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glowshow


member
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA

Total posts: 406
Posted:I had to post this on it's own because i am really happy to have learned all of this.I got side to side BF transfers last night! WOOHOO! I can do regular ones where it kind of looks like a BF weave (couple of beats on each side), and the beautiful alternate BF transfer, where it bounces from side to side in front of you, then behind to one side, back in front of you, then around to the other side. Along with some of the other licks I have learned in the past few weeks, I now have enough BF stuff to make up half a set.
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(I have always been a little low on the BF moves)Oh, for those who were wondering, this is what Nightshade refers to as 'that thing that Jo Derry does.' There is a vid of it in the video section.I was so happy, I stayed up until 2 last night doing it over and over again, so I wouldn't lose it.*Goes off to wiggle and practice some more*------------------I feel more like I do now then I did when I got here.PLUR(RE) ---J---


FREE TIBET!!! (with the purchase of a 44 oz. drink)What do you want to be when you grow up?I want to be a kid again!I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.~~~J~~~

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Whiffle Squeek


Whiffle Squeek

addict
Location: Hartford, CT USA

Total posts: 416
Posted:WOOT!!!!!i just got that last night too, along with some horizontal BF stuff with some wraps!!!!!its so damn cool, i feel all special now, i share your joy GS!!!

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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NatalieUK


member
Location: England

Total posts: 3
Posted:HELP!!!!!!!!!!I really cant get this move, please explain how you do it.Cheers.

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Dom
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK

Total posts: 3009
Posted:Basically the butterfly normally spins in front of behind you (see lessons on this site). However you can spin the butterfly to your sides, alternating sides. Can also can be done with one hand behind the back.You can start by spinning a normal butterfly and turning your body, but keeping the butterfly where it is, then try moving it to the other side.If you go to a twirling meet then there will probably be somebody who can show you how.

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NatalieUK


member
Location: England

Total posts: 3
Posted:Thanks for that, i will try it.To be honest i thought they were talking about the split time butterfly...that i cant do. I read somewhere that instead of them meeting above and below they meet at the sides but i tried different things and still couldnt do it.I hope i have confused you!!!!

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Bendy


member
Location: Adelaide, SA, Australia

Total posts: 750
Posted:This is the three-point stuff right? I have done butterfly transfers a bit in the past, but don't try it that often. You inspired me to give it a shot and I got the split time butterfly transfer by accident. "How?" you might ask. In the words of Tone Loc "I dunno, it just kinda happened..."
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Natalie - do you mean just the split time butterfly? or the split time bf transfer?For the first pretend you are on the end of two long double-dutch skipping ropes.The second feels really unnatural to me, and I can't explain it!
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Courage is the man who can stop after only one peanut

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NatalieUK


member
Location: England

Total posts: 3
Posted:I am starting to get a bit confused.When i do the normal butterfly i do it like the lessons...left and right hand in opposite circles with pois swinging towards each other with my right hand on top and both in front of me.Split time ??????? i haven't got a clue what you mean. Do you change the rotation that you are swinging so they meet at the side? Is the action different then to what i am doing??Sorry but you know when you really want to do something!!!

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NYC


NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA

Total posts: 9232
Posted:Oh yeah, I guess I should learn that one at some point huh... thanks for the reminder. I always seem to forget the moves I want to learn next... I still can't thread the needle... I should put that on my list too...

Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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glowshow


member
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA

Total posts: 406
Posted:Yes, I was referring to the three point stuff. I forgot what it was called. Actually, it is on both sides, so I think it would be a 4 point. Hmm, I dunno. To get the split time effect while you are doing a BF, just alternate the bobbing of your hands. If you are doing a bf the right way, your hands should be together, palms in, and bobbing up and down. One string should cross before the other every time. For me, on an overhand (starting from forward circles) BF, my left hand is below and slightly in front of my right, so the left string crosses first. Do it and watch. Whichever string crosses first, that is the one that has to start the alternate bobbing. I'll explain it the way that would apply for the way I spin, and you can change it around if you do it opposite. When your hands are bobbing, keep a count like in music. For each down beat, count. i.e. One * Two * Three * Four* One, etc. What you want to do is barely stall the right hand at the top of the BF, so the left hand comes down first, and you have a split time count. i.e. One and Two and Three and Four and, etc. with the left hand dropping on the numbers, and the right hand dropping on the "ands." By saying the numbers and the "ands", the beat will be twice as fast, and you will notice that the poi will seem to bounce from side to side. To get back out of it, just stall the left hand on the "and" count, and resume with the One * Two * Three * Four. I hope that helped, Natalie. I think that is the simplest instruction I have seen to date on this site. I tried not to use the "quantum string physics" that seem to pop up from time to time.
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I'm terribly afraid that I can't explain the 3 point transfer *without* using quantum string physics. The best way to learn it is to practice side to side regular BF transfers first, so you can get used to where your hands need to be. Someone get Bassman to post the link to him doing the 3 point TTN.------------------I feel more like I do now then I did when I got here.PLUR(RE) ---J---


FREE TIBET!!! (with the purchase of a 44 oz. drink)What do you want to be when you grow up?I want to be a kid again!I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.~~~J~~~

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Whiffle Squeek


Whiffle Squeek

addict
Location: Hartford, CT USA

Total posts: 416
Posted:wow, thats so much more confusing than it actually is, just start with one hand doing the butterfly movement, then bring it behind you body, on the the same side, and let it do a rotation there, then bring it back to the front, and do a rotation there, then bring it across and behind you so now you arm is across your body, and the poi is spinning behind you, get that motion down, then do it with the other hand, now with both poi, get a split timing butterfly going(they meet at the sides not the top)and do those motions with your hands, when one crosses your body and goes behind the other goes behind on the same side, so youre keeping your hands together, its kinda of hard to get it down, but once you get down once, its very simple from that point on...:is going to try to get a vid of himself doing it, and then put a link to it:

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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glowshow


member
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA

Total posts: 406
Posted:I was just explaining how to do a split time BF.------------------I feel more like I do now then I did when I got here.PLUR(RE) ---J---

FREE TIBET!!! (with the purchase of a 44 oz. drink)What do you want to be when you grow up?I want to be a kid again!I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.~~~J~~~

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glowshow


member
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA

Total posts: 406
Posted:Here is the vid of Jo doing all this crazy stuff. http://64.87.7.217/displayreal.php?real=jo_derry56.ramNot
meaning to steal your thunder. Sorry. The side to side BF transfers are at the beginning, the split time stuff is in the middle.


FREE TIBET!!! (with the purchase of a 44 oz. drink)What do you want to be when you grow up?I want to be a kid again!I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.~~~J~~~

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Stone
GOLD Member since Jun 2001

Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Total posts: 2830
Posted:I love butterfly moves, but after reading this thread I'm really confused. So, are these moves based on using split-time TTN to go from a forward butterfly (say on left side) to reverse butterfly (say on right side)?Or are people somehow managing to keep poi in say forward butterfly on left and right sides, which I find difficult as poi seem to naturally want to go the opposite way when you change sides. When people say BF transfers, what are they transferring from or to? Thanks, any help appreciated
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If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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Stone
GOLD Member since Jun 2001

Stream Entrant
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Total posts: 2830
Posted:Ok, I should have read this thread more carefully. Whiffle Squeek's description really helped, especially that bit where "one crosses your body and goes behind the other goes behind on the same side" really helped. Go it, thanks heaps
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If we as members of the human race practice meditation, we can transcend our fear, despair, and forgetfulness. Meditation is not an escape. It is the courage to look at reality with mindfulness and concentration. Thich Nhat Hanh

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jonathan


enthusiast
Location: new zealand

Total posts: 210
Posted:that video of jo is qutie cool, but that butterfly stuff can be done in one hand toocool aye?what should we do with the other free hand?

