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DJ Dantana
BRONZE Member since Aug 2001

veteran
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA

Total posts: 1495
Posted:On a subjuct related to auras: I was wondering if anybody else has ever had their point of awareness move to the outside of their body? In other word has anybody else ever found themselves outside of their body? This has happened to me many times (like more than 15 times). It is something I can stop from happening or I can go with it and allow it to happen (when I feel it start to happen). I can't make it happen on command (yet). I must wait for it to start to happen at random, and then I can choose to do it or not. For some reason I am always laying on my back too. One time I actually did it twice in a row with a period of laying down, awake for several minutes in between. The first two times it happened I didn't realize it was just my spirit/conciouseness moving. I went into it right after falling to sleep. It scared me because I thought I was physicaly floating when I woke up, the fear poped me back into my body though. On the way back to my body I blacked out for an instant though. It doesn't scare me now. It is not always easy to control where I go without poping back into my body. I just have to do it, don't think about it. Any strong emmotions (like fear or selfish thoughts) pop me back into my body also. And it is a little different each time. Sometimes I percieve my mind being in two places at once, one part inside my body, the other part outside, some times I have actually seen the world with my physical eyes and my "spirit eyes" at the same time, that was just a little bit disorienting because I was looking at the same object from two points of view, and I came back into my body fully with amost no perceptable transition, even though my awareness had been 90% out, 10% in (kind of like the left and right brain, but my two points of awareness were seperated by several meters)... And Physical objects are no barier, although I have tryed to leave my house several times and I can't go through the final barrier (ceiling, door, wall) to the outside. But I think this is a mental inhibition, because I have passed through other objects (like floor, or my bed)without resistance. I have several friends who have left their body also. We knew each other for years and one day some of us started talking about it and it turns out we had all done it befor.As to the causes, there are many.Pysical: stress, exastion, pain.Mental: stress, exastion, painOther: Random, drugs, ?For me it has only been random, or from mental stress.I have experienced a partial OBE during mental stress on several occations (like while studying for final exams) My piont of aware ness moves to the top of my head, but I don't actually leave, and other random times. The full OBEs happen usualy after I have been asleep and I wake up feeling like I am about to leave, or as I am laying down trying to go to sleep. I am deffinatly not sleeping when it starts to happen though. A few times it has started when I was just laying down thinking, not even trying to go to sleep. Although the first two times it happend while I was sleeping and I woke up out side of my body. There seems to be a transition zone of blackness and unconciouseness sometimes, but I think this has disapeared over time. And, these are deffinitly not dreams, a few times I have dreamed of leaving my body, but those are always different, they have that dream like unrealness and mindset, and they don't match with reality. This is a real thing, and it has proven to me that our spirit does exist, and after we die, our spirit goes on living. A couple other times I felt fear as I left, but as soon as I made peace with God (not speaking, just thinking)the fear disapeared. Didn't mean for this to be this long.Daniel[This message has been edited by santanatwo (edited 13 September 2001).]

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

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Diesel_RaVer


member
Location: New York City, NY USA

Total posts: 15
Posted:What are you doing, and where can I get some
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j/kseriously, I used to have those when I was younger, floating feelings, out of body experiences, It is your unconciousness superceeding your conciousness, you become unaware at that point of time and you are no longer percieving the outer realm, rather you are in a state of dream or floating euphoria, much like everyone else, this is a common phenomina, while not everyone can remember this, im sure everyone has had that childhood dream/nightmare of "something" big and dark maybe even a terrestrial animal or being chasing you, and that infamous falling dream. its all part of psychology, if your really interested check out a book on the human mind, what you will learn will baffle you.


