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Whiffle Squeek


Whiffle Squeek

addict
Location: Hartford, CT USA

Total posts: 416
Posted:ok, i know this may seem ridiculous, but i really was wondering about it, and just thought id toss it on this board to see if anybody else had an idea like this

now, i dont have the guts to fire breath, but the effect is incredible and adds so much "ooh and ahhh" value to the performance, and since glow is the usual substitute for fire, i began wondering if there was a way to do this with glow materials

now glowsticks work because of two chemicals that mix and then react to cause the light, so say you aspirated one of those chemicals and had either another person aspirate the other chemical or somehow introduced the other chemical into the plume of the first say by spray bottle?

wouldnt this creat a plume of phosphoresence(sp?)
or would the chemicals not have enough time to react with each other, or perhaps they dont work in the presence of oxygen?

or perhaps one of the chemicals is too thick to aspirate?

or even if they did, perhaps those chemicals are toxic?

just me and my little wonderings, i was hoping someone with chem background, i.e. NYC, would be able to help out here...

i would ask if anybody has tried it before but i sincerely doubt it...

oh, and since i brought it up, i feel the need to say, please dont go trying this without solid evidence theres no harmful side effects...

thanks...


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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Kinudin (Soul Fyre)


veteran
Location: San Diego, California, USA

Total posts: 1325
Posted:It's a good idea, but I heard from a reliable source that people at raves were splitting glowsticks open, getting high off of them then dying. Not so sure people are that stupid though.

If it does work though, take pictures lol I'd love to see it.


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Spectre


member
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada

Total posts: 5
Posted:Hi there,

I've cut a few glowsticks open before, and I can tell you that it smells aweful, I can't imagine what it would taste like. Tho I have had a friend who had one of those small glowsticks that you can put in your mouth and he bit on it and cracked it open, and he says it does taste aweful. And it lingered around... Soooo be warned!


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gάrbǿ


gάrbǿ

addict
Location: Bristol / London / Norwich / C...

Total posts: 521
Posted:I have heard of people doing it at the drome (R.I.P) .

The one thing you have to be really carefull of is glass inside the tube.

We used to cut them open and put them on our cloths to make them glow.

Another problem is that once mixed with air the glow stops after about

30mins or so. Apparently the shit inside them aint that toxic.

safe

[garbo]


be excellent to each other: safe:

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Mark P
BRONZE Member since Oct 2001

Mark P

old hand
Location: Bath, England

Total posts: 1031
Posted:Although the chemicals are probably not that toxic there are many factors that need to be considered here I think.

The chemicals will stain whatever they hit and will probably leave a nasty taste and residue in your mouth.

I dont have access to the chemical safety data as I am not exactly sure what chemicals different types of Glowsticks use but I am sure there would still be more of a risk from actually breathing the aspirated chemicals, much the same with paraffin - accidently swallowing a very small ammount is no where near as bad as inhilation of the fine droplets.

Also other considerations to take into account is the actual effect that you are looking for, the reason that fire breathing is so effective is due to the heat created by the flame, this helps carry the flame further and causes the nice billowing effect of the plume. If you were using 2 chemicals to produce a chemiluminescent reaction then you woud only see a spray rather than a nicely shaped plume.

Other possibilities are using UV reactive liquids or possibly powders, I am unsure as to how these would look but you can definately get UV reactive liquids that are completely non-toxic and might be worth a try (take tonic water for example).

Just make sure whatever you use you are 110% sure that it is safe


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MaDMouSeFiReBoY


member
Location: U.K. / Holland

Total posts: 49
Posted:I am obviously writing this with full, technical (and chemical) authority!

DONT DO IT!!!!

Although Im sure (IF it is possible) that glow breathing would look fantastic, but I knoiw of a kiddie once who did the "Im raving my bits off and Ill chew anything that gets near my mouth" type thing with (youve guessed it) a ghumble glow stick!

He was violently ill, had pains in his mouth for a while after, and (apparently) went quite a fetching version of green!

DONT DO IT! ...and I reckon you gotta be mad to try! (I wouldnt and I have a severly bad reputation for doing daft things!)

Try fire breathing, after the "pre-tried" it nerves, you will LOVE IT (like a dirty slag!!!)

Nuff said!


Distorted sex drive in space was already known to be a sticky knoblem - BRASS EYE

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Kyrian


Dreamer
Location: York, England

Total posts: 4308
Posted:I do know people that have eaten glowsticks with no apparent harm (altho the inside of their mouth was bizarre colours for many days afterwards.) The chemicals are nontoxic (supposedly. be careful iwth the dyes.) They work fine in the presence of oxygen, have you ever seen the glow stuff scattered all over rooms and people?

