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Narr


Narr

(*) (*) .. for the gnor ;)
Location: sitting on the step

Total posts: 2568
Posted:i know a while ago there was a discussion on (now im gonna spell it really wrong!)circumsision(?!)(and yes i see all you boys cringing and cowering in fear! ) but i have just found out something really cool..did you know that scientists can now grow sheets and sheets of skin from the foreskin of a newborn ?!bet ya didnt!and its used to treat the scars of burns victims etc how cool is that!a good reason for circumsision dont you think?!!



she who sees from up high smiles

Patrick badger king: *they better hope there's never a jihad on stupidity*

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Dentrassi
GOLD Member since Apr 2003

Dentrassi

ZORT!
Location: Brisbane

Total posts: 3044
Posted:quote: Sorry Dentrassi, but we are here now oh well, the only reason i actually mentioned it thrice is cos im procrastinating instead of doing uni assignments, and will do anything to distract myself.

happy debating!!


"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.

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telic


I don't want a title.


Total posts: 940
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Psylent_BoB:
It is a bit worrying to me that on the one hand many people are up in arms about female circumcision, which I agree is also wrong, but male circumcision is just brushed aside as something "cultural". Either way you look at it their both mutilation of an unwilling (in most cases) party... You may be right about male circumcision being wrong - I'd have to read up on medical studies before I could offer an informed opinion.

But you have to understand that cutting off the clitorous (this is what is known as female circumcision) is more akin to cutting off the entire penis. Cutting off the clitoral hood would be like cutting off the foreskin, and if that's all they did, then we could compare and discuss. As is, since the Western world does not castrate males in the name of culture, there can be no comparison.

::quietly goes back to work::

[Edited for poor syntax.]


E pluribus unum, baby.

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Narr


Narr

(*) (*) .. for the gnor ;)
Location: sitting on the step

Total posts: 2568
Posted:SlightlySinged - everything i was gonna say has been very well put by regyt and vanize. sorry matey but you just can compare those to things.

Dentrassi - i should have put that link in at the beginning but it wasnt supposed to end up as a debate about the good and evil of the foreskin. just wanted to include some cool science stuff!



she who sees from up high smiles

Patrick badger king: *they better hope there's never a jihad on stupidity*

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Dentrassi
GOLD Member since Apr 2003

Dentrassi

ZORT!
Location: Brisbane

Total posts: 3044
Posted:ive notice topics on interesting science stuff usually evolves into big ethics debates....or doesnt evolve at all.
i thought my sciency thread on Ig Nobel Prize was most amusing but only got 1 reply .
besides usually when i post comments on sciency stuff i go way too technical and confuse everyone else. oh well.

back to the debate....


"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.

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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:That is certainly the case Dentrassi. Every so often one merely becomes metephysical instead of ethical and continues to propagate in that regard.

Getting back to Narr's original post and the fact that we are fire performers - how would you like to end up in the burn ward wraped up in someone's foreskin?


-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

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Posted:quote:Originally posted by regyt:
But you have to understand that cutting off the clitorous (this is what is known as female circumcision) is more akin to cutting off the entire penis. Cutting off the clitoral hood would be like cutting off the foreskin, and if that's all they did, then we could compare and discuss. As is, since the Western world does not castrate males in the name of culture, there can be no comparison.That is a fair point, for me personally (and trying not to get to graphical) that bit of me old fella is probably the most sensitive and stimulating (that sounds so dodgy!!! ) and I certainly couldn't imagine being without it.

I understand that female circumcision is removing a whole gland, not just giving it a "short back and sides" but even that would leave me significantly less sensitive, and still genital mutilation is genital mutilation. I have read cases of extreme female circumcision where the girl is literally sown up (leaving a small hole for the usual business) to be cut open by her husband on her wedding night.

To me it doesn't matter what bit of whoever is being removed, it's when it's being practiced on children who can't vocalise their opinions / fears / reservations I cannot condone it in any way, shape, or form...

I would like to point out that if someone wants to do this to themselves then I have absolutely no problem with it at all, their adults and can make their own decisions, but children of 5 and under being forced to under go this, doesn't that count as child abuse?

PsyB.

[Edited - damn quote tags ]

[ 22. October 2003, 03:07: Message edited by: Psylent_BoB ]


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rajiv_sinhain


member
Location: india

Total posts: 18
Posted:sorry dentrassi,, its nothing but to give pain to a child

live life happily


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vanize
SILVER Member since Aug 2001

vanize

Carpal \'Tunnel
Location: Austin, Texas

Total posts: 3899
Posted:it's not really a gland (there is a difference beteen the term glans, a type of tissue that swells with increased blood flow, and gland, which secretes some bodily fluid or other) - more like a nerve bundle stylized in form. The clitorous is a wonderous thing in that it exists for no purpose other than to give a woman sexual pleasure, which makes it even more specialized than what us males have.