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Whiffle Squeek


Whiffle Squeek

addict
Location: Hartford, CT USA

Total posts: 416
Posted:Stone- no problem, thats what were here for to help each otherJohnathan- im intrigued, you can do a split time butterfly one handed?ive never actually tried that, is it possible, basically all i can do one handed is over the head stuff, and im working on turning now, if you have any tips on it, id appreciate if youd share em...

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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Jaeden
GOLD Member since Sep 2001

member
Location: Edmonton, Canada

Total posts: 220
Posted:One handed split time butterflies are possible and fairly easy. Start with a normal bf and as split time is basicly a bf on it's side, give your hand a 90 degree twist and continue the same hand motions (only side to side instead of up and down). It kinda feels like waving a flag.

The world is not out to get you but if you fight it you will be eaten alive

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phunky


old hand
Location: Edmonton, AB

Total posts: 877
Posted:An easier way to start a one-handed split-time butterfly is, just transfer the poi over to your other hand while you're doing a split-time butterfly (easy enough
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)continue with that flag waving motion after the both your poi are in one hand.------------------[]Dhuong-Vu Truong==== []Dhunky ====


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PK_
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

PK_

Lambretta Fanatic
Location: , United Kingdom

Total posts: 4993
Posted:Whiffle Squeek- try one handed BF both forwards and reverse.once mastered...do a reverse one handed BF then do a couple of beats behind the head and then on the down swing turn to your left..now your into a forwards one handed BF
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not tried it the opposite way yet! gimme time.Also turns to the side are quite easy if you can manage behing the head turns..just try to keep the rotations as straight as possible otherwise you get them clashing right towards your face..would like to see jo to that butterfly transfer one handed..gonna get him to try next time i see himPK
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PK.

"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."

*Francois Couperin.

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jonathan


enthusiast
Location: new zealand

Total posts: 210
Posted:if you want to do butterflys i think it might be more useful to concentrate on doing the moves over the elbow rather than over the head, for me it opened up some new ways to do stuff. but basically the reason i suggest this is that when you get another butterfly going in your aother hand, the two are less likely to collide!!!.usually how i go into a split time butterfly is by stepping forward with my leading leg (dosent have to be a big step), bringing the hand over the elbow and taking it from there.hhhhmmmm having said that stuff about not going over the head though, there are lots of moves analougous to most of the simpler ones in the lessons, probably id say that most of the simple moves in the lessons section could give you an idea.the split time one handed butterfly is kinda the attack moves with the poi, get it? kinda meeting at the sides hopefully to bean someone in the noggin!!! p.s. whiffle, i put up the first four 4 poi moves i learnt in the moves section a while back, try it................[This message has been edited by jonathan (edited 26 January 2002).]

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Whiffle Squeek


Whiffle Squeek

addict
Location: Hartford, CT USA

Total posts: 416
Posted:thanks everbody, quite helpful actually...

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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MYMA


member
Location: blah, Togo

Total posts: 23
Posted:":is going to try to get a vid of himself doing it, and then put a link to it:"*wait's impatiently*

*Live as if you were to die tomarrow, learn as if you were to live forever* ~Mahatma Ghandi*Imagination is more important than knowledge*~Albert Einstein*dream*

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Tom
BRONZE Member since Sep 2001

Tom

member
Location: England

Total posts: 135
Posted:Jonathan.. over the elbow??? i don't follow.. which hand? which elbow? or am i just being thick??

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Whiffle Squeek


Whiffle Squeek

addict
Location: Hartford, CT USA

Total posts: 416
Posted:Orginally poasted by MYMA:*wait's impatiently*well you know, if my web cam worked, i would do it, but no!!!!i have to have piece o crap computer...

