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Altera
SILVER Member since Nov 2002

member
Location: Sydney

Total posts: 38
Posted:hey hey twirlers
mmmmmmm.... just recently i have tried throwing my stick in mid figure of 8 (if you understand me) and decided it works best if you do th throws either side of you as it gives you a few extra spins on the side depending on the throw..... this is all good but i was wondering if you could throw it over your head and catch it with the other hand or something
i was wondering what you people thought of that?


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simian


simian

110% MONKEY EVERY TIME ALL THE TIME JUST CANT STOP THE MONKEY
Location: London

Total posts: 3149
Posted:I did that (throw from in front, catch behind) a couple of months ago entirely by accident. I've tried to reproduce it a few times since then without much success.

It's not that its particularly tricky to do, its just that practicing it means you're going to smack yourself repeatedly around the head with a big flying metal pole. Which is never very nice, and can often leave you looking like this or this .

The Bovrilmonkey can do it pretty well though, if memory serves. Maybe he'll drop by with a handy hint or two.

A couple of little things from me, (bearing in mind I can't actually do the goddamn move )
You don't have to throw very high to get the staff over you. The centre of the staff only has to reach slightly above shoulder height. When it goes past your head it should be at an angle of about forty five degrees so it misses your head and shoulder.
Also its easier to move yourself under the staff, rather than throwing the staff behind you, if you see what I mean. But doing it the hard way would look cooler.
And if you are going to practice it, then I suggest protective headgear

(Oh, this is all assuming that you're throwing from in front to behind you while spinning in the wall plane, instead of from your left side to your right while spinning in the...um...the one that isn't the wall plane)


"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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TheBovrilMonkey
SILVER Member since Sep 2001

TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England

Total posts: 2629
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Simian:

The Bovrilmonkey can do it pretty well though, if memory serves. Maybe he'll drop by with a handy hint or two.
That's a bit of an exaggeration, but I'm going to use it as a license to throw in some stuff.

To start with, until recently, the only staff spinning I did was with 1 arm, because the other was in a cast. I learnt a few throws to add in a few extra revolutions now and then when I ran out of fingers to spin through.

I did manage a few throws from the figure of eight that moved the staff clean across the body, either from side to side or from back to front (I never could catch the damn thing behind me), and what Simian says is pretty much spot on - you don't need to throw the staff very high, just as long as it's well timed and is horizontal when it's directly over your head.

It's also easier to move slightly, stepping in the opposite direction of the staff's movement (if you're throwing it to your right, then step left etc..), to make sure it clears your body ready for the catch.
It also means that you can get away with throwing the staff directly upwards, and step under it, rather than trying to the and angle of the throw perfect.
Moving will also give you a bit more time to turn if you're planning to do that while the staff is still in the air too.

To start off, it's probably easier (and safer on your head) if you don't let go of the staff for now, just pass it off to your other hand above your head so you're certain what movements you and the staff need to be making, then start introducing the throw between the hands and gradually work at throwing the staff further and further.

Oh, and it should be pretty obvious, but I thought I'd mention it anyway - go very, very slowly

Also, as far as I'm aware, the plane in which the staff (or poi) spin to the side of you is called the side plane


But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

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Altera
SILVER Member since Nov 2002

member
Location: Sydney

Total posts: 38
Posted:yeah thanks for that...
im starting to get the hang of in now but am suffering from concussion!!! well not that bad but i have some nasty bruises..... but now im thinkin maybe if you twist your body 180 degrees as wel you could create some sort of double rotation!!
what do you think of that?


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musashii


musashii

starring Skippy the green llama
Location: Seattle, WA

Total posts: 1148
Posted:tite, nice idea..throw from figure 8, spin 180 n catch with the same hand..* commences tring now * Been playing w these two, the timing izza so critical..

First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica

" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."

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i8beefy2
GOLD Member since Mar 2003

i8beefy2

addict
Location: Ohio, USA

Total posts: 674
Posted:The overhead toss is pretty easy once you get enough practice (and bruises) in. I find it my easiest toss... though I can only go from left to right, not right to left yet... Guess I should practice that...

As for the spinning 180 and catching with the same hand... I've pulled this off a few times a long time ago when I first started learning tosses. I stopped because I was dropping my staff so much. The hardest part for me was keeping my eye on the staff as I turned my body (and orientation) 180 degrees... I'd always lose track of which way the staff was going and instinctively try and grab it as if it was spinning the opposite direction.

Never the less you've peeked my interest... off to play with fire!


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Charles
BRONZE Member since Jun 2001

Charles

Corporate Circus Arts Entertainer
Location: Auckland

Total posts: 3989
Posted:Another hint to consider is to throw the staff flat to start with...

That way it doesn't smack you upside the head (OUCH!) and you get the hang of where it going.

