exclusive with. that is a big no-no in my book believe it or not. it has been done to me many a times, so to me that is something i would never try.you know a lot of guys probably would not have a problem with this. a lot of guys probably would have had sex with all these women. and a lot of them probably would not have any morale dilemnas with it. but i do.

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
you have got some problems man. i say do what makes you happy. but dont get cocky and dont lie to them, they hate when you do that.

anyone got a light?

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
hey sounds to me like you have it all sorted.dont sweat it man, enjoy it! Josh

Posted: 23rd Oct 2001
Anon, I dont really think its my place to judge your actions as right or wrong.. i can only say that if what you're doing is causing you to ask youself if you're a bad person, and you know that acting honest, that is acting according to your morals will relieve this self doubt, than yu should be open with the women. It can be harmful to your inner well-being if you act against your morals. Unresolved "moral dilemas" can just sometimes fester inside a long time and create a lot of tension and guilt...hmmm.. did that make sense, its kinda late for me... maybe it would be easier to just change your morals i don't know, im a big promoter of inner peace and harmony.. i think the closer you come to that calmness, the more inevitable it will be for you to spread that same energy and happpiness which lasts longer than "a few moments"... i only add this because spreading happiness to others seems to be very important to you, which is a wonderful desire good luck and good night

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
Annon,I've been in a vaguely similar situation. At one stage in my life I was involved with 4 beautiful, funny and completely wonderful women at once. I wasn't 'officially' promised to any of them, but there were ties, there always is. Different people obviously always expect different things from relationships. All of these 4 knew there were others, only one knew specifically everything (I worked with 2 of them!). I wasn't deceiving, I wasn't trying to conquer, I just wasn't providing unasked for details. Everything was going ok for a short time, it was excellent and flattering, but it was obviously teetering on a knife edgeIn the end it all collapsed mainly because it mentally and emotionally exhausted me.Relationships of any scale cost energy, and the more intense a relationship the more energy used. The constant juggling involved in having that many intimate partners added more pressure and guilt (4 ball juggling is complex enough for me, 4 women - insane!). Eventually I couldn't think straight and when I finally decided things had to change I couldn't 'pick' just one, I had to close down completely.That was then, now I'm single, and I look back upon it as a learning experience. My fingers got burnt, but nobody died. Now I spend more time with my friends who mean everything to me, and when it comes to choosing partners, I'm a lot more thoughtful now!You live and learn, you make your own mistakes, and you live with them, so choose them well!

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
'hidden', you said it all. I was going to tell my tale and how it affected me but you hit the nail on the head with every stroke. Only difference is I was only involved with 2 women (I'm not that much of a casanova!).Damn near had a nervous breakdown, never again!

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
Ok, when I read your post, my immediate reaction was "get over yourself!" And, frankly, that is still my reaction. To think that these women cannot survive without you or that you are the only one able to bring them happiness is a little, let's say...snooty. Women are amazing creatures and let me be the first to tell you that this will not continue for long. Women can sense these things. It seems to me that you are hiding behind the guise of trying to be this great provider of happiness when the truth is probably that you enjoy(naturally) being wanted. And, right now you are wanted by all these different women and I think that you don't want it to stop. I doubt very much that these women would want to continue seeing you if they were aware of your antics. And, even if they said they did, they would be hurting inside. Many women have been hurt by men doing essentially the same thing you are doing now and it makes them much less likely to put their whole heart in to future relationships because of the fear that history will repeat itself. If your heart is not in it with these women, you need to let them go find someone who's is. You are wasting their time. At what if the excitement of all these admirers is causing you to miss out on someone who may truly be someone you would settle down with, but you are having so much fun, that she passes you by. Sorry if this sounds harsh, but I am hoping that you don't fall into the category of so many other men in this world. Rethink what you are doing. That is all.(I know who you are and my opinions are nothing personally. I assume you posted anonymously because you wanted an honest response. So, I gave you one)

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
I've been trying to word how I felt about all this, but Cleaopatra just did it so well that I don't have much to add. I don't know who you are, but if you at least worry a bit about all that, it means there is still hope. Staying with someone to please him/her is bullshit. Not bereaking up with someone by fear of hurting the person is nonsense really. Sometimes you do a person a favour leaving him / her before you make this person bitter and cynical.but everyone is different, if you can tell them exactly what you just wrote and if they are still interested in sharing some "timeless" moments (trying to word this romantically still... ) then amen, so be it !!! we are all grown ups and if we are given all necessary information and still decide to go for it, noone can complain later ...cassandra

"I want brown bread... no, that is diesel oil..."
"So I was raised in Europe, where History comes from ..."
"NON !!! La Plume de mon oncle n est pas Bingibangibungi !!!"