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DJ Dantana
BRONZE Member since Aug 2001

veteran
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA

Total posts: 1495
Posted:Actually, as a younge teen, I used to occationaly wake up to a feeling that an evil presence was nearby and my body would be paralyzed for a little while. I would try and talk too, but my vocal cords wouldn't work and all I could do is move my mouth and breath. I would try to speak the name of Jesus, luckily the thought counts...Because the evil presence always would leave when I did this. many seconds (seemed like years) later I would regain the ability to speak and move. Something different has happened to me a few times...I have woke up after apparently not breathing for a long, long time, because it is all I can do to take a tiny breath. I keep doing that, using ALL of my will power (because I have no oxygen left, just will to live) untill I can take a slightly larger breath, this goes on for an apparent eternity, taking larger and larger breaths, untill I am full alive again. This is realy scary but it has not happened more than about 4 to 6 time in my life. This might sound wierd but it could be related to the fact that i forget to breath sometimes when awake...especialy when playing things like video games and musical instruments like the guitar and piano (and almost just now on the computer). Might have something to do with having to much conciouse control over my "autonomic nervouse system" (I can manipulate my heart beat, blood flow, skin conductance, and penis size-not joking) just by thinking about it. I don't practice this stuff often, but I have done it before. When sea mammals dive, they restrict blood flow so it only goes to the to the heart and brain inorder to stay active underwater for long periods of time, I guess I have the same ability, it just takes practice to be able to do it. example: three laps underwater in an olympic lap pool (when I was 15 years old) last month I did 2 minutes underwater without hyperventalating before hand, and I wasn't even needing oxygen whenI came up, I just tend to get worried when I feel like I don't need Oxygen after two minutes
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It's all about COMPLETE relaxation, even while moving your muscles. Your muscles use up more energy when they fight against eachother.Keep the replys comeing people, I'm sure there are more people out there who have this stuff happen.[This message has been edited by santanatwo (edited 13 September 2001).]


we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

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Posted:Astral Travel?!

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GoaFire


member
Location: Leeds

Total posts: 71
Posted:santanatwo...i can astrally project myself...email me if you like at goafire@hotmail.comor if your on msn my nick is goafire...hehe...we can chat about it if you like...*smiles*goafire

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emthren


member
Location: Sydney

Total posts: 57
Posted:Whoa where to begin santanatwo! You seem to have covered everything from sleep paralysis to night terrors and OBE's.
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There's quite detailed info available on pretty much everything you've spoken about, ranging from the hardcore sceptical scientific views to the complete mystical and 'fluffy' perspectives.Would suggest you check out www.lucidity.com (thanks Endangered Sanity!) for the Lucidity Institute's writing, as well as the Astral Society's resources at www.astralsociety.comQuite comprehensive and detailed coverage of practically all that you're describing.[This message has been edited by emthren (edited 14 September 2001).]


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jedimastah


member
Location: Round Rock TX , US

Total posts: 97
Posted:Santanatwo, it is not difficult to train yourself to achieve astralprogection. All it takes for me is about 20 to 30 min. of some deep meditation. Although it took me about 2 and 1\2 years to be where I wanted to be. Which is a place that I like to call "THE PLAIN OF ENLIGHTENMENT." Here I like to train my mind as well as my body to accuire peek efficiency. This "plain" is far beyond any material or physical limitations. I can pretty much do anything I want there. The feeling is like a sensory overload. When I am there I feel at complete peace and in a state of utter extacy. You obviously have the ability. So try to focus all of your energy on achieving controll and break the physical limits. Once this is done you will be able to do anything.

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Endangered Sanity


member
Location: Brisbane, QLD, Australia

Total posts: 164
Posted:I think www.lucidity.com might work better
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JeStEr
SILVER Member since Jul 2001

enthusiast
Location: Melbourne Australia

Total posts: 214
Posted:this is cool stuff, i myself can't remember and so can't be sure i've had an OBE, i have however had dreams of being in other places and all the details are so clear i have thought it could be a premonition etc. I have strong beliefs that there are many kinds of ESP (extra sensory perception) ie telepathy, telekinises, astral projection etc. just to carify are bilocation/OBE/astral projection/remote viewing all along the same lines? I have predicted things when trusting my intuition though; then those events have occured later, (it's like i close my eyes and see the situation unfold on the back of my eyelids), also i know i'm getting off topic but things like knowing who's at the door or on the phone before answering happen to.cya all

Trying to play the Akashic records,
but my turntables not compatible.