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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jonathan


enthusiast
Location: new zealand

Total posts: 210
Posted:tom, by over the elbow i mean basically holding your arm out straighter than you would when doing one of those over the head butterfly things, its the same move. if you were to do a butterfly in each hand and try do over the head moves with each hand, it requires a lot better timing and is a lot harder to do than if both arms were to go over the elbows... get it? the poi are less likely to tanglea move ive been trying out is where you have two butterflies and your standing with your left leg forward, now bring both poi/butterflies infront of your body in an under the elbow motion, with your left arm closest to your body, at the same time move your left leg back and put the weight on it. now as the poi come back shuffle your right leg back a bit, put youe weight on it and take a step back with your left leg..your garunteed to crack your shins a few good ones doing this, its quite tricky to get all 4 poi passing eachother cleanly, obviously this can be done on the other leg, or going over the elbow (dont forget to duck!!), but the coolest thing about it is that its the start of the infamous 4 poi weave. the good thing about one handed butterflies is you can have split time, or in time. and you can have your other hand doing the same spin rotation in sync or out of sync..........the mind bogglesoh well, off to make my sword handle
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Paddy


back from the dead...sort of
Location: 4341'N 7938'W

Total posts: 884
Posted:I'd never seen/heard of the side BF transfers before reading this thread...practicing it is a good way to bashed in the head, innit?-goes off to get some ice and possibly a helmet-

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PK_
BRONZE Member since Dec 2001

PK_

Lambretta Fanatic
Location: , United Kingdom

Total posts: 4993
Posted:360 split time b/f transfers now that feels so nice to do.Has any one else noticed that when you do the split time b/f transfer from side to side with no full rotation infront of you, that you dont have to move your hands or wrists... just keep every thing still and just twist your upper body.. they flow naturally between transfers!PKhttp://uk.geocities.com/poi_in_the_park_sheffield

PK.

"To be an angel, one need not have wings.
In giving love there is an equal grace.
Nor need one seek the aura in the face,
As love unveils the beauty of all things."

*Francois Couperin.

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Whiffle Squeek


Whiffle Squeek

addict
Location: Hartford, CT USA

Total posts: 416
Posted:yeah, same thing with overhead butterfly, you just move your hands back and forht, and the poi follow their patterns,ridiculously simple after you get it...

Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!

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glowshow


member
Location: Charlotte, NC, USA

Total posts: 406
Posted:PK, that is one of my favorite moves. A lot of the time when I spin, I am at a club. 4/4 beats, so I will go to the right, get a full 2 beats in the middle, and then go left, come back to the middle, etc. The effect is like cathing the 1 and 3 beats so it lets people know you are dead on time with the song. I do it a lot for break-ins on songs that I know really well. It looks good to go from flowing beautifully during a transition, and then wrap a wrist or something and flying into a 3-point when the beat kicks in.On a side note, I have teaching myself a lot more b-fly and TTN transitions lately. It has really improved my style. I usually do a lot of weave transitions and combos back to back to back, but it just feels so goooood to do a bunch of b-fly stuff! One of my new favorites is the "rolling b-fly." Basically regular and split-time BF turns, but on the way, I throw it between my arms. I think some one called it a contra-rotating buzzsaw before. Looks hella cool!
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When you do it split-time, it looks like the poi are going to chomp down on your head!------------------I feel more like I do now than I did when I got here.~~~Dance as if noone is watching!~~~PLUR(RE) ---J---


FREE TIBET!!! (with the purchase of a 44 oz. drink)What do you want to be when you grow up?I want to be a kid again!I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.~~~J~~~

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Morgane


member
Location: Austria

Total posts: 102
Posted:hmmmm i read it and my brain crashed... rebooted and read it again...brain crash....i don't get it the transition bit i mean. do u just twist your upper body and the butterfly stays where it is???
"critical system error hit strg alt delete"
Morgy


Out to Wrong Rights and Depress the Opressed.

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