List of chemicals in glowsticks:
-Hydrogen Peroxide
-Phthallate Ester (non toxic at the doses it's going to exist at in a glowstick. semi-toxic at high doses.)
-phenyl oxalate ester
-flourescent dyes. (altho their supposed to be non-toxic, i'd check individual glowsticks on this, as dyes could be a place where you could get in trouble.)

what you get out of them:
-Phenol (ur going to find this listed as toxic. in small doses. not very often it isn't likely to hurt you, but small = very small .5grams or less.)
-Some sort of Peroxyacid
-Flourescent dyes

But it seems to me the biggest danger with any type of breathing is breathing the aspirated fuel... your not getting rid of that risk when you do it with glow chemicals.


Keep your dream alive
Dreamin is still how the strong survive

Shalom VeAhavah

New Hampshire has a point....

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Charles
BRONZE Member since Jun 2001

Charles

Corporate Circus Arts Entertainer
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

Total posts: 3989
Posted:With one small difference in this case...breathing broken glass into your lungs!

HoP Posting Guidelines
* Is it the Truth?
* Is it Fair to all concerned?
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Kyrian


Dreamer
Location: York, England

Total posts: 4308
Posted:good call charles, but you could also just mix the chemicals yourself? in which case you'd get rid of that problem at least.

I also think Mark P has a point, it would be very hard to get a plume, you'd likely wind up with more of a mist in the air.


Keep your dream alive
Dreamin is still how the strong survive

Shalom VeAhavah

New Hampshire has a point....

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[Nx?]
BRONZE Member since Nov 2001

[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both

Total posts: 3749
Posted:Anyone thought about using a fine powder, like custard powder for example, instead of fuel? I know that a powder/air mix of the right density will explode but is it any less dangerous? probibly not as inpressive.

I wasnt shure about fire breathing before and two of my friends have chem phneu and now pele's gone down im going no-where near it. looking at plans for a kick ass fire gun instead.

N


This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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Ajay


member
Location: Oxford, U.K.

Total posts: 158
Posted:also when u breath fire the fuel burns (hmm im sure this will get slightly less obvious later on...) which gets rid of it but with 'glow breathing' the glow stuff would end up floating around and going everywhere.

which might be a good effect but still a consideration.


One fine day in the middle of the night,
Two dead men got up to fight,
Back to back they faced each other,
Drew there swords and Shot each other.

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lluhmas


member
Location: Armidale, NSW, Australia

Total posts: 63
Posted:Yeah, I cant see it billowing then disappearing like a flame ball..rather spraying out and falling or going everywhere...but to test this, empty some glow sticks into a spray bottle (maybe with a little water) and spray the mist...see what happens...

BAHOOGA! It's the penguin-people!Gertrude, get me my lollypop and we'll lick 'em to death..and?

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Kyrian


Dreamer
Location: York, England

Total posts: 4308
Posted:Have sprayed glow suff before... collected from those necklaces. it does kinda go everywhere, but it if you were removed from the audience you might be able to pull it off. and keeping in mind again that some of these dyes stain.

Keep your dream alive
Dreamin is still how the strong survive

Shalom VeAhavah

New Hampshire has a point....

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Leonie


member
Location: Cumbria, UK

Total posts: 7
Posted:what about UV liquids? there are some that arent toxic usually some bizzare alcoholic mix im guessing that you could do a blow with some of it, whether it would actually glow when sprayed finely is somthing i might test this weekend (and probably get myself thrown out of the clubs in the process)
dont know what the actual thing in the drink is called to make it glow i just know that there called "test tube babies" in local pubs and come in a snazzy test tube glass in red, green and purple


Belief? What do I believe in? I believe in sun. In rock. In the dogma of the sun and the doctrine of the rock. I believe in blood, fire, woman, rivers, eagles, storm, drums, flutes, banjos, and broom-tailed horses...

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Charles
BRONZE Member since Jun 2001

Charles

Corporate Circus Arts Entertainer
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

Total posts: 3989
Posted:quote: there are some that arent toxic usually some bizzare alcoholic mix Alcohol IS toxic. That's the whole point. That's why getting wasted, or blotto or legless means the poeple involved appear to have some sort of degenrative nerve disease...

Sorry, nothing to do with the topic, but alcohol is toxic...


HoP Posting Guidelines
* Is it the Truth?
* Is it Fair to all concerned?
* Will it build Goodwill and Better Friendships?
* Will it be Beneficial to all concerned?