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
All good points. The women on this board are sensible!My little additions: Sort it out, it's gonna get really, really messy, very, very soon. If you really are tired of relationships, then keep it platonic. No reason to do anything but. I've been close friends to many girls and kept it 100% platonic and those are some of my most precious friendships. One way of flirting is to make it seem that the person you're flirting with is the only person who makes you happy. This is rearely, if ever, the case. They could live with you only being a friend.Obviously age and situation make things slightly different, but whether you're 14 or 40 it's pretty much similar.Good luck!Dom

We're nothing but the nerds they think we are

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
I'm not going to say if I am speaking from experience or not, but here is what I think:4 relationships = a hell of a lot of time. That's really going to stress you out.Never lie, and never deceive by ommision. If someone doesn't ask, you don't have to tell, but don't avoid the spirit of the question by being all technical ("I never had sexual relations with Monica Lewinski").Be smart: - wrap that wrascal - no exceptions! This is your obligation to them. - avoid needy women/psychos - they will make your life hell, and also make any others involved with you pissed too. - don't mess with other people's lives - make sure they are single or in legitimately open relationships so there is no fallout for anyone else when shit hits the fan. - listen to your instincts - if it seems like a bad idea, it probably is.If they all know (or don't ask what you are doing when you say you are busy tonight and can't hang out with them) and they are all cool with it, then no foul. Good luck on that being the case though. But not wanting to tell them is dangerous. If you are going to play that game, accept the situation.Remember that people get unreasonably attached to good sex. Or perhaps that is a reasonable thing to get attached to, but I think you all know what I mean...And don't brag (too late), or they will find out (they won't like this even if they do know about the other women) and shut you down so fast it'll make your neck snap. [This message has been edited by vanize (edited 25 October 2001).]

-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
Well, much as Cleopatra made some good points about the ways women can be hurt and damaged by men who play, I think she missed an important fact: Women can be playas too. Not all women are all emotions all the time. If these gals are as smart and together as anon says they are, then they can take care of themselves. Men do not have the monopoly on sex drive - it's quite possible anon's lady friends are in it for the same reasons he is. Now, anon, the fact that you're feeling guilty suggests that you're not really being as up front with these women as you should be. When I was once in your shoes (or similar shoes, at least), I thought I had a great little thing going until I realized one of these girls was getting pretty serious about me. I ended up hurting her pretty badly, and I felt like a total jerk... and still do, years later. It was all due to a lack of communication on my part. If she had known I wasn't in it for the long haul, and that furthermore I was seeing other people, she probably would have dumped me long before things reached the stage where they got messy. Moral of the story: As long as you are open and honest and these women know exactly where you stand, just have fun and enjoy it while you can. Be cognizant of the feelings that are at stake, but know that it is not your responsibility to take care of these women.

this little light of minei'm gonna let it shine...

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
I find it very hard to believe that these women are not asking you what you do in the time when you are not with them because they don't care. Women don't ask because: a. They know they may not like what they hear. b. They are worried you will think they are invading your space or being "needy".In any case, they do want to know. And this whole business about avoiding needy women really makes me annoyed. (gggrrrrrrr!) What is the definition of a "needy" woman? Aren't we all looking (unless we've already found them) for someone to share our lives with that we can't live without? That we "need"? I think it is very important to be somewhat dependent on the person you love at the same time as being your own individual. Maybe that is why the divorce rate now is so high. Because nobody really depends and needs anybody else in their lives. So, when the first big problem arises...they can just walk away. Whoooooaaaaa!!! I'm getting carried away. I guess the best advice I can give (after beating my opinions over the heads of everyone on this post) is: There is nothing worse in this world than regret. So make each decision with this in mind. Not just for yourself either. Don't make these women regret meeting you.

