Page: 123
Dom
Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK
Member Since: 19th Dec 2001
Total posts: 3009
Posted:I wanted to put a few ideas out there for people to play with. These aren't Jedi. They're not new. They're not 'my' moves. There's a whole load of variations that lead from and to them. And I don't want people to start discussing them too geekily. They're just ideas to give to people who might not have seen them yet. And they all look better if you smile too.

The Wheelchair - Same time isolations at your sides between your arm and your torso.
This is just one member of a large family of moves (a family called 'poi moves'), but got a name because it was for too good a naming opportunity to miss! There's a whole load of other variations - split time, in front, internal to external, internal tuck-turns, etc... You figure them out.

Tap Backs
Spin backwards at your side, slowly. As the poi head passes 45 degrees past horizontal on it's rise release the handle so that the head continues towards you. Quickly bring your hand up to impact with the poi head, sending it back whence it came. The handle will be somewhere, grab it and keep spinning. Can also be done the other way, with poi coming over your shoulder.

These stem from seeing club juggling tap backs, which I can't do. These seem to work with my sock poi - haven't tried other socks/tail/fire/goblin/whatever poi. Speed, point of release and possibility of it working at all are dependent on your poi.

Mid Chain Grabs
Stop powering the poi so that you can move your hand from the centre of rotation and grab hold of the chain near the poi head, spin a revolution, then let go into the original poi circle.

Isolated Throws
Spin backwards. As the poi head reaches horizontal push the handle down. The poi will isolate and the handle will return to you.

Catches
Don't let jugglers have all the fun! Catch and throw your poi. There's two different ways to catch your poi:
pull - If you stop your hand giving poi circular momentum a small hand movement can pull the poi back into your hand. This makes catches nice and easy in all positions, and allows some great exaggerations.
fall - Just stop powering the poi and it'll fall. With practice it'll fall nicely into the palm of your had. This looks a bit smoother than a pull catch, but is a bit harder, especially when catching from behind.

Flatlining and Flicks
Gotta dig them cheesy names! Basically a pull catch which misses and so dissects the circle of poi movement and forms a semicircle. Bounce = flick from a Gilligan

Throws and drops
What else you going to do once you've caught it?

Bounce poi
Don't let bounce jugglers have all the fun! Put big bouncy balls on a rope (or buy a suitable dog toy) and find a flat, hard floor. If you've even seen club bounce juggling you know what I mean.

Enjoy


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TheWibbler
old hand
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 11th Apr 2003
Total posts: 920
Posted:Musashii - Do I smell the sweet scent of a believer?

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.

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Glåss
Glåss

The Ministry of Manipulation
Location: Bristol
Member Since: 8th Nov 2001
Total posts: 2523
Posted:spinsin...
looks like a saw blade,
sounds like a buzzsaw

ppp what would you call a buzzsaw in pi alpha zee notation?
and mores to the point.
why do you call a cat, a cat?


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duballstar
duballstar

slack rating - 9.5
Location: Suburbiton, Yoo-Kay
Member Since: 3rd Sep 2003
Total posts: 2216
Posted:hey 3p-o(i)...

it's an intersting idea man and one that needs some thought. when i first read it, it seemed like technical jargon, but the more i think about it.. what we're doing is technical!

i think you've got to be careful about completley disasociating yourself with the existing language of poi though, if you want to create a smooth process of learning from begginer through intermediate to technical. there needs to be point of reference to existing and understood phrases/moves such as TTN which visually aid us to understand what someone is explaining...

also there are many that love the weird and whacky names and moves that get used as it add's flavour to what otherwise could become far too mathmatical and precise...


i do like the idea of naming the planes though as it could really help explanations!


It is our fantasies that make us real. Without our fantasies we're just a blank monkey' - Terry Pratchett

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musashii
musashii

starring Skippy the green llama
Location: Seattle, WA
Member Since: 14th Dec 2002
Total posts: 1148
Posted:hmm, ye just might

First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica

" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."

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TheWibbler
old hand
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 11th Apr 2003
Total posts: 920
Posted:

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Glass is right. "Cat" does not adequitely describe the animal.

PoiPoiPoi, we've actually got a term that EVERY english speaking poi reigon uses to describe a move and you're suggesting we change it? I don't know anyone that doesn't use "thread the needle"...