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Marlboro


member
Location: St.Annes, Lancashire, England

Total posts: 180
Posted:I remember having a re-occuring sensation, again only whilst laid flat, awake, and unable to initialize, but I'd get a sensation of lifting up, but it would go up my body as a wave, as soon as I was consious of it the height would stop, and the wave would roll up and down my body for a while and as soon as I tried to get and kind of control of it, it was gone. I remember it being an amazing feeling, and not understanding it at the time I just wanted to keep this wave motion flowing.Is this the kinda sensation you get/or relate to? (I'm v., v. interested.)M:-)~

We were somewhere around Barstow on the edge of the desert when the drugs began to take hold.

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emthren


member
Location: Sydney

Total posts: 57
Posted:JeStEr,OBE's and Astral Projection are sort of half-in half-out the ESP basket. Although people do experience seeing what looks like the physical world, the validity of those results is questionable.The experiences are put down as merely a waking induced lucid dream. Unfortunately, it seems to overlook much of the distinctiveness of OBE's compared to LD's.Remote Viewing (CIA-style et. al.) is something different altogether, with stands on even shakier ground.Marlboro,Sounds like either the start of your body falling asleep, or the beginning of the OBE/AP process. Hard to pick without knowing more - how long did it take to get this sensation? Did you experience anything else before/after it?So in my element,emthren ;D

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DJ Dantana
BRONZE Member since Aug 2001

veteran
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA

Total posts: 1495
Posted:yes, also known as astral travel by new agers, Bilocation by catholics, and OBE by laymen.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

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Pele
BRONZE Member since Dec 2000

Pele

the henna lady
Location: WNY, USA

Total posts: 6193
Posted:For me it is like I am another person looking at myself from outside myself. I call it my detached person syndrome. Beyond that it is complicated to explain but I belive it is associated with past lives, at least for me.

Pele
Higher, higher burning fire...making music like a choir
"Oooh look! A pub!" -exclaimed after recovering from a stupid fall
"And for the decadence of art, nothing beats a roaring fire." -TMK

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s-p-l-a-t


member
Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia

Total posts: 383
Posted:I have experienced this OBE with and without drugs.... more recently *with* a 'drug'....Native Americans used to use (and perhaps still do to the best of my knowledge) herbs that would induce OBEs.... they would do this to follow their spirit journeys after wandering into the desert to meditate and chant. I believe the idea was to induce psychic or similar abilities and gain insight into their spirituality. Salvia Divinorum was a herb they have been known to use.... I obtained some of this from a herbal shop down south a little while ago... it was incredible... I was coming down from other drugs (in my irresponsible youth
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), and I smoked a fair amount of Salvia due to a lack of my preferred smoking herb (at the time that is) ... I proceded to spend the next five hours wandering around the house, laughing 'with' the patterns on the walls, a flying/rushing sensation, and viewing the room I was mainly in, from just outside of it, somewhere up near the roof. The music I had been listening to (some ambient stuff) faded to the sound of faint drumming, which got louder on the occasion.. I was not hearing it with my ears, more my being was experiencing it via my essence, which in turn felt like it was leaping out of my skin. I felt like singing, humming, and so I did... My body felt very very warm, and as if my spirit and my body were in different places/planes at the same time. It was the most controllable OBE I have ever had, I felt like I was being touched by some kind of ancient 'spirit' ... it was an exhilirating feeling.Salvia Divinorum does not do this with everyone though - some people report similar, others have reported turning into a bit of a shivering wreck when ingested too much. I guess some people are more ready/open to it than others when using this sacred herb. Please do not use this herb unless you are well experienced in herbal psychedelia... I have read stories of people losing their sanity with it. Even then, have someone you feel very comfortable with 'babysitting' you ... (don't necessarily need to talk to them..just know they are there)http://www.lycaeum.org should still have info...