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
I agree with alleykat.. Frankly I'm a one woman (at a time) guy. But if you're not, and don't expect them to be, then be safe and have fun. Be honest. If not specifically about the other women, then certainly about the light heartedness about which you're taking the relationship.I like relationships that are mutual. Not parasitic. I don't ever want to be with a woman that needs me. It's much more flattering to be with a woman that doesn't need me but wants me.

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
Ok I'm throwing in my two cents because I can. ~ As a man that was in a multi-partner relationship for a few years I can give you one word of advice. HONESTY!Above all else be honest with them and yourself. It's a lot easier to deal with a truth up front and cope with a small emotional pain then to deal with a lie and have to clean up a HUGE MESS!And gods forbid that ANY of these women know each other (As in they are friends of each other), 'cause then it will REALLY come back to haunt you.My advice to you would be to dissolve all of the relationships back to being friends (As in NOT sleeping with them) and talk to each of the women on a 1 to 1 basis and find out what THEY think the relationship is about. A little work at the beginning is worth the extra effort TRUST ME. As for experience I was "dating" 8 women at once. It was easy because I was up front as to what I was willing to give in a relationship at the time. Funny thing is that the more of them I dated (and all of the women I was with knew each other) the easier it was to be myself with them. So my advice is simple BE HONEST, of and think first "How would I feel if this was being done to me?" before doing anything. ------------------Blessings to all, Peter "In motion, move like a thundering wave. When still, be like a mountain.Rising up, be like a monkey. Land swiftly and lightly like a bird. Be steadylike a rooster on one leg. One's stance is as firm as a pine tree, yetexpresses motion. Spin swiftly and circularly like a wheel. Bend and flexlike a bow. Waft gracefully like a leaf in the wind. Sink like a heavy pieceof metal. Prey like a watchful, gliding eagle. Accelerate like a gusty wind." Wushu Proverb

Blessings to all,
Peter
When you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered Dragon, remember, you do not have to outrun the Dragon ...you just have to outrun the halfling.

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
cleopatra - your definition of needy and mine are definitely different. Sorry if my terminology got you hot under the collar.My definition is closer to NYC's (emotional parasites), and it doesn't exclude the fact that men can be overly needy/psycho too. I just happened to be talking about a situation involving women at the time.On some level, we all need each other. No man is an island. But I was referring to extremes of behavior. People with extreme behavior probably aren't going to work out in a multi-partner situation. [This message has been edited by vanize (edited 25 October 2001).]

-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 25th Oct 2001
Vanize-We are all a little different.
Non-Https Image Link

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 25th Oct 2001
okay everyone. first off thank you for giving me your honest opinions and holding nothing back.i would like to first say that i am not having sex with any of them. they know that i will not because i am not fully commited. i must say that i am a one woman man when i commit, but i cannot commit to someone that i cannot see myself with later on in life.these women are just having fun with me, hang out, talk and enjoying things that we both have in common.maybe some of you think that i am telling these women that they are my girlfriend, or that we are commited, no they understand that i am an adult. and furthermore, isnt that how you find out what you really want to find in a person, by dating various different people?how would i ever know exactly what i wanted in a woman if i did not go out there and experience what all these different wonderful and dynamic women have to offer?but still there is the moral dilemna. they may not even care about it, its true they could just be looking for a good time and a piece of ass themselves. but it does bug me sometimes... well, i am still up in arms about this, but once again i really appreciate all of the input and your forthrightness.

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
PS thank you all for your brute honesty, it is what i expected and wanted. cleopatra, how do you know who i am? thank you for not taking it easy just because of that fact.