Another option is to throw it in front of you and spin your body 180 so you are facing the other way. It is actually more impressive ot most crowds, and its easier as you can keep an eye on the staff until the veyr secondbefore you catch it.

quote: its easier to move yourself under the staff, rather than throwing the staff behind you, if you see what I mean. But doing it the hard way would look cooler.
Well, as far as the average joe is concerned, it looks just the same as if you didn't move.

Unless they are serious staffers, most onlookers wouldn't know the difference between an over the head throw and a throw into the air that you walk underneath. They tend to watch the staff, and then you when you've caught it.

Try it with s standard rotor, keeping the staff spinning in one spot and turning your body 360 behind it, most onlookers think you are spinning the staff around your body, when it is your body that is turning and the staff that's position isn't changing...


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simian


simian

110% MONKEY EVERY TIME ALL THE TIME JUST CANT STOP THE MONKEY
Location: London

Total posts: 3149
Posted:Oh you know that it would be far more kung-funky and shaolin-jedi-style to throw the staff behind and catch while your feet and body and stationary, compared to moving in front and catching. Its a really obvious total precision throw.

People are used to seeing people catch flying objects by moving about and keeping their eye on them like in baseball/rugby etc. But total precision not even looking at it throw and catch stuff can still blow peoples minds.

Its just a pity I'm an UberKlutz when it comes to stuff like this. I still can't do this move properly, but I can do another move turning 360 with it spinning balanced on the back of my hand, thanks to botched attempts at it

Its like an extended quarter-fishtail for those interested in over-complicated nomenclature


"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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Charles
BRONZE Member since Jun 2001

Charles

Corporate Circus Arts Entertainer
Location: Auckland

Total posts: 3989
Posted:Simian, it's your choice of course, as to what you want to learn.

However, "a really obvious total precision throw" is not obvious to anyone excpet staffers or perhaps the odd shaolin monk

I make my living as a performer, and what impresses other firies will bore the socks off most members of the public.

Not that I think a total precision throw isn't a great trick to learn, but making sure people are aware of who it will impress and who it won't.

There's nothing worse than smacking yourself upside the head with a big metal pole if you don't really need to...



All in my opnion, of course


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[Nx?]
BRONZE Member since Mar 2017

[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both

Total posts: 3749
Posted:yo,

I gotta btb throw, right to left behind without turning, got 2 rotations with it but I agree with charles, the only peeps Ive inpressed with this are other staffers, the throw isnt really big enough to look cool, and doing a big throw is difficult.

i like the over the shoulder throw the fireninja does, looks pretty slick.

N?


This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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Altera
SILVER Member since Nov 2002

member
Location: Sydney

Total posts: 38
Posted:hey i figured out the overhead toss... but its a bit unreliable at the moment but again i agree with charles it is easier to pull off an easier throw to impress crowds and these more technical ones are only good for fun or if your really confident!!!

i must say though fire breathing is always good as a crowd pleaser!!!


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fireninja


fireninja

member
Location: Portland, Oregon, USA

Total posts: 34
Posted:quote: i like the over the shoulder throw the fireninja does, looks pretty slick. Thanks +). I'll use this as an excuse to comment a bit. I assume you are refering to this one which I've had on my website for a while:

http://www.fireninja.com/backtoss_to_flip.mov
br>
I think that this is an example of what you guys are referring to as a total precision throw, i.e. 'throw the staff behind and catch while your feet and body are stationary' [although, I cheated a bit in this vid, you can see me trying to look over my shoulder...]. This kind of move is much easier to learn if you turn your body as you catch the staff. As your throwing gets more precise, you will need to turn less and less -- and soon your will be doing it "shaolin-jedi-style".

However, as cool as I think moves of this type are, I have to agree with Charles when he said

quote: I make my living as a performer, and what impresses other firies will bore the socks off most members of the public.When I've done this kind of stuff in front of a crowd the only ones who are impressed are the other fire performers. I find myself doing this kind of move when I'm showing off for other performers, and sticking to easier fail safe crowd pleasers when working a show.

This is an old complaint -- often times the coolest most technically difficult moves will be ignored by your standard audience, but they will go crazy if you something easy, like chuck it way up into the air and catch it. This is especially true if you are working at a rave or similar event where the audience is so ****ed up that all they are seeing is a bunch of tracers.

However, if you are stuck on doing this kind of stuff, you should maximise your chances to impress the crowd by drawing attention to how hard the moves are. Turn your back to them so they can see you catch it behind your back. If you're spinning behing your back turn so they can see it. If you're flipping and catching your staff with one hand, wave to the crowd with the other hand, or use your free hand to cover your eyes. Etc.

Anyway,

Have fun, and play safe...

-david
david@fireninja.com
www.fireninja.com


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