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frostypaw
Great balls of fire
Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent
Member Since: 28th Jul 2003
Total posts: 643
Posted:Wednesday morning joke for y'all

----

At a dead halt in a traffic jam, one driver thought to himself, "Wow, this seems worse than usual."

He noticed a police officer walking between the lines of stopped cars, so he rolled down his window and asked, "Officer, what's the hold-up?"

The officer replied, "The President is depressed, so he stopped his motorcade and is threatening to douse himself in gasoline and set himself on fire.

"He says no one believes his stories about why we went to war in Iraq, or the connection between Saddam and al-Qa'ida, or that his tax cuts will help anyone except his wealthy friends; the press called him on the
lie about Iraq trying to buy uranium from Niger, and now Campbell Brown is threatening to sue him for a sexual innuendo he made at a recent press conference. So we're taking up a collection for him."

The lobbyist asked, "How much have you got so far?"

The officer replied, "About 14 gallons, but lots of folks are still siphoning."


I can SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Raymund Phule:
So POOF, I'm gone! I'll believe it when I see it. Or rather when I don't see it.

Goodbye.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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Bobo DCL
member
Location: Halifax
Member Since: 17th Aug 2003
Total posts: 141
Posted:Huh...

Well....

That was rather interesting, all though nasty at points.

I would say I hate humans right now, which, all though not *completely* true (it's generally a dislike to humans, all though I am one of the worst kinds -- a teenaged girl.) But I guess I'm positive, because right now, I can't think of anything but the joy that poi and HoP gives me.

And even at times like this I like it, because I like debates. Allthough I tend not to post in them, becuase I've noticed that the "debate" normally turns into a fight between two people with the rare poster in the middle.

HOWEVER, I did enjoy the jokes, just for the fun of it. Nothing was ever meant personal, until someone took it to offense.

The truth is, humans will poke at eachother until we become extinct. It's society. It's the world. It's humans!

So, in good nature, with a light heart, I wouldn't mind more jokes! They're a laugh when I tell my parents.

But remember just that. It is in good nature, intended to be taken with a light heart, I'm sure.


I like orange.And don't take my cookies.

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Kaji
Kaji

Quantum Theorist
Location: Vansterdam
Member Since: 12th Dec 2002
Total posts: 564
Posted:WTF just happened? how did a joke tern into this?

Ok so:

An English man, an Irish man, and a Scotsman walk into a pub. The bartender looks up and says: "What is this? A joke or something?

lets see what I can start with this.

And if that doesn't do it this should. If you can condone leveling two poor as dirt middle eastern countries. I can condone flying some airliners into some buildings. tis the law of karmic return.
For ever mind the rule of three whatever you do comes back to thee.
- wage war on a country and leave them with nothing but the ruins
- So planes into buildings
- Level a couple countries
- Now I'm waiting for the dirty bomb or backpack nuke being set of in times square or some place in DC.
You see how stupid this is becoming


In the 60's people took acid to make the world weird, now the world is weird and they take prozac to make it normal again.

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Beth
Beth

Miss Whippy
Location: Cornwall & Oxford
Member Since: 3rd Jun 2003
Total posts: 1262
Posted:Ray is... gone??

I can feel a black cloud lifting from HoP!

There it goes... POOF!


Aim high and you'll know your limits, aim low and you'll never know how high you could have climbed.

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Matthew B-M
Matthew B-M

Lemon-Aware Devilstick-wielding Operative
Location: East London Wilds
Member Since: 9th Jul 2003
Total posts: 605
Posted:This is a long ramble on the nature of respect, feel free not to read it: (sorry to spoil the jokes)

In the last two or three years, my line of business (programming computers) hasn't been doing so well. I guess it's pretty obvious why (dot-bomb etc). The company I've been working for for almost that long has been getting slowly more hard-up, as contracts have got tighter and tighter, and clients are quibbling every last little bit of our invoices. The people who founded the company are good at the computer side, but not so wonderful at business.

So, a few months ago, we were told that a new MD (from outside) had been appointed, and that he was going to be injecting on the order of a half a million quid into the company. We were told of this on a Tuesday afternoon, and he was going to start the following Monday (though obviously the preparations had been a month or so before). His first action as pre-MD was to call a meeting for this Monday at 8am (an hour and a half outside my contracted start time), with the clocks having gone forward that weekend.