The beautiful thing about learning is that no one can take it away from you.- B.B.King

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Posted:I just have to add a bit more info on Salvia, cuz it's legal, easy to get and potentially dangerous...Salvia is available as leaves, basically a standard extract...its also available as 5x extract..ie 5 times more potent than smoking the standard leaves. you can also get up to 25x extract (shit - you can get pure salvia, but it costs thousands of dollars - and you need to be a registered researcher) - but no-one I know (and I know some very open minded and seriously out there psychedelic freaks) smokes the really strong extracts (10x+), cuz it's too easy to have too much.play safe kids, keep out of the institutions, and Salvia will remain un-prohibited.and just my opinion, but I dont count Salvia as much of a party enhancer...more of a spaceship for your imagination
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Josh


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Naganootch


AKA CLERIC
Location: Staten Island , NY. USA

Total posts: 172
Posted:I did a sensory deprevation thing at one point in my room. I was really mad at the time and didn't want to deal with any noise or people. So it was about 3 in the morning. I covered my windows with heavy blankets and stuffed towels under the doors, and put ear plugs in, then turned off the lights.It was so dark i could not see my hand and i couldn't hear anything. It was scary at first but then i got calm. It was the clearest i had ever thought. By the way it was around 3 when i started . I must have dozed off because next thing i know it's 5 oclock. But i swear i didn't fall asleep. i didn't feel my eyes close. I didn't dream. I had stayed in the same sitting position. It felt as if i had been sitting there for 5 minutes yet i was the most rested i've ever been. Not sure what this has to do with leaving your body. But i think everyone should try out sensory deprivation. I'd like to know if anything wierd happens to them.

We are defined by the choices we make

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s-p-l-a-t


member
Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia

Total posts: 383
Posted:Thanks for those important points, Josh.I had a friend who was a chemist a few years ago... who had crystalized and extracted this form of Salvia. He did not think it would work...but a tiny crystal had him in different 'dimensions' .. (e.g. black spaces...what he described as a kind of time travel for his spirit etc)I usually smoked the 5x extract..and a fair amount of it... however smoking loads of the leaf form would trigger visions and movement. I was not aware you could purchase 10x + extracts.... ye Gods! I personally would not understand the need...but then again with the things my friend was telling me of his crystals (No I was not interested in trying!) it seemed certainly unique and powerful ... but I figured the people that HAD been using it for centuries had not crystallized it in 'their labs' ...I never did Salvia as a party drug and would certainly not condone such a usage. I don't understand why people would do this in the first place with such a herb?? However coming down off ecstasy saw me do it a few times in my irresponsible years. There was never anyone else awake in the house... (Usually began doing it at 2-3 am)... And I would start by meditating (or simply closing my eyes and trying to envision a 'silence' for a while)I do not know anyone that had the more pleasant experiences I did on it... most of the stories I have read over the net involve simple visuals or strong feelings of dread or fear.

The beautiful thing about learning is that no one can take it away from you.- B.B.King

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Marlboro


member
Location: St.Annes, Lancashire, England

Total posts: 180
Posted:I've not come across Salvia, but on a similar level I managed to get hold of some DMT , and really wanted to experience it (and still do) but held back coz at the time and situation I new I would have ended up inthe nut house.Anyone out there tried it?:-)~M

We were somewhere around Barstow on the edge of the desert when the drugs began to take hold.

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Marlboro


member
Location: St.Annes, Lancashire, England

Total posts: 180
Posted:I've not come across Salvia, but I've heard of South American Indians using Peyote for a similar OBE experience.On a similar level I managed to get hold of some DMT , and really wanted to experience it (and still do) but held back coz at the time and situation I new I would have ended up in the nut house if I'd have taken it.I'm interseted to hear if anyone has tried it, and what the experience was like?:-)~M

We were somewhere around Barstow on the edge of the desert when the drugs began to take hold.

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MiSsFrOg


member
Location: Oceanside, CA USA

Total posts: 187
Posted:ook people no more dugs...
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have you guys ever licked a frogs tummy? [This message has been edited by MiSsFrOg19 (edited 15 September 2001).]


