• All Purchases made this month instantly go into the draw to win a USD $ 100.00 credit to your HoP account.
 

Anubis


member
Location: Birmingham UK, or, Kuruman RSA

Total posts: 11
Posted:Reading all these posts about playing with fire started me thinking about things I learnt at school which might help create a nice effect.A few hours of trawling through my memory archives led me to the first "experiment" we were shown at secondry school, something I developed a few years ago....It goes something like this. Light a cloud of either saw dust or icing sugar to make a fire ball come out of an empty paint tin.Aparatus: Empty paint tin (metal)Long length of hosepipeLittle candlelittle dish to put icing sugar/sawdust inFriends to put you out when it all goes wrong.Method:Make a small hole near the bottom of the side of the paint tin. Put the hosepipe through this so that only a short bit (~2") is in the tin. Make sure the fit between the pipe and the tin is tight so that no air can get out.Fill your little dish with you chosen fuel(icing sugar/sawdust)... place it in the paint tin so that the end of the hose pipe either points directly down at it, or is in the pile of fuel. Put the lit candle in the tin next to the fuel. Put the lid of the tin on tightly and run away while someone else blows into the hosepipe to blow the fuel into a fine cloud. It then explodes and the lid of the paint tin flies off closely followed by a fire ball.When I tried it my length of pipe was only 1 foot. the paint tin was not metal. and my friend didn't put the lid on properly, so that when I blew into the pipe, I got a fireball that didn't go straight up, but went horizontally, into my face. mmmMMMmmm singed eyebrows
Non-Https Image Link
Happy playing....Anubis


__ __ __ __ __You're depriving some poor village of it's idiot

Delete Topic

Anubis


member
Location: Birmingham UK, or, Kuruman RSA

Total posts: 11
Posted:Just had a thought to add....Putting the lid on is not a must.Therefore two or more could be set up on a stage and set off at the same time by connecting all the hoses to the same air source (compressed oxygen/ person with very powerful lungs).

__ __ __ __ __You're depriving some poor village of it's idiot

Delete

Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:Thanks Anubis. I never heard of this before but I just so happen to have al the components around here somewhere (the benefits of being raised by packrats is that you think of creative reasons to keep obscure things!
Non-Https Image Link
)I have some ideas for this and think I will give it a try!Many Regards------------------Pele Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir...http://www.pyromorph.com


Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

Delete

McFly


member
Location: Melbourne, Vic, Australia

Total posts: 7
Posted:I suppose chemicals could be added for different colours?Does this make a lot of smoke?

I like the pretty lights...

Delete

Ajay


member
Location: Oxford, U.K.

Total posts: 158
Posted:ive done somthing simulal but simpler, if you take a drinking straw and put it in a tin of custard powder then put your thumb over the end and pull it out so you get about and inch of powder in the straw then blow that onto a fire you get a nice fireball.

One fine day in the middle of the night,
Two dead men got up to fight,
Back to back they faced each other,
Drew there swords and Shot each other.

Delete

TheBovrilMonkey
SILVER Member since Sep 2001

TheBovrilMonkey

Liquid Cow
Location: High Wycombe, England

Total posts: 2629
Posted:I've done it even simpler than with a straw, tear a small hole in the side of a drinking chocolate packet and wave it over a fire, making a mist of powder.when the powder hits the fire, you get a nice fireball shooting up in front of you.making a cloud of powder and having someone flick matches through it is pretty good too, uses up alot of drinking chocolate though.[This message has been edited by TheBovrilMonkey (edited 20 December 2001).]

But there's no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

Delete

Anubis


member
Location: Birmingham UK, or, Kuruman RSA

Total posts: 11
Posted:Minimal smoke. The teachers showed us inside. We actually managed to get the lid of the paint tin to hit the roof. They stopped us playing when the fireball started to reach the ceiling!!
Non-Https Image Link
I found sawdust to be much more explosive than sugar based anything. The best was sawdust from pine which had a lot of resin.The idea of the paint tin is that you can put a *MASSIVE* amount of powder in it. The only limit is the air source. If you can get hold of an oxygen tank then you could have some real fun
Non-Https Image Link
[This message has been edited by Anubis (edited 20 December 2001).]


__ __ __ __ __You're depriving some poor village of it's idiot

Delete

SteelWngs
BRONZE Member since Aug 2001

SteelWngs

member
Location: Malden, Massachusetts United S...