This, as you can imagine, did not go down hugely well with a tech company, but, with salaries cut, we all made it. (I ought to add that at this point, my normal journey was taking about an extra half as long as it normally does again, due to the Central Line shutdown in London).

There was nothing particularly special about this meeting, it was for this MD character, Ronald, to introduce himself to us as a whole (without disruptions). Some of the things that were said were extremely divisive, though not overtly so.

2 days later, he'd basically decided that 4 people have to be made redundant (I'm not among them). 3 of them are there, one is on holiday. The one who is on holiday is the head of sales. So we need to appoint a new one. And of course, a small effort is made to contact her and talk to her, but... you get the idea. Now, if this was just lacking in respect, that would be pretty bad, but it's actually a problem under UK employment law. She hadn't done anything sackable, and her position wasn't being made redundant, so he was just opening us up for a huge lawsuit.

The next week, the office was in some chaos, because none of the people who were supposed to have any clue what was going on were in. For a week. Sometime towards the end, we were told that we were having another 8am Monday meeting (can you say "Power games", boys and girls), and it was strongly hinted that we were expected to start wearing suits to work. This is not the company I joined.

So we had this monday morning meeting, and the atmosphere was visibly depressed. Ronald still hadn't put in any cash (it was becoming questionable to some of the upper management whether he had it), and he had decided that we were "all in sales", and was giving us a sales lecture, at 8am on a Monday. Moreover, everyone except myself and two of the three former directors had, indeed turned up in suits. With some deference, I had kept a jumper on over the one t-shirt I have with f**k written on it, ready to take it off if need be, with the excuse that to get in for 8am, I was more bleary eyed than normal, and picked the first thing I could find off the pile. (2 can play power games).

It was decided that the newly formed R&D group, of which I was to be a member should have an 8am meeting the next day. This would have been fine, ish, but the person who was supposed to be chairing it, didn't turn up (later turned out to be told not to by Ronald). Meanwhile, I had sorted out a job interview that evening, and many people were planning to leave, as characters had become eroded.

It came to a head when Ronald came into the office at lunchtime, obviously fuming. I was in the middle of a how-are-we-going-to-do-this-contract discussion with the person who was supposed to come in to chair the meeting on the phone. Anyway, an impromptu meeting was called, and he started ranting about how he was putting in days and nights for "the business", and he, personally, deserved nothing less than absolute loyalty for it. (wasn't he wonderful).

He then started singling me out (in front of the 30-odd people in the office), as someone who "wasn't giving him respect and loyalty". I was mostly gob-smacked, as, this kind of onslaught is, well, unusual at best. It was obvious what I should have said, which was, "fire me, and I'll see you in court", but such things only come to you after the event. I was still putting in lots of work for the company at this point, and I didn't want to let my colleagues down. (we're massively understaffed anyway, losing any member of the team is a significant blow). He denied that he was picking on me, and stood a couple of feet from me screaming at me. I could see a colleague mouthing "WTF is he on" over his shoulder as he's shorter than I am.

This went on, but I kept the tears back. Eventually my boss appears (as chairman of the board of directors) and "has a word", they came out from the private meeting room in the middle of this, and my boss basically said, "I'm not going to see my staff treated like that, I didn't ask you to manage, I asked you to invest". It ended up with him walking out of the building. We reinstated the previous head of sales (remember her?) that afternoon.

So, there's the story (this is an edited version of it, but it's how it happened more-or-less), and in the telling, it's hopefully obvious why Adam, my boss, deserves respect:
* he controlled his anger, and tried to be detached
* he stepped in to solve a problem that he could solve for someone else, it didn't really affect him, in some ways
* he hasn't gone out of his way to be nasty in the first place
* he treats people as people
* when I broke down after Ronald had gone, he was there to try and be comforting

And Ronald, well, what of him, why did he not get my respect:
* the way in which he made people redundant, and the lack of understanding of their position in the company (it was basically on gut feeling)
* the stupidity of opening us up for a lawsuit that we were bound to lose, when we could least afford it
* the complete lack of communication of what was going on in his ivory towers about the changes that he was trying to make
* power games of 8am Monday meetings (after a clock change)
* trying to change the ethos of the company, and, to some extent, the work ethic.
* shouting at staff, in front of everyone in the company, and demanding respect and loyalty (demanding it just makes it harder to give, as I found), basically, this was an attempt to humiliate me into submission. It wasn't going to work, though what would have happened if Adam hadn't stepped in, I don't want to know.