I do have to agree with PBob to an extent though. I don't think it is child abuse per se (much more than the whole battery of immunizations the por infant must also deal with), but in that it is done unwillfully to the patient for marginal benifits is not quite right. I am not about to question the Jewish religion for continuing to practice it though, and more than I am going to tell Catholics they shouldn't baptize their kids until he/she is old enough to make their own mind up in the matter. It is a significant rite in their religion, and does no long term harm.


-v-

Wiederstand ist Zwecklos!

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:i agree with infant circumcision.
for several reasons.
i can also see that some men may come to resent it as they become adults.
i personally would not make the decision for my child unless i become an orthodox jew in which case i would insist that the rabbi performing the ceremony was medically trained (as many are i might add).

however, you might want to disregard my views as i also agree with docking the tails and clipping the dew claws of working dogs when they are puppies.
it's illegal in the uk now

[ 22. October 2003, 03:25: Message edited by: coleman ]


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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funkymonky


funkymonky

member
Location: oxford

Total posts: 192
Posted:i'd personaly say if it was there at the begining, its there for a reason... putting the personal view here, so don't think i'm having a go either way, but from a personal view, i'd prefer to have the end of my penis there. the hygene thing is just rubbish, as anyone not washing properly and paying attention is going to get debris going on regardless of their foreskin being there or not.

simply out of interest, and with obviously no discriminations either way, but what do the women/ bi gay guys of the board prefer? does it matter? can you tell the difference? would it stop (or start) you getting down to business once you find out the guys lacking in the end of his judgement stick?


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SlightlySinged
GOLD Member since Jun 2003

member
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Total posts: 82
Posted:Okay, okay, clitoris/foreskin comparison was a tad extreme. But I think you got my point. Pick something smaller then. Pick ANY thing, ANY part of a female child's body. If there was some benefit to medical science by lopping it off, would you do it to your child?

I do poi nearly every day. But it's not like I'm addicted or anything. I mean, sure, I am always conscious of exactly where my poi are at all times, but I'm not obsessed. um.. Anyone have the number for Poi-ers Anon?

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kristiboy
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

member
Location: Christchurch

Total posts: 23
Posted:Let the new born baby decided...it is his foreskin afterall.

If you talk you can sing. If you walk you can dance.

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Narr


Narr

(*) (*) .. for the gnor ;)
Location: sitting on the step

Total posts: 2568
Posted:funkymonkey - im not sure we can go into that kind of thing on this board

slightlysinged - i cant think of a part of the female body that isnt necessary.
*sees huge amount of men getting enraged by that comment!* - - but there are an equal amount that find life without it equally pleasurable.

i think the reason the foreskin was chosen was because alot of boys are circumsised and its a way of getting stem cells without using dead fetuses or growing embryos specifically for that purpose, which im sure all of you will agree would be completely unethical!

but i think i have an idea that may solve this whole thing ... why have they not used the appendix?!! its a completely useless organ!!?!


she who sees from up high smiles

Patrick badger king: *they better hope there's never a jihad on stupidity*

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Dentrassi
GOLD Member since Apr 2003

Dentrassi

ZORT!
Location: Brisbane

Total posts: 3044
Posted:narr & funky,
we have gone into that kind of detail before - this discussion is pretty tame compared to the last one.

in response to the question, heres the my post from the last time we debated the topic. its the seventh post down the page. theres also various other comments on the issue.

we do go into quite a bit of detail here so if your not comfortable with that id advise to give it a miss.

link to my post in last circumscision debate

id advise reading the entire thread if you find this current topic interesting.


"Here kitty kitty...." - Schroedinger.

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coleman
SILVER Member since Aug 2002

coleman

big and good and broken
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay

Total posts: 7330
Posted:quote:Originally posted by Narr:
but i think i have an idea that may solve this whole thing ... why have they not used the appendix?!! its a completely useless organ!!?! removing the appendix at birth would involve invasive surgery on a newborn...

i don't reckon many new parents would be up for that!


"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood

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Narr


Narr

(*) (*) .. for the gnor ;)
Location: sitting on the step

Total posts: 2568
Posted:hmmm, true!

she who sees from up high smiles

Patrick badger king: *they better hope there's never a jihad on stupidity*

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