Total posts: 169
Posted:::::::::::::Channeling NYC:::::::::::Gay-Lussac's Law When gas molecules are trapped in a rigid container and exposed to burst of heat, their kinetic energy rises quickly. If the molecules are moving faster they will collide with the walls of the container more frequently and forcefully. These increased collisions will result in more force being applied to the walls of the container. In a rigid container, the area of the walls to which the collisions and forces are being applied does not increase (unlike an expandable container like a balloon) so the pressure (force/area) increases. As the gas molecules move faster and faster and the pressure builds, the lid of the container is blasted to the ceiling. The direct relationship between the temperature and pressure of gases held at constant volume was first proposed in the late 1700's by the French scientist Joseph Gay-Lussac. It is the rapid motion and increased collisions from heated gas molecules that cause the most spectacular explosions. But like any action-packed Hollywood movie, a good explosion needs a good source of heat. The chemical reactions of dynamite, TNT, etc. create rapid exothermic reactions which are able to quickly increase the speed of any gas molecules which happen to be near the reaction. For this small-scale explosion, I use burning lycopodium powder to create the heat I need. I have built an apparatus that mimics a grain elevator explosion. This demonstration is excellent for teaching the effect of the surface area of the reactants on the speed of a reaction. In order to burn something, the combustible reactant must be exposed to oxygen. If you build a fire with a large log, only the cellulose molecules on the surface can burn leaving 90% on more trapped on the inside. This makes for a slow combustion. If you cut the log into smaller and smaller pieces, you expose more and more of the cellulose to oxygen so more burning can take place at the same time - increased reaction rate. If I prepare an experiment to produce hydrogen gas from zinc metal and hydrochloric acid, I find it interesting how students will always choose the largest chunk of zinc they can find. Most of their zinc atoms are well-hidden from the acid and the reaction proceeds slowly. Zinc dust is much more dramatic, but may be too fast. Lycopodium is a combustible substance whose powder is composed of extremely fine particles. I begin the demonstration by filling a metal spoon with the powder and holding the edge of the pile in the flame of a Bunsen burner. The pile burns slowly and begins to blacken, but the students are not impressed. However, with a flick of your wrist, you can take advantage of the tremendous surface area of lycopodium powder. As the powder spreads out into the air, a large flame cloud develops as the oxygen molecules make their way between all the little particles. Now I want to recreate this flame cloud inside a rigid container with trapped air. My "tower" consists of two paint-type cans. They did not actually have paint in them when I got them, but they have the type of lid that seal tightly like a paint can. The kind you need a screwdriver to pry off. I don't remember what was in them, but I got them from a lawn and garden center. I removed the bottom of one of the cans so I could attach the two together in one tall stack. Do not try welding them. I tried that. I went to the hardware store and found a special epoxy type glue to attach them. So far so good. And they have been through a number of explosions. Next, I drilled a hole near the bottom of the stack. The hole is large enough for a #3 rubber stopper. I inserted a 4 inch section of glass tubing through the stopper. Insert the stopper so that the narrow end is coming out of the can. To the outside end of the glass tubing I attach a 4' length of rubber tubing. The tricky part was finding something for the other end of the tubing. I needed some kind of cup that hold lycopodium powder yet had a hole in the bottom to allow the powder to be dispersed inside the can. It took awhile, but I found the perfect solution. The plastic caps to the old mimeograph fluid containers have a hole that fits the glass tubing, and when turned upside down, they hold a nice pile of lycopodium powder. Fill the cap about 2/3 with powder and reach down and attach it to the glass tubing. Place a candle at the bottom and light it with match using tongs. Seal the lid down as tight as possible. I take the end of the 4' rubber tubing and retreat under the lab table directly beneath the set-up. With a quick burst of molecules from my lungs, I disperse the lycopodium powder inside the can tower. The speeding gas molecules take care of the rest. The lid of the tower will put a dent in your ceiling and the flame will rise 2-4' out the top. It is pretty spectacular. If you want to see the action, go this way....... http://www.allatoms.com/LycoPicturePage.htm
------------------Blessings to all, Peter "In motion, move like a thundering wave. When still, be like a mountain.Rising up, be like a monkey. Land swiftly and lightly like a bird. Be steadylike a rooster on one leg. One's stance is as firm as a pine tree, yetexpresses motion. Spin swiftly and circularly like a wheel. Bend and flexlike a bow. Waft gracefully like a leaf in the wind. Sink like a heavy pieceof metal. Prey like a watchful, gliding eagle. Accelerate like a gusty wind." Wushu Proverb


Blessings to all,
Peter
When you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered Dragon, remember, you do not have to outrun the Dragon ...you just have to outrun the halfling.

Delete

Anubis


member
Location: Birmingham UK, or, Kuruman RSA

Total posts: 11
Posted:That'll be the one!
Non-Https Image Link
Are there any budding chemists out there who can tell us what we should add to the powder to make brightly coloured flames? Mark P?