I hope my colleagues realised that I tried to earn their respect with this:
* I tried to act in the way which would minimise their loss if I left.
* I let them all know that I wanted to leave pretty badly, and couldn't cope.
* I did the work that they passed my way wherever possible to the best of my ability (and warned that I wasn't sure that this would be the best work I did, because of the point above)
* I didn't break down and I didn't back down, but I didn't go in guns blazing to Ronald during his attack on me. (part of this was stupefaction, but part was not wishing to turn the blaze to anyone else).

What I realised, stepping out of this, is that respect (and loyalty) must be earned, and that it is earned through actions not words. It's all very well to say something, but if you don't follow it up, then you will, ultimately end up losing respect. Some respect is deserved with people who haven't proved themselves either way by their actions, but don't let that deceive you that they necessarily deserve respect after their actions have shown their true colours.

The story above is extreme, and hopefully something similar will never happen to you, but let this be a warning to you, it is almost only in extreme situations where you really understand the true meanings of respect and loyalty.


Luv 'n' Lemons
purity :: clarity :: balance

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Kaji
Kaji

Quantum Theorist
Location: Vansterdam
Member Since: 12th Dec 2002
Total posts: 564
Posted:quote:Originally posted by NYC:
quote:Originally posted by Raymund Phule:
So POOF, I'm gone! I'll believe it when I see it. Or rather when I don't see it.

Goodbye. I'll believe it when I see it to


In the 60's people took acid to make the world weird, now the world is weird and they take prozac to make it normal again.

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frostypaw
Great balls of fire
Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent
Member Since: 28th Jul 2003
Total posts: 643
Posted:That's quite a story Matthew!

This bit made me laugh tho
{quote]With some deference, I had kept a jumper on over the one t-shirt I have with f**k written on it, ready to take it off if need be, with the excuse that to get in for 8am, I was more bleary eyed than normal, and picked the first thing I could find off the pile. (2 can play power games).[/quote]
I'd have been giggling and trying to find a reason to take my jumper off all week!

It's Very odd how jokes and respect mix though to me

stage 1: no respect: lots of jokes
stage 2: gaining respect: the jokes dry up...
stage 3: respect earnt: the jokes come back and if anything get more personal!



people are strange.


I can SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

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Matthew B-M
Matthew B-M

Lemon-Aware Devilstick-wielding Operative
Location: East London Wilds
Member Since: 9th Jul 2003
Total posts: 605
Posted:Certainly with people I'm closest to, the jokes are fine, just because you know what people's limits are. I'm not sure it's necessarily about respect, so much as about friendship. But I see what you're saying.

Oh, and believe me, I was trying to find an excuse to do it. Ronald claimed (I'm not sure how much he's living on this planet, to be perfectly honest, the things I've heard about him since then make everyone think this even more) to be a christian, and disliked swearing enormously. So I'd need to do it right in front of him. But yeah, the whole thing was pretty horrendous at the time, I guess it's just good that I can laugh about it now...


Luv 'n' Lemons
purity :: clarity :: balance

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Dirty Marmite Spider
Dirty Marmite Spider

Climbing up my leg
Location: England
Member Since: 17th Sep 2002
Total posts: 141
Posted:Post deleted by Dirty Marmite Spider

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Captain Hazzard
Captain Hazzard

Ninja (shhhh, don't tell)
Location: Truro, UK
Member Since: 3rd Jan 2003
Total posts: 420
Posted:i think i'm gonna miss ray a little bit. i've really enjoyed reading his arguments, mainly with frosty!

its always good to hear someones opinion, especially if those opinions are the polar opposite of your own.

having said that, he did have a special way of alienating folk!


I only wanted to be 16... and free

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pavement
member
Location: york, uk
Member Since: 17th May 2003
Total posts: 121
Posted:Hop is a much nicer place without him..

Goodbye and good riddance.........