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
I kinda resent the fact that this thread has turned a bit into a man bashing session.1) anon never said he was sleeping with them all, in fact he said he wasnt.2) woman can and do act dishonestly in relationships - so ppl sitting on moral high horses about the sexual division of dishonesty please dismount.3) anon says he has told them all that he wants to remain single. In my eyes, unless they ask directly for details, thats all he should be obliged to disclose. Do you really expect him to drag each of these girls through *all* the details of all his other relationships? I certainly dont drag my current gf through the details of my past relationships, and I think this is a similar situation. If they ask, tell them - but I dont think this has even come into question.4) I think some of the women who have answered really havent read what he has typed about his situation, and are now trying really hard to fit him into the male pig stereotype, when realistically - he has demonstrated that he's actually quite sensitive.Also - bear in mind - these girls are coming onto him, hes not out there scheming to steel some naieve little girls virginity.Sure there are nasty guys. lots of them. but please read whats being said before you jump to conclusions.Josh

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
ROTFL.bloody hell anon, couldnt you wait for me to have my rant?huh?now I just look silly.oh well...certainly isnt the first time.Josh

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 24th Oct 2001
oops sorry,you know you are a bit right though. i do think that a lot of the women have fit me into to the pig stereo type when as you said they are coming on to me. i am just being myself, having fun above all else, and that is what they seem to like...i used to be the guy that always finished last, but i am still very nice...

Posted: 25th Oct 2001
Ew. Josh, I must say I think your rant was rather uncalled for. First of all, very few women even responded to anon's post at all, and not once did any of them resort to name-calling. The closest I saw anyone come to "man-bashing" was when cleo said: "Many women have been hurt by men doing essentially the same thing you are doing now." Which isn't a bash, or even an over-generalization; it's true. Many men have been hurt by it too, but that wasn't the question. Meanwhile, I did see the phrase "needy women/psychos," and all kinds of assumptions that women are not emotionally strong enough to handle a casual relationship; comments like that smack of sexism.And as for folks trying to squeeze him into some "male pig stereotype" - he asked for it. His description of himself sounds just like a stereotype, but by and large folks responded to him as an individual. Imagine for just a moment what the reaction would have been had a woman posted the same question. Perhaps I'm being cynical, but I doubt that she would have been responded to so sympathetically, and I would bet that the word "slut" would have been tossed around with abandon. I could be wrong. I hope I'm wrong. All I'm saying is that I find it very hard to stomach the laments of the "nice guys," while women continue to be oppressed by societal ideas about their emotional instability. Not to mention all the other nasty bull**** that happens to women every day. I don't mean to flame you, Josh, you've made some good points on other threads; if I had seen any actual man-bashing on this thread I would have been with you all the way. But I didn't, and somebody has to speak up for the sisters or else it's never going to get any better. peace,alleykat------------------this little light of minei'm gonna let it shine...

this little light of minei'm gonna let it shine...

AnonymousPLATINUM Member

Posted: 25th Oct 2001
no offense to anyone is intended by the following so having said that...i find this (thread not anon's situation) kind of funny, mainly because of the things i've heard about myself from when i used to know lots of people.My main thing is just to befriend the people i meet and offer that up as a place they can go if they need help or want to chill or something. I had a friend tell me the other day that many people in school thought i was unbelievably lucky with women, because i have a flirtacious nature and since 9/10ths of my friends were female. It was common for girls to come up give me a hug/kiss and maybe even hang on me for the span of the conversation. I didn't think anything of this cause it never went beyond that with most of them. I was and still am good friends with most of them. I never slept with any of them, and unless the relationship became more commited never made out with them.I did have one or two times with new people to the group that it got fuzzy and i had to talk to them, and they were kewl with that. One led me to a lengthly relationship. But for the most part i was just there to be a friend and not much more. I, of course, had to be less friendly depending on who I was dating because some didn't realize the platonic nature of it, but for the most part it was all good. I don't think I'm all that or anything, personally i think i'm weird, to skinny, and not that entertaining, but to each his own. I'm also not saying that i'm the only one that could provide the same friendship.****Anyways... anon.. as long as they are clear that you aren't committing anything but friendship to them you are okay imho, noone has a right to get pissed off that you have more friends than just them.and i personally hate that women are called sluts for carrying themselves in the same manner that makes a male a "stud" its BSand i'm out (go ahead get upset and say i'm bragging all u want, i was just trying to help and if u don't like that sorry)