__ __ __ __ __You're depriving some poor village of it's idiot

Delete

SteelWngs
BRONZE Member since Aug 2001

SteelWngs

member
Location: Malden, Massachusetts United S...

Total posts: 169
Posted:I have also used lycopodium powder for fire blowing/breathing. Not as big a flame as liquid but sure beats a mouth full of kero.
Non-Https Image Link
I use a small tube (like a plastic straw), fill it with powder and blow it through a flame. ------------------Blessings to all, Peter "In motion, move like a thundering wave. When still, be like a mountain.Rising up, be like a monkey. Land swiftly and lightly like a bird. Be steadylike a rooster on one leg. One's stance is as firm as a pine tree, yetexpresses motion. Spin swiftly and circularly like a wheel. Bend and flexlike a bow. Waft gracefully like a leaf in the wind. Sink like a heavy pieceof metal. Prey like a watchful, gliding eagle. Accelerate like a gusty wind." Wushu Proverb


Blessings to all,
Peter
When you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered Dragon, remember, you do not have to outrun the Dragon ...you just have to outrun the halfling.

Delete

NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:My chemistry sense was tingling...Full on props to steelwings... you are right on...There are tons of "blow stuff up" things that you can do... I've got a book called "backyard ballistics" which uses small amounts of lighter fuel and "pringles" potatochip cylendars to make mortars and PVC pipe to make cannons... (check it out next time you're in Barnes and Noble Pele..)Other chem teachers use small amounts of flammables to blow the lids off of coffee cans and such...I'd be careful... explosions happen far too quickly to react.All of these things fall into the "BOOM! COOL! OK, I'm bored of it." category for me...

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Delete

NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:Holy teacher-of-the-year Steelwings, your website is GREAT! When I grow up I wanna be just like you. Except for the snakes... Nothin' against em... Just no so much the "animals in the classroom" type of guy...You holding any chemistry workshops anytime soon? I think I feel an "staff development"/road trip coming on... Bah, my district would never buy it...
Non-Https Image Link


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Delete

SickpuPpy


SickpuPpy

Ninja Rockstar!
Location: Denver, Co. U.S.A.

Total posts: 1100
Posted:Non-dairy coffee creamer... unbelieveably flammible.
Non-Https Image Link
If you have the space to do it, I saw a band (Crash Worship, out of New Orleans) a few years ago who opend their show with a two story fire ball. Appearenty they did it by taking a dust pan (probobly called something diffirent outside the US) attaching a wick with wire around the mouth of it and just dumping out the creamer. It was very impressive, to say the least.------------------If you love something, set it on fire.[This message has been edited by SickpuPpy (edited 20 December 2001).]


Jesus helps me trick people.

Delete

SteelWngs
BRONZE Member since Aug 2001

SteelWngs

member
Location: Malden, Massachusetts United S...

Total posts: 169
Posted:As I would love to take credit for the web site it's not mine. Basically, I'm a geek. I do tech support and stuff like that. I do have friends that have gone to MIT and TUFTS and some wonderful schools here in Boston. So I grew up with some wonderfully smart people. I like to think of myself as a jack-of-all-trades.
Non-Https Image Link
As for chemistry I know enough to not blow myself up. I did do a lot a seriously stupid stuff when I was a kid. Thinking back now I'm amazed that I still have all of my fingers. NYC for you alone I will admit that in high school a friend of mine and I made a VERY small amount of Potassium nitroaminotetrazole to experiment with or we used to coat paper towels in potassium perchlorate just to see what it would do. Like I said earlier if I knew now what I was working with I wouldnt have done it. But please don't give me credit for the site the work is friends of mine NOT mine. I just steal from reliable sources.
Non-Https Image Link
But I will ask about seeing if you could come out and hang with a few pyro's that I know that teach at MIT.
Non-Https Image Link
Oh, and BTW what is it with Chem. teachers and Physics teachers and Pink Floyd anyway? Maybe it's just here in MA.------------------Blessings to all, Peter "In motion, move like a thundering wave. When still, be like a mountain.Rising up, be like a monkey. Land swiftly and lightly like a bird. Be steadylike a rooster on one leg. One's stance is as firm as a pine tree, yetexpresses motion. Spin swiftly and circularly like a wheel. Bend and flexlike a bow. Waft gracefully like a leaf in the wind. Sink like a heavy pieceof metal. Prey like a watchful, gliding eagle. Accelerate like a gusty wind." Wushu Proverb


Blessings to all,
Peter
When you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered Dragon, remember, you do not have to outrun the Dragon ...you just have to outrun the halfling.

Delete