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frostypaw
Great balls of fire
Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent
Member Since: 28th Jul 2003
Total posts: 643
Posted:yeah i'm not the best at keeping my mouth shut when someone says something i think is out of order not sure it's a good thing

I can SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

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pavement
member
Location: york, uk
Member Since: 17th May 2003
Total posts: 121
Posted:Frosty vs. Ray is certainly an amusing read, thats for sure...

I just dont understand why he comes here, his views go against everything this site stands for..


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Dom
Dom

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Bristol, UK
Member Since: 19th Dec 2001
Total posts: 3009
Posted:DMS - I know what you're saying, but that's an ideal situation, and this wasn't one of those.

Ray has been on this board for a nearly 2 years now, and he started out being worse than this - just plain agressive. There was a period where he mellowed out a bit, he did learn a lot, but it always seemed to me that the true Ray was just been masked. He has "got some of the joy out of HoP that we all get". In fact he got an extra spcial helping of joy from it. But I don't think he learn't that much from it, or he'll always be on a totally different wavelength to all of us.

There's only so much you can do to help somebody, only so much of your own energy you can expend on someone else before it becomes too much of a drain. At some point you have to accept that you can't do anything more. A lot of us did try to talk to Ray on a level, but it never really worked. Unfortunately some just insulted him, and that never helped, in fact it reinforced his desire to be the 'anti' sentiment on HoP. So that's a lesson to us all: you'll never change someone by using negativity. And if you were being negative just to piss him off then shame on you.

And I know Ray will be reading this, so hello to you. One thing you said struck me in all this. Ray - this is real life. You, sat there, reading this forum and posting to it, not posting to it, is real. Every second of your life is very much real. Every act, every motion, everything you do is an expression of who you are. Everything, from how you pick up a pencil, post to this board or talk to your friends, is part of that expression. Scott, you are Raymund Phule.


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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Well said Dom.

I'm actually a bit impressed by the number of comments, on list and by PM, indicating how offended so many people were by Ray's presence. I wonder why nobody said anything sooner.

I do, however, feel that Ray's exit is best for Ray as well.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

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Rouge Dragon
Rouge Dragon

Insert Champagne Here
Location: without class distinction
Member Since: 21st Jul 2003
Total posts: 13215
Posted:probably because he would have gotten angry and an argument would have occured, which intimidated and scared off a lot of the peope who PMd you and commented in the list (including myself)

i think its sad that hes left completely, i would have liked to see a repeat of the nice stage (since i wasnt here for it), but i understand from Dom's post that it didnt turn out too well. aw well...


i would have changed ***** to phallus, and claire to petey Petey

Rougie: but that's what I'm doing here
Arnwyn: what letting me adjust myself in your room?..don't you dare quote that on HoP...

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Dentrassi
Dentrassi

ZORT!
Location: Brisbane
Member Since: 9th Apr 2003
Total posts: 3044
Posted:reading down the posts, it really was the 'push peoples buttons' things which provoked me.

friends are there to support, care for, love, and respect.
they are to be generous and considerate.
'pushing buttons' is not friendship. its not funny.
its not constructive.
its hurtful.
its sick.

i have made some wonderful friends here. some of whom i have met, many i will meet next year. i joke around with many - but i know where to draw the line. theres are difference between hilarious and spiteful - check out some of my posts with Patrick and Mechhead if you need an example.

theres also so many good souls and helping hands here.

people to help you when you need a hug, a shoulder to cry, have had bad news, when a major dream has been shattered, when you need a guiding light, to call you when your so tensed up that your about to explode, and they make you giggle.

these are my type of people. the friends i have in the real world are the same type of people.

theres so many good souls i can have a serious chat to, without personal insults, provokation, an derision. we have different views, but are still friends.

but maybe im just a non christian bisexual australian guy who doesnt know what the f*&% im talking about. good bye ray.


"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.

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flid
flid

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Warwickshire
Member Since: 27th Aug 2002
Total posts: 3136
Posted:thanks for writting your story mathew, was a good read. Is it a coincidence that ronald shares his name with the famous mcdonald? Whilst reading it i had this picture stuck in my mind of an evil guy in clown suit with a fake smile. Perl/C network programing not so good anymore? F***, time to start moonlighting on some other people's courses then.....

The whole "I'm leaving" tantrum is a bit of a deja vu thing, I'll beleive it when i see it.