Plus, have you ever threaded a needle? It's exactly the same motion! It's the only name that makes sense!

You crazy.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:nyc - this is not about individual names; it is a notation system.

'plural zee alpha' is still 'thread the needle', just as '333' is still 'three ball cascade'.

geddit?


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Dom
Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK
Member Since: 19th Dec 2001
Total posts: 3009
Posted:Thought I'd contribute to a thread hijacked by geeks. GEEKS! the lot of ya!

quote: I don't know anyone that doesn't use "thread the needle"...

Plus, have you ever threaded a needle? It's exactly the same motion! It's the only name that makes sense!
Years ago I got taught the push-through - which makes a lot more sense than TTN. And the cross-follow also makes a lot more sense that the weave. But most of the time I still refer to moves I'm teaching people as 'this one' and 'that one'.

And I've threaded many needles. It tends to involve squinting, licking the end of a peice of thread and occasionally pricking yourself. Hope of this happens during poi. At least not my poi!


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[Nx?]
[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Member Since: 5th Nov 2001
Total posts: 3749
Posted:yo dom,

was having a little go at thoes tap-backs last night, theyre great fun! thanks not shure about the wheelchair tho.

T


This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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TheWibbler
old hand
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 11th Apr 2003
Total posts: 920
Posted:Dom, is this what you mean by 'tap backs'?

'split time outwards 180 release with 360 tap back'


Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.

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Glåss
Glåss

The Ministry of Manipulation
Location: Bristol
Member Since: 8th Nov 2001
Total posts: 2523
Posted:Tap back= club move where you hit the other end of the club in mid flight, then catch the handle.

also called slap backs:
http://www.peapot.net/tocmenu/index.html

go to radical club news, then video clips, the first trick sequence in the first video is jay gilligan !!!! doing them with fish.
Doms doing them with poi.

Also If you haven't seen it before, I recommend you check out :
This Just In - Maksim's traps
at the bottom of the list
not for poi, but just cos maksim is aultrabadassjugglingdude

[ 13. November 2003, 12:24: Message edited by: Glss ]


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Dom
Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK
Member Since: 19th Dec 2001
Total posts: 3009
Posted:Can't see videos due to silly bank security proxy server, but if Jay's being unkind to fish again maybe we should call the RSPCA or something?

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:*Bumping this up from months ago...*



Went into the depths of my cataloged moves that "I can't do yet" and busted out some tap backs. With huge fire wicks and lamp oil.



Big flames, no hair on hands, no burns (cuz my wicks have little exposed metal) and big fun.



When the wick is 'taped back' it gives off a bit of a fire ball. eek Be very friggin careful with these and fire. I do them with my kevlar bracers on but it totally depends on the type of wick and wicking you have. Don't close your fingers around it though... (for those of you that know ice hockey rules, it's about that level of timing)... I think you'd definitely burn off skin with a mid-large sized wick and pure coleman fuel.



Thanks Dom. I think I found my first signature Ubermove... tap-back into an under the leg wrist wrap. biggrin


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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musashii
musashii

starring Skippy the green llama
Location: Seattle, WA
Member Since: 14th Dec 2002
Total posts: 1148
Posted:Jay looks like the Tony Hawk of juggling, except angrier eek Lots of rage there ubblol

First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica

" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."

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TheWibbler
old hand
Location: New Zealand
Member Since: 11th Apr 2003
Total posts: 920
Posted:SO in poi I guess we need to define Tail Taps and Head Taps cos they produce quite different results

Spherculism ~:~ The Act of becoming Spherculish.

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joulz
joulz

enlightened
Location: montreal
Member Since: 6th Oct 2003
Total posts: 187
Posted:sigh** poi has so many names for so many moves and the only way to name them is to describe the motion and maybe give it an abreviation
now when u gyus talk about the alpha zee omega stuff or wtv i dont get why u would call it that but meh tongue if it makes u happy.
in addition to all this.. there is no way i will ever understand all the names u can have for moves. no1: cus i dont have any frineds that spin and no2: cus i dont ahvea visual + if u ahd to add all the variation.. sigh to much!!! spinning fire jsut like spinning glowstix creates a diff effect everyway u c it wether its live, on cam, or on film cus nothing can capture the beauty of wave of fire spinning around ones body and try to explain waht a BTB thread to needle and all that stuff to a newb and hell give up poi thinking its to complicated weavesmiley


it must be green

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Quote:
SO in poi I guess we need to define Tail Taps and Head Taps cos they produce quite different results



Well said. And actually I just realized that you can do head taps either with, or without releasing the finger strap. With socks I do a total release (so it's a bit of a weak throw) but with fire I keep my chains attached. Hrmm... Never realized that.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Delete

Achluophobia
Magical Sock Dancer
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Member Since: 1st Jul 2003
Total posts: 255
Posted:How about renaming things according to exactly what is happening, such as calling a (what ever the currnet name for hitting the head back) a um.... I'm short for a name now. I dunno, head tap with (insert what you use here).

