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TaiGuy
member
Location: Yorktown, VA, USA
Member Since: 10th Feb 2001
Total posts: 127
Posted:For all of you that know how to do the btb weave, and especially those of you that just recently got it:I'm finally trying to get my btb forward weave (the one where you hit your shins, or the back of your head) after taking a break for tennis. I've read most everything on this site on it, and i can *sort of* visualize the moves in my mind, but i have no way of getting started on the learning path. Right now I'm just trying to be able to use each hand individually and be able to go across the back of my back without smacking myself (having moderate success). Now I have no idea as how to put the two together though. How should I start it off? Where do I begin? Oh the questions... Also do any of you have any good pointers for learning/doing the btb weave? As experimentation has shown me, that instead of crossing as far over to the other side and flat against your back, stay as far *out* as you can, just like you would in a weave in front of your body. That's about all I've figured out, thanx in advance!

The reason communism doesn't work is because people like to own stuff

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Superman
Superman

member
Location: Houston, Texas
Member Since: 13th Mar 2001
Total posts: 829
Posted:you and me both tai guy...i think the BTB weave is where the distinction is between someone who is good at poi and the "elite"That is the one move i have worked the longest on, and still havent come any closer to accomplishing. probably becasue i have never seen someone do it right in front of me, only on the site. if i can see a person doing a move, and i do it along with them, i can pick it up so much easier. I think we are missing one little tip that will make it all click. i know you have been trying it for a while as well, because i remember your first few posts about trying it..good luck.."S"------------------"Only the warrior that hears the call will know when to leave, Where to go" -unknown"We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dreams"- Willy Wonka

Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear--not absence of fear.


- Mark Twain

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protozoa
member
Location: Baltimore, MD USA
Member Since: 2nd Feb 2001
Total posts: 148
Posted:Here's how I did it; treated it just like learining any other move. It takes longer to learn this than any other I learned, but the steps are still the same.Start with one poi. With one arm try getting it around your back to the other side. Then try simple two-arm crossovers behind your back. Then try them in split-time. Then try doing them in split-time several times in succession. Then try adding that extra 'twist' to the one side, where one arm comes over the other and you're doing a full weave.One btb-weave-specific trick I've found is that it really helps if you stand with your feet right together and lean forward, bending slightly at the waist.Baby steps.
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And Superman I hate to be pissin in yer cheerios, but as someone who can _do_ the btb weave (in one direction, anyway) I have to say I strongly dislike your characterization of 'good' versus 'elite' and that somehow doing these btb moves will get you from one class to another. I think that's a rather off-track and limited/limiting way of looking at things, IMHO.


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Superman
Superman

member
Location: Houston, Texas
Member Since: 13th Mar 2001
Total posts: 829
Posted:Is that what that taste was this morning?? i thought the milk had gone bad..
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in my eyes right now, with what i know, when i see someone pulling of BTBW's, they to me are elite. Because i cannot do them..its just matter of perception. When i could only do a weave, and my friends were busting out the Butterflies, they to me, at the time, were elite. its just somethig that helps me..its sort of a goal setting thing i do. Maybe a bad choice of words. But how many beginners haveyou seen doing btb weaves? all the same....I consider you elite.."S"------------------"Only the warrior that hears the call will know when to leave, Where to go" -unknown"We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dreams"- Willy Wonka


Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear--not absence of fear.


- Mark Twain

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Superman
Superman

member
Location: Houston, Texas
Member Since: 13th Mar 2001
Total posts: 829
Posted:but i guess the more i think about it, when i finally nail that damn move..i will be far from elite. point well taken protozoa, not bad for a single celled organism..Super'
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p.s. your welcome to come over anytime for cheerios
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Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear--not absence of fear.


- Mark Twain

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adamrice
adamrice

poo-bah
Location: Austin TX USA
Member Since: 19th Dec 2000
Total posts: 1015
Posted:Yeah, what Protie said. I mean, hell, if I can do it, how 'elite' can it be?I can't do the 5-beat weave (I'd like to, I've tried), and in fact, I have never seen anyone else do it either, despite the presence of a lot of really damned good firedancers around here. Conversely, one of my local twirling friends relates to me how a novice twirler showed her how he could do the btb weave, which impressed her--but he couldn't do turns. Any kind of turn.I don't think the ability or inability to do a given move means anything more than that. And I'm kind of uncomfortable with the idea of an elite.The additional tips I can offer: you have to gyrate a fair amount. You need a little flexibility--I've seen (but cannot do) a yoga stretch where you put your palms together, fingers pointing up, behind your back. I stretch by grabbing my elbows behind my back. You also need to resign yourself to hitting yourself a lot. It helps to have a fair amount of momentum, which may mean you need heavier wicks.