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Matthew B-M
Matthew B-M

Lemon-Aware Devilstick-wielding Operative
Location: East London Wilds
Member Since: 9th Jul 2003
Total posts: 605
Posted:flid: Ronald> we think not. We had a whole load of names for him, but yeah, as soon as he left, no one took him seriously.

It's not actually clear whether he had the money he was claiming that he wanted to invest. Opening his bank statement in front of the directors of the company he's going to invest in and saying "how can the bank possibly lose a half-a-million pounds?" is probably a bad sign in retrospect. You only learn such things with hindsight, though.

I'm glad I can laugh about it now

As to Ray, I've tended to avoid the threads where he's been posting so I'll keep out of that argument, but I have seen the "I'm leaving" kind of thing before. Sometimes it's true, sometimes not. I, personally, think it's a great pity that Ray couldn't get the same enjoyment out of HoP as some of the rest of us. I know I wouldn't have made as many friends as I have in spinning if it hadn't been for HoP...


Luv 'n' Lemons
purity :: clarity :: balance

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Posted:Matt, harsh m8, so unprofessional of him!

As to Ray....

I think every message board I've posted on has contained a couple of trolls of some description, and unfortunately Ray filled this space. I may not have been posting on here long, but from what your all saying you can recognise the signs.

What I think is great about HoP is that the number of troll's is tiny! I was amazed that there was only one (that I know of! ), and the sense of friendliness is just amazing!

I think this is due to the fact that a fair number of us meet up every week / month / whatever, we spin together and go out to the same parties, I know this is true of the London based spinners, and I think that really does add more of a sense of comunity and friendship to the site and this stops trolls, lets face it you don't slate someone's opinion if your gonna be seeing them in the next week!

You can have a good discussion and there are some spirited debates but it's all good natured really and just the free flow of ideas.

So, I guess this leads to a question, did anyone ever meet up with Ray regularly, or spin with him at all?

If so then my theory sucks.
If not ...

But that's just a n00bies two'peneth!

PsyB.

[ 04. November 2003, 06:12: Message edited by: Psylent_BoB ]


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Matthew B-M
Matthew B-M

Lemon-Aware Devilstick-wielding Operative
Location: East London Wilds
Member Since: 9th Jul 2003
Total posts: 605
Posted:Yeah, but Psylent_BoB, you're wrong, even if I'm going to have to see you tomorrow. And [Nx?] is still a glowstick ponce

(ducks and runs very very fast )


Luv 'n' Lemons
purity :: clarity :: balance

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Posted:*swings for Matt misses, gets tangled in his Poi and falls over*

I woulda gotten away with it, if it wasn't for you pesky kids!

PsyB.


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simian
simian

110% MONKEY EVERY TIME ALL THE TIME JUST CANT STOP THE MONKEY
Location: London
Member Since: 11th Oct 2002
Total posts: 3149
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Psylent_BoB:
lets face it you don't slate someone's opinion if your gonna be seeing them in the next week!Thats the most stupid thing i've ever heard. What are you, some kinda moron?

edit: dammit, got to that joke just a touch too late... damn you Matthew DAMN YOU

on a more serious note (puts on serious hat)...

Ray wasn't just trolling (usually), despite what he said about getting a rise out of people. He did believe in what he said.

When you read a load of opinions that you strongly disagree with it's very easy to get frustrated. It's then very easy to vent that frustration with a post thats a bit mean and angry sounding. I think that was the case with Ray rather than deliberately attempting to piss people off (usually).

i think HoPs better off with a devils advocate (strange term to use considering Ray's side in the religous arguments), though possibly one that could structure their arguments in a less confrontational manner.

And i'm not liking the 'putting the boot in' reactions from some toward him. There are comments on this thread far nastier than anything i've seen Ray post.

But i bet you a wine gum that we haven't seen the last of Mr Phule.

Till then, see ya Ray


"Switching between different kinds of chuu chuu sometimes gives this "urgh wtf?" effect because it's giving people the phi phenomenon."

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Posted:quote:Originally posted by simian:
Thats the most stupid thing i've ever heard. What are you, some kinda moron?
Oh thats IT!

see this...

*pulls out a can*

This is a can of whoop-ass(tm)...

see you tuesday boyz!