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DeadManWalkin30


member
Location: Staten Island, NY

Total posts: 25
Posted:I've never tried this, but it sounds like it might work. If you blow a mist at a lit glowstick, the light might reflect off the water and make a glowing mist, but i don't think you could get a very big plume because the further you go the less light will hit the mist. I gotta go try this now

Fanaticus Incendi -Pyromaniac

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Wikkaman


member
Location: The Birthplace of BlackSabbath

Total posts: 259
Posted:Nix,
I've heard that custard pwder works too, but i remember all to vividily the experiment at school when powders and fire and small explosions so i am dubious. Let me know if you try it.


The answer is never the answer. What's really interesting is the mystery. If you seek the mystery instead of the answer, you'll always be seeking. I've never seen anybody really find the answer-- they think they have, so they stop thinking. But the job is to seek mystery, evoke mystery, plant a garden in which strange plants grow and mysteries bloom. The need for mystery is greater than the need for an answer.-- Ken Kesey

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[Nx?]
BRONZE Member since Nov 2001

[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both

Total posts: 3749
Posted:yeah, i remember the experiment, but i think it explodes because its under compression (in a tin) and blown it would probably be more of a flash.

I think im gonna keep this hypothetical for the moment

N


This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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Teine


member
Location: Asheville, NC

Total posts: 74
Posted:i had a friend recommend coffeemate for powder breathing...second opinion anyone?

life begins between the night and the light.

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Teine


member
Location: Asheville, NC

Total posts: 74
Posted:tried the coffee nondairy powder creamer...no sucess. very unpredictable ignition, and when it actually does burn, it's a very weak flame...kinda like 1/4 version of a sparkler. *grumps*

life begins between the night and the light.

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Ajtag


Ajtag

The occasional one...
Location: nottingham

Total posts: 445
Posted:used flour when building a small cannon (long story) to give it a nice flash that worked the finer the better, any fine dust in the air will burn, so i guess pick and chose, not for me tho

There are 10 types of people, those who understand binary and those who dont.
Enjoy - A

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shizN0T


member
Location: Stroudsburg, PA, USA

Total posts: 184
Posted:Im sorry, I just have to say

"It's a good idea, but I heard from a reliable source that people at raves were splitting glowsticks open, getting high off of them then dying. Not so sure people are that stupid though.

If it does work though, take pictures lol I'd love to see it. "

if you are gonna say something is reliable, make sure you know what your talking about...


I smell something burning.

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Lapaire
SILVER Member since Jan 2002

Lapaire

member
Location: Hadley, MA, USA

Total posts: 36
Posted:2 quick notes-

1. When I was in boot camp, kids would constantly drink the lightstick goo and then get a kick out of having glowing urine.... NOBODY got high. I've tasted the stuff myself and although it doesn't taste good, I find it easy enough to drink without ingesting glass. Maybe there are some kinds of glowsticks that they used to make that were worse or like Kyrian said, certain dyes are bad, but I've seen people drink so much of the stuff I don't worry about it too much myself.

2. Although almost any powder will ignite, there is a danger of white lung disease which is fatal with dry fuels. I don't know if this applies to all dry fuels or just flour, but it might be worth finding out with the the coffee creamer stuff. There is a F.A.Q. on here somewhere on dry fuels if you are interested, but I'm not ambitious enough to try to find it again

I think that glow goo breathing is an awesome idea... My mind is awash with all the neat stuff you could do with controlled currents since the stuff stays in the air. Heck, you could probably even write/draw things with it with enough practice/skill/proper tools


When there is no place that you have decided to call your own then no matter where you go you are always heading home -Soseki

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Muff_Daddy


member
Location: London

Total posts: 45
Posted:hey i dont particularly want to be the one to go against a good idea, but i dont think that breathing out the chemicals from glowsticks are a very good idea.
as far as i know the chemicals are not safe. apart from ppl on this post, i personally dont know anyone who would consider the chemicals safe. and im sure a lot of glowsticks u can buy have warnings on them about breaking them open and what not. maybe some arent dangerous, why not find out from the manufacturers?
if there wasnt any problems or doubts about the safety its a great alternative to fire breathing, but i dont see it as safe.
thats just my personal opinion


'Statistics are like miniskirts, they reveal more than they hide.'

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[Nx?]
BRONZE Member since Nov 2001

[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both

Total posts: 3749
Posted:errm, all the glowsticks in this country are marked "non-toxic" i guess that makes them ok, i guess....