Laugh while you can, monkey-boy

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Timmy
member
Location: Bishop's Stortford, UK
Member Since: 11th Jan 2001
Total posts: 45
Posted:Hey there Taiguy,When I was learning the btb weave, I found it SO much easier to learn the backwrd one first. The way it worked for me was this: Do a normal backward weave, then try to move it behind your back! Sounds really silly, and like I'm joking, but it works (you have to thik about how your hands go, you know, over-under-side-over-under etc..... and as other people have said, lean bit so as not to bash your head!). Once you are almost getting it, give up on it and do something else. Then do a fowards weave, and turn as you would to do a backwards weave, but btb instead. Et voila!! It all just seems to flow
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All I've got to do now is work out how to turn into a fowards btb one, and I can die happy
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Good luck, and don't give up! The first time makes your heart skip a beat! (?)Tim /|\


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Lamar
member
Location: Dacula, GA, USA
Member Since: 2nd Jun 2001
Total posts: 53
Posted:I tend to agree with Superman, Protozoa. Although I think elite may be a bad way of phrasing it. I will give some one a hell of a lot of respect when I see them bust out with something like that because no matter how well they flow I know for a fact that they are incredibly dedicated to spinning. As a fellow spinner I recognize these sort of qualities and it truly does put people like that in a higher category for me. Not only that, but it puts me in awe and I'm hella envious, so it is basically natural for me to just drop my jaw and go 'whoa man... you are straight badass'! You've seen big trouble in little china, haven't you? It is like a chinese girl with green eyes. A unicorn of sorts. The few, the proud, the elite!!
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Unfortunately, that was primarily off-topic and I can't contribute very much to the actual topic. I've just recently begun to work on btb weaves... so I'm doing it a hand at a time. As a side note that might help anyone else in the same place, I'm not just practicing btb xovers... I'm also practicing doing btb xovers on the opposite side of my body, tucking my hand under the arm that I'm not using. It keeps me from being bored, and the btb xover / btb-across-the-body-xover switch between forward and reverse spins so it keeps me more balanced. I hate being forward/reverse/left/right dominant with any move 'cause I feel that it limits me.


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pj
member
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, USA
Member Since: 8th May 2001
Total posts: 277
Posted:A little more fuel for the fire...A friend of mine picked up the BTB weave a few days after playing with poi for the first time. Oddly enough, he picked up the BTB weave before other "simple" moves such as the windmill and mexical wave.-p.

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Superman
Superman

member
Location: Houston, Texas
Member Since: 13th Mar 2001
Total posts: 829
Posted:i think ill just go home and practice now...dman, there is always a freak o' nature in the mix somewhere.and adam...im uncomfortable with gyrating. it wouldnt be a pretty sight... [image]http://www.homeofpoi.com/ubb/images/icons/grin.gif">Super'------------------[/image]"We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dreams"- Willy Wonka

Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear--not absence of fear.


- Mark Twain

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TaiGuy
member
Location: Yorktown, VA, USA
Member Since: 10th Feb 2001
Total posts: 127
Posted:yea, well my friend can do it since i got him interested in poi and glowstix, and he's just been practicing a hellavu lot more then me. NEwayz, he can do the forwards (shin bashing) btb weave, and he's pretty much got it down. But it doesn't help me when i see it, perhaps i'll video tape him later, and post a high-quality clip (where you can see what's going on
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). NEwayz, i had a dream last night (i woke up at 3:45 in the morning, got some water, filled up the cat's water dish, and went back to bed), from 3:45 till' bout 9 (swim practice) i had a dream where i visualized everything perfectly, i saw how everything went together, now just putting it together is the hard part. Now that i think about it, it's not that hard (in theory), but in practice it hurts quite a bit! ^_^NEwayz, good to hear you're trying it to Supa~


The reason communism doesn't work is because people like to own stuff

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s-p-l-a-t
member
Location: Brisbane, Qld, Australia
Member Since: 8th Mar 2001
Total posts: 383
Posted:Geez.. I can do the btb weave forwards and backwards and refuse to classify myself as 'good'. I've had crazy dreams where I've seen twirlers in outback Africa pulling off some crazy stuff and they, to me, are 'good'. (Some may have had more than two arms .. ) But anyway..my point is that I learnt them 2 months into firedancing learning and its very true - they ARE just like any other move. (It was thanks to this site I learnt them - I'd never seen anyone do it bar here)In fact I would say the fact that I had only learnt the forward and backward weave 8 weeks prior helped - I started with one poi and then gave it ago with the other and then attempted to make them flow in that weave type flow together. Cause I figured if you can't do it with one at a time then you can't attempt to do it with both (unless you enjoy a little pain
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)I didn't find it necessary to bend forwards - this seemed to just throw me off balance and confuse my hands. I tipped forward EVER so slightly and shuffled my feet (like a penguin !) to get out of the way when I was first learning - although now I find it impossible to do unless I wiggle my hips a little. (I didn't realise I was doing this until my partner alerted me to it
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)As protozoa said.. baby steps... they go a looong way.
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The beautiful thing about learning is that no one can take it away from you.- B.B.King

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Tree
member
Location: edinburghb
Member Since: 16th Nov 2002
Total posts: 12
Posted:Hey all you btb forward weavers - I only got this move YESTERDAY!!!!!!i was the same as many of you..... could visualise it and do it with each hand individually but not together. What got me through was practising the hand moves behind my back with out any poi, so that you can feel what your hands have to do - suddenly, as if by magic tree was doing a btb weave!WOOHOOpractise and you shall achieve

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Posted:knew to this place but i have a suggestion. when i saw it i picked it up the next day that is just how i am. but the exercise that i was told would help is to start out with one poi we will say it is in the right hand. no spin that on your left<opposite> side in front of you and then behind you and repeat back and forth with no stops in between. then get used to doing it with the other had then with both hands at the same time. i found that with the behind the back weave starting out that if you really overexaggerat your arm movements it helps to. by the way the exercise is supposed to help you to move your body in the right kind of rythm. hope it helps. i just heard of the 5 beat weave and cyclone lastnight. picked it up in about ten minutes now the tough part is trying that behind my back or the backwords cyclone.