Its not easy being green....

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RavingLunatic


member


Total posts: 286
Posted:Interesting..I had always heard that salvia divinorum had little to no effect on you at all when used alone. But when used with mushrooms, or acid, or DMT, it would prolong, and intensify the trip.. or maybe I am thinking of something else..ah yes, now I remember, that was syria rue(sp?) seeds..syria rue inhibits your digestive system, and makes it difficult for you to metabolize certain things, which is what intesifies the trip and makes it longer, because the drug stays in your body longer.but it can be very dangerous!! you must cleanse your body for weeks before even thinking about this, no caffiene, no alcholol, no milk... I am by no means an expert, but I want to make it clear that this is not something you can just go try, unless you are ready, both physically and mentally.Anyway, I wanted to let everyone know that drugs are only a light shining on a door in your mind. that door is already there, you just have to walk through it, and it can be hard to see in the dark.For example, whenever I do mushrooms, I see things, not strange hallucinations, like smurfs climbing up walls, but rather a soft undulation of everything, especially living things, a wave motion, about 120bpm or so..this is the NOT the drugs MAKING me see this, it is the drugs ALLOWING me to see it! It's already there..when I sit and relax, with nothing on my mind, sitting in the sun peacefully, maybe with a little marijuana to let the mind unwind, I can see this motion. I can see it undulating through everything, because it IS the pulse of life..anyway, that is all I have to say for now, but this is a very interesting thread, and I'd love to hear more from everyone about their OBEs, and visions etc..------------------~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

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Marlboro


member
Location: St.Annes, Lancashire, England

Total posts: 180
Posted:Raving -- I totally agree - any drug requires physical and mental strength and clarity before you take, specifically the trippy variety. Otherwise get out yer special jacket!!MissFrog -- you offering? I've heard of toads that have hallucinogenic oil on their skin....?:-)~M

We were somewhere around Barstow on the edge of the desert when the drugs began to take hold.

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Tlight


member
Location: London

Total posts: 189
Posted:Wow this is a really intersisting topic. I think i would be really scared though if it happaned to me.

I hope you realize how pissed I am.

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DJ Dantana
BRONZE Member since Aug 2001

veteran
Location: Stillwater, Ok. USA

Total posts: 1495
Posted:I know this one guy who smoked a joint loaded with horse tranquilizer (he didn't know it at the time) while he was on a boat. He ended up looking down at himself from high in the air.But I don't ever have OBEs from using drugs, I might have burned a little green befor a couple of them, but by far the majority have happened while I was totaly sober. I have never actually seen myself either, though I understand that some people do. Usually I don't realy go far I just move around near my body for a while, I would love to go places though, Because I belive that could lead to the ability to "remote view".Like JeStEr I used to know who was at the door or who was calling. The "looking through the door thing" started because one day I was waiting in the car one night for a friend of mine....And as I sat there (sober, and I'd never done any halucinogens) I noticed a black/magenta/purpleish color blob (I had never seen a color like this befor, like it was in some other plane of existence) moving along the rock-walled building he was in. It moved across slowly and I watched it not knowing what I was seeing. Then right as it came to the end of the building my friend stepped out the door....It is as if I was seeing his energy or something, and I was watching him through solid rock. So after that I would try to look though my door befor I answered it. I have never seen this "color" with the same intensity again, but I would call out their name befor I answered the door, and I never got it wrong (I did this for several months) For some reason none of them ever said anything about it to me, but I realized (4 years later) that one of my friends used to call me "quizatch haderack" and I think it may have been because he noticed what I was doing....though at the time I never made the connection.

we eat and we drink and we smoke and we try!