PsyB.


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coleman
coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay
Member Since: 29th Aug 2002
Total posts: 7330
Posted:i don't believe ray will stay away either which i also believe is not a 100% bad thing.

i thought it was random as hell when i stumbled across this thread - load of jokes, ray rants about something unrelated and then backpedals, nyc steps up to the plate in the defense of sanity, ray leaves the park for good.

i've been in arguments with ray and even been insulted and threatened with violence if we should ever meet (and that was over a misreading of of a post directed at someone other than ray himself).

after the last discussion i had with ray i decided (similarly to dom) that i was spending a great deal of my time and energy trying to have a reasoned discussion with someone that was not interested in debate but only in preaching his own values and opinions.

i wish you all the best scott.

god bless america (which inadvertantly means 'god bless raymund phule' ).



"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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NYC
NYC

NYC
Location: NYC, NY, USA
Member Since: 26th Aug 2001
Total posts: 9232
Posted:Then again... if Ray's been anything, he's been a man of his word. If he says he's leaving, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

I dont think he'd lie about something like that.


Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]

Delete

frostypaw
Great balls of fire
Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent
Member Since: 28th Jul 2003
Total posts: 643
Posted:quote:this stops trollsthat and we don't reward bitchiness here... people call a spade a spade which really helps

someone coming on with a problem isn't told to "get a life" etc

seems to me like there's two types of trolls:
1. idealists who preach their wonderful utopian way of life, which is usually an incredibly inconsiderate 'one-mans' utopia
2. suprarealists who are usually the knowingly inconsiderate with a philosophy of 'just deal' and 'its the bloody internet, why are you letting it bother you'

lots of usuallys in there to point out i'm generalising wildly, just a kinda pattern i've seen and luckily an attitude i've not seen much amoung the spinning/festivals communities thus far!

people hug and try to care for each other - madness


I can SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

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MiG
MiG

Self-Flagellation Expert
Location: Bogged at CG
Member Since: 16th Apr 2004
Total posts: 3415
Posted:*CoughCoughwhathappenedtothejokescough*

The way i look at it is this: some people will always be nice, and some people will always be pricks. thats life, thats people. As has been said, if everyone got along then life would be boring as.


"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie

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MiG
MiG

Self-Flagellation Expert
Location: Bogged at CG
Member Since: 16th Apr 2004
Total posts: 3415
Posted:ok, sorry for double posting, but heres one:

This Aussie guy is sitting at a bar, having a beer. A tourist walks up, and starts talking to him. The Aussie, lets call him bob, looks up from his beer, and says 'you know its weird, the way names work. I built this bar, by hand, from scratch, but do they call me bob the bar builder? no. See that jetty out there?' He points to a massive, solid jetty outside. 'I built that, too, by hand, but do they call me bob the jetty maker? nooo.' He pauses, and has a drink of his beer. 'Hell, i even built most of the boats that are tied to the jetty, but do they call me bob the shipwright? no. But you screw one sheep...'


"beg beg grovel beg grovel"
"master"
--FSA

"There was an arse there, i couldn't help myself"
--Rougie

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The_Pirate_Dyke_Boy
The_Pirate_Dyke_Boy

HOP Lord of the Pirate Admiralty
Location: Canterbury, UK
Member Since: 5th Nov 2002
Total posts: 1079
Posted:i think the problem Mr. Phule, is that a lot of people voted for Bush to do the right thing in office. and he's done nothing but screw up, choke on pretzels and drop his dog on his head.
(how do you trust a man with the nuclear button when you can't trust him with a dog?)

anyway, back to my point, a lot of people trusted him, and he's let them down. and i think you'l agree its hard to respect someone when they've let you down and lost your trust.

but thats just my opinion from acroos the pond. perhaps your enjoying your combat pay and hazardous duty bonus.
gimmie a list of the reasons i should like him, and maybe ill think about it, but i cant find any reasons.

but hey wait, you gotta give Bush Kudos, cuz i wouldnt have had the balls to kill retards on death row, hes got real will power for that.

www.punkvoter.com


D.B.
X x X x X

Ship off the starboard! sound general quarters! noise and light discipline! man the cannons! GET ME THE RUM!

Master of the Free Hug Program

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