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Shibaki
enthusiast
Location: Tampa, Fl
Member Since: 28th Mar 2001
Total posts: 309
Posted:Cyclone...That sounds neat, could you explain what it is? Ive never heard of that one before. ------------------We are not physical beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a physical experience.~Edgar Cayce

Wow

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Lamar
member
Location: Dacula, GA, USA
Member Since: 2nd Jun 2001
Total posts: 53
Posted:I think he is referring to a 4 beat windmill. I could definately see it being called a cyclone. Hmm... btb 4 beat windmill? Eek!!
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alterego
alterego

Warm beer is infinitely colder than no beer
Location: Boulder, Co
Member Since: 4th Jul 2001
Total posts: 222
Posted:I can do a btb butterfly and btb crossover and am close to getting a btb figure eight, being my point of topic. Before you learn the weave you gotta learn the figure eight. Dont over-achieve
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Love always,Spanky


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phunky
old hand
Location: Edmonton, AB
Member Since: 30th Jul 2001
Total posts: 877
Posted:I was curious, can any of you guys do the btb 5-beat weave?My friend can do it consistantly on forward and backwards and i recently nailed the forward one.

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space cadet
member
Location: Minneapolis
Member Since: 14th Nov 2001
Total posts: 19
Posted:Back on this thread...So I'm trying to get the btb weave, too. The weird thing, is that I can sit forever* in a figure eight, but just can't get the last swing to make it a weave. Also weird- I can do a figure eight a lot* more easily than just in-time crossovers- I get tangled all the time. I can't seem to picture how hands should go behind the back... even though it should be just like doing it in front, right? (forwards would be over-under-out and backwards would be under-over-out?)Bleh. Eventually...

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GaBBeRave19
member
Location: Alexander, Iowa
Member Since: 19th Sep 2001
Total posts: 72
Posted:i learned the BHB weave before the crossover or the figure 8. if u still insist that a crossover will help ur BHB weave first of all lean foreward like everybody keeps telling you, i didnt listen at first. start with a foreward swing and angle them inward if it keeps hitting your legs / \ and straighten em out if they are tangling | | find the happy happy medium and it should come naturally. if u cant get BHB tricks try adding weight or length and work ur way back to normal after u learn it.

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yashiro
member

Member Since: 21st Aug 2001
Total posts: 77
Posted:Okay, i wanna clear this thing up...I never started doing the figure 8 before doing the BTB weave... and I learned the BTB weave in one afternoon(september 29 can't forget that date)... wanna share my learning experience while it's still fresh in my mindMovements-) Swinging in forward...1-) found it easier to put left foot in front of my right one2-) don't try to do figure 8!!!3-) i first started to move my right poi to my left side and THEN i moved my left poi, so both went to the right side 4-)IMPORTANT=when the left poi is at the right side, MOVE your right hand BELOW your left hand4.b)while the right hand is below the left hand move it to your left and the left arm should move to your left too AND then UNDER your right hand and repeat the process(moving your body is a good advice)Facts(personal feelings)-you'll be most likely to swing your poi very slow 'cuz you're beginning -Try not to get pissed, won't help you-you'll be most likely to do this: try to swing your right poi but you can't... and end up swinging both poi normally-you WON'T be afraid to get hit!!! Cuz you can't see what u're doing behind your back!!-Extreme Frustration...-Don't give a damn if you feel like a stupid because u'll be moving your body A LOT!!Misc. Stuffs-USE jeans, and a jacket, cause you're gonna be hitting yourself a lot that it's isn't even fun. the hit zones are the back and knees-Practice 3-4 hours straight focusing ONLY with the BTB weave-I used to practice with staff and tried the back transfer for a few days, I don't know if that helped me-I didn't knew how to do the BTB butterfly before learning this(right know I"m practicing the BTB butterfly 4 wraps, and I can only do 2 wraps to end in reverse BTB butterfly and I can't do reverse BTB butterfly-Prepare for the pain that you're going to have for the next day!!!!-whatever BUT never, EVER, give up!!! -Feel happy that you can do a sloppy BTB weave in one day!!I don't think that 'elite' isn't the best way to describe a person who can do a BTB weave, I think that doing a BTB weave shows the passion that someone cares for twirling, so If you see a person learning the BTB weave you can expect a lot from them, You'll be doing crazy stuff when you learn the BTB weave, specially the wraps which it looks terribly magnificent. [This message has been edited by yashiro (edited 06 October 2001).]

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