This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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Charles
BRONZE Member since Jun 2001

Charles

Corporate Circus Arts Entertainer
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

Total posts: 3989
Posted:I think it might pay for someone with some medical training to explain why inhaling/exhaling nontoxic chemicals can still be bad for you.

Water is about as non-toxic as it comes, but you can still drown if it goes down the wrong way.

BUT, AS ALREADY MENTIONED there are little bits of BROKEN GLASS!!!!!!!!! in chemicals inside glowing sticks.

I know you guys aren't talking about exactly the same thing, but any kids reading the last few posts (like a lot of us do) are likely to give this a go anyway.

Do you mind if this is conducted by email for the future?

I just think the risk of some 8 year old reading this and then guzzling some glass and glowfuel from a glowstick is too scary...


HoP Posting Guidelines
* Is it the Truth?
* Is it Fair to all concerned?
* Will it build Goodwill and Better Friendships?
* Will it be Beneficial to all concerned?

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[Nx?]
BRONZE Member since Nov 2001

[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both

Total posts: 3749
Posted:as is the following lawsuit?

This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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Whiffle Squeek


Whiffle Squeek

addict
Location: Hartford, CT USA

Total posts: 416
Posted::scratches head:

sorry Charles, didnt really think about that, i didnt quite mean just biting off the tops of glowsticks and trying it, i meant carefully acquiring the said chemicals and then using them, but eh, i guess the effect is still the same...


Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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Jade Lynx


member
Location: Laguna Beach, but i live in De...

Total posts: 239
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Whiffle Squeek:
say you aspirated one of those chemicals and had either another person aspirate the other chemical
or perhaps one of the chemicals is too thick to aspirate?

Just to be clear here, aspirating is what you DON'T want to do. To aspirate is to breathe something all the way into your lungs, where of course, what you WANT to do is just hold it in your mouth.

or even if they did, perhaps those chemicals are toxic?

Whether they are dangerous to hold in your mouth or to swallow into your stomach is worth researching, but do bear in mind that you still face the same risk of chemical pneumonia with kero, white gas, vodka, lamp oil, glowstuff, pretty much anything you try blowing out with. Speaking as someone who nearly died in the E.R. lobby just from aspirating too much housedust, you can pretty much figure that if looks good flying out your mouth, it's gonna jack your lungs up bad.

oh, and since i brought it up, i feel the need to say, please dont go trying this without solid evidence theres no harmful side effects...
Good on you, Whiffle Sweet Squeek, to point this out. I'm glad you added that disclaimer.

[ 02 September 2002, 18:24: Message edited by: Jade Lynx ]


We got the MikeZ in the house, woot!Glue the ham, hat baby!

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trintek


member
Location: San Antonio, TX

Total posts: 107
Posted:"yeah, i remember the experiment, but i think it explodes because its under compression (in a tin) and blown it would probably be more of a flash."

Think of a grain dust explosion. It usually explodes due to compression, but, you can still get one hell of a flash fire using the same principles. coffemate or some other non-daiy creamer works well for this type of effect, we used to do huge flares at some of our events using a medium (shoe box or smaller) sized box full of creamer, and a small tin of black powder under it... score the top so it rips easier, and score the bottom of the box so the blast sprays through the powder... by the way, dont try this, it was a very stupid way to get an effect on a budget, and i take no responsibility if you decide to play with something as dangerous as that.

As far as the glowsticks go.. Halloween, 1998, we took 4-5 of the green glowsticks, cut them open and drained them into a bowel, put all the glass vials into a mortar, smashed em, and put screen over the top of the mortar.. poured it back into the other chemical and mixed, then used it for covering some doors and such.. did the same thing with about 10 of the orange glowsticks (which really glow a weird kind of orangish green (ie: brown glow)) and used that for a fire breathing effect. no ill effects, well minus a really bad aftertaste.. and as far as i can tell, the chems dont mix well with water, looks like a strange uv lava lamp.


We bleed the same blood, We cry the same tears, We have the same fears, We pass the same years, We see the same stars, Under the same skies, We pass the same time, We all live and die

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SteelWngs
BRONZE Member since Aug 2001

SteelWngs

member
Location: Malden, Massachusetts United S...

Total posts: 169
Posted:http://www.lincoln.k12.or.us/newporths/staff/bmontgom/brian_mo.htm
br>'
Try using dry fuel like lycopodium powder a lighter sometime.


Blessings to all,
Peter
When you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered Dragon, remember, you do not have to outrun the Dragon ...you just have to outrun the halfling.

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