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Dragon7
Dragon7

addict
Location: Aotearoa (NZ)
Member Since: 17th Oct 2003
Total posts: 625
Posted:A name is just a name.

Keeping it real...i dont argee with someone dictating what everyone should call something, i believe u should be able to call something what ever u want. In saying that i also believe it is ok to have a set of names and definitions, but who would dictate/ i mean decied that? The only real fair way would be to have polls and everyone vote on it(every move), but to also have exceptions, cause its the exceptions that make life real.

And while on the subject, i wanna nominate Arashi to have 1 free shot @ naming somthing, cause he's been going on about it for months ubblol



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arashi
arashi

Pooh-Bah
Location: austin,tx
Member Since: 21st Mar 2002
Total posts: 2363
Posted:all right then i nominate that every move be named according to it's appropriate variation on "slapping the wet fish. "
even is it has nothing to do with SWF, it shall thusly be called... SWF w/oslap, butterfly... or SLWw/oslap, TTN.
first time i read that i went eek eek eek ubblol then i realized you meant an actual move.
you people are SICKOS!!! ubbrollsmile


-Such a price the gods exact for song: to become what we sing
-Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty.
-When the center of the storm does not move, you are in its path.

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MillenniuM
MillenniuM

Hyperloops suck

Member Since: 10th Jul 2003
Total posts: 595
Posted:Quote:
sigh** poi has so many names for so many moves and the only way to name them is to describe the motion and maybe give it an abreviation
now when u gyus talk about the alpha zee omega stuff or wtv i dont get why u would call it that but meh tongue if it makes u happy.
in addition to all this.. there is no way i will ever understand all the names u can have for moves. no1: cus i dont have any frineds that spin and no2: cus i dont ahvea visual + if u ahd to add all the variation.. sigh to much!!! spinning fire jsut like spinning glowstix creates a diff effect everyway u c it wether its live, on cam, or on film cus nothing can capture the beauty of wave of fire spinning around ones body and try to explain waht a BTB thread to needle and all that stuff to a newb and hell give up poi thinking its to complicated weavesmiley



1. As a moderator would have told you if I didn't, please try not to use "u, c, cuz" while posting. There's plenty of people on the boards that either have english as a second language, or simply don't like it. Thanks smile

2. As for your post, I had no one around me to explain all of the moves and show me how to do them, but I managed. As long as you understand (and can preferably perform) all of the moves on the Lessons section (At the top of your page right now under "Free Lessons"), you can pretty much understand most of the stuff crazy people like PoiX3, Nx, Coleman and Bluecat are talking about. There's always a few that are completely different than those shown on the lessons (hyperloops, airwraps, throws, taps), but even most of those are pretty self explanatory. Except for hyperloops. They're very hard to understand through text, but that is what the Video forum is for! There's an aweful lot of videos that explain many of the things described in crazy posts like these, as well as other places for advanced lessons such as www.spherculism.com.

Try to visualize the text as much as you can. Get a first person view in your mind of what you'll be doing to recreate the text. Take it one step at a time and think clearly, you'll understand eventually. And it never hurts to just get a pair of poi in your hands and "spin it out"


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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Quote:
all right then i nominate that every move be named according to it's appropriate variation on "slapping the wet fish. "
even is it has nothing to do with SWF, it shall thusly be called... SWF w/oslap, butterfly... or SLWw/oslap, TTN.




I agree. Having just mastered "slapping the wet fish isolation in the middle of a 5 beat weave, without slap". Yet another way to confuse newbies. I love it. I really gotta learn the "slapless wet fish slapping waistwrap" damnit.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Delete

Dom
Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK
Member Since: 19th Dec 2001
Total posts: 3009
Posted:Enough nonsense about naming moves, it's not like anybody actually agrees on the names anyway!