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RavingLunatic


member


Total posts: 286
Posted:Yes.. this is how humanity works. We all have this power in us, we need only unleash it. It is the distractions of this way of life that have disconnected us and made it so hard. and people will call you a "quack" or a "nutcase" if you admit this..but this is the real deal people.On another slightly unrelated note, did you know that there are really 13 months not 12? the moon goes around the earth 13 times in one year. the tides cycle 13 times a year. a womans menstrual cycle occurs 13 times a year. there are exactly 13 twenty-eight day periods in one year, with one day left over. I'm not sure of the exact signifigance of this, or of the extra day left over.But I think the 12 month calendar takes us away from the natural flow of the earth. making it harder for us to realize these very real things out there that the powers that be would have us never be aware of.just my $0.02------------------~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

~whoosh whoosh whoosh~

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MiSsFrOg


member
Location: Oceanside, CA USA

Total posts: 187
Posted:
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@ marlboro haha


Its not easy being green....

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Posted:um Marlboro, be careful with DMT. AFAIK, its about as strong as it gets...ie you cant get further out...do some research...its a big step, and may change you as a person...I've done some research on it, and I cant really make up my mind - be sure you know yours before going down this path.Syrian Rue is a MAOI, it is dangerous because it inhibits the functions of your blood brain barrier, which is the membrane which keeps most of the bad stuff out of your brain...however when you inhibit its functioning, you can jam more stuff into your brain = more effect...unfortunately it also allows toxic or potentially toxic chemicals in, which ordinarily you would be fine with. again, if you have some, make certain you know what you are doing...there are a lot of good websites to learn from,www.erowid.org is my favourite...Splat, thanks for your insight, Salvia is relatively rare methinks, and its always nice to hear from someone with some experience...
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Josh


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emthren


member
Location: Sydney

Total posts: 57
Posted:For OBE work, Datura (and associates) appears to be the choice drug. Not a guaranteed OBE, but Ive come close a few times my self. Even at mild dosages it can serve to make the whole OBE process easier. And hey, even dear old Don Juan & Castaneda says it's "used for flying".
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Josh,Not altogether sure if I agree with you on the function of MAOI's. My understanding is that MAO's break down released neurotransmitter, making them useless. When this is inhibited (what MAOIs do) the effect is as if there was more of that neurotransmitter. Its because of this inhibited decay that its much easier to overdose using drugs, or just eating food that has an effect on the particular neurotransmitters.But... much agreed on Erowid. Fantastic site. =))


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rangerbethany


member
Location: brisbane, QLD

Total posts: 70
Posted:i read that the shamans in peru use a drug called "yaje" or "yage" which increases ESP but you need to have a tiny amount that slowly increases over several years, don't even dream of touching this stuff without someone experienced. i'm thinking of dedicating some years of my life later
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also, there are a ton of different salvias in my garden but i haven't a clue as to which ones count, what colour is the divinorum? meanwhile my datura's have just started to flower again
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i think i might have had an OBE recently, i had a little go-e whilst clubbing and dropped some acid around 4-5am on the way home, i was in my room listening to some native american chanting music and freezing my ass off when everything stopped. i wasn't cold anymore, and i was looking down at myself as i flew in circles above me and was visualising many a cool thing(desserts, canyons). it lasted for what seemd like hours (the speed was ace)
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i'm not sure if it was an OBE, not a real one, i wouldn't have had it without acid.can anyone else fully manipulate thier dreams?beth


floating
drifting
fading away
how could these stimulants lead us astray?

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Posted:i find special k (horse tranquilizer) gives a euphoric out of body experience but really drains your energy,as far as drugs go, they unleash your energy and powers, whilst on them you are bound to run out of kick, so the energy comes from your aura, it took months to seal my auric holes, so stick with the natural.as for astral projection during sleep, raise your hands in your dream. once you can do that you have control over where you are going, be protected, an old friend of mine went a bit too far and wasnt capable of bringing himself completely back and another good friend now suffers fits when going to sleepwork on psychic shields.bright blessings and happy travels!
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Posted:ok emthren's right and I'm not sure whether Im misguided, or looking at it from a different angle.
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http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/maois/maois_info5.shtmlits probly better to think of it in those terms.appologies!and remember kids,just say Know.Josh[This message has been edited by [Josh] (edited 16 September 2001).]


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