New thing to play with:

2 beat weave with total isolation
Like most technical moves it is absolutly pointless and looks just like lots of other moves where your hands move in unattractive patterns, but then some people like that....
The basic move with one hand is a 2 beat weave. When the poi is crossing over from right to left - right hand on right hand side and poi head right in front of your face. Isolate the poi head completely by bringing your hand up and round the poi, so that right hand moves to left hand side of your body whilst the poi head doesn't move at all. Then let poi regain momentum and move to left hand side. Repeat on way back to right hand side. Then do with both hands.

On a more useful and movement orientated note: total isolations in the wall plane whilst turning 180 degrees are lush. Keep the poi by your shoulder.
Wheel plane alternate direction total isolations also quite nice, but not really so visual.


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Mr_Jedly
Mr_Jedly

member
Location: Perth, West Australia
Member Since: 29th Jan 2004
Total posts: 195
Posted:Here's an idea i've been trying to make work but have currently been unable to do so.
When you light up, instead of spinning off the extra fuel before lighting you keep it on the poi & somehow create a fireball for a nice intro?

It is done with staff all the time - just hold the staff horizontally between your hands & give it a spin & throw it up in the air - you get a nice looking fireball on each wick & it is a great intro.

Is anything like this possible with poi? confused
The only thing i've come up with is doing a butterfly like move & clipping the poi off of each other at the top of the arc - it doesn't really work though & only a small amount of extra fire is created... maybe i should use more flammable fuel as an initial coat...

anyone know of something like this? eek


We don't stop playing because we grow old,
We grow old because we stop playing.

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bluecat
bluecat

geek, level 1
Location: everywhere
Member Since: 15th Dec 2002
Total posts: 5300
Posted:yes.

use your chain like a whip. nice little fireballs.

bur MAKE SURE YOU CHECK YOUR SPLIT RINGS EVERY TIME YOU PLAY if you do this.

when i was into this i changed them every second night. and still panicked gently....

smileR


Holistic Spinner (I hope)

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[Nx?]
[Nx?]

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Europe,Scotland,Both
Member Since: 5th Nov 2001
Total posts: 3749
Posted:alternatvly, you could spend another 40p and get quicklinks....

spank bad kitty!

T wave


This is a post by tom, all spelling is deleberate
-><- Kallisti

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musashii
musashii

starring Skippy the green llama
Location: Seattle, WA
Member Since: 14th Dec 2002
Total posts: 1148
Posted:saw someone do a burnoff w poi on NYE, was amazed..not for the faint hearted eh..This guy simply spun off lit, split time. Not as much flying fuel as I expected, most ended up on the ground, not in the air..This was with white gas tho, dunno if I'd recommend it with lamp oil..O, n split rings suck, not safe for what we do..
EDITED_BY: musashii (1079683682)


First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica

" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."

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DeepSoulSheep
DeepSoulSheep

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Berlin
Member Since: 25th Sep 2002
Total posts: 2617
Posted:I keep meaning to try it but apparently if you give them a good kick with the outside of your foot inparting loads of spin on them, it does a burnoff. Makes sense I spose *shrug*

I live in a world of infinite possibilities.

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simian
simian

110% MONKEY EVERY TIME ALL THE TIME JUST CANT STOP THE MONKEY
Location: London
Member Since: 11th Oct 2002
Total posts: 3149
Posted:you can roll tubecore wicks along a surface to get them to burnoff but i never done it & i dunno know the details\dangers



Dom, your 2 beat with full isolations is NOT ugly. You just have an incomplete perception of beauty that's missing the aesthetics of geek biggrin



"it's pretty because it's hard" ubblol



The lovely thing about (attempting wink) full isolations is the rythym and speed changes i need to do. Float up to them really slowly then suddenly whanging my arm round as fast as i can. Last night i realised that i'd been doing something close to them for a little while (in fwd flowers), while trying to do sudden speed changes during each petal.


"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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musashii
musashii

starring Skippy the green llama
Location: Seattle, WA
Member Since: 14th Dec 2002
Total posts: 1148
Posted:turning flowers are the entry gate to isolations, no doubts there

First intention, then enlightenment..
Ars Pyronomica

" Life is programmed. Whether death is programmed or not is yet to be determined."

Delete

Page: 123

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