Forums > Technical Discussion > aerotech ultimates
Login/Join to ParticipateSILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
well, they've done it.
rgb (i.e can produce any colour you care to imagine), *fully* programmable (via usb pc link) aerotech equipment has arrived at last
anyone who saw the london juggling convention show (or was at the ejc earlier this year) will have been lucky enough to see owen and malte performing their classic 'spot the drop' routine with routine-programmed aerotech ultimate clubs
they already have plans for staff and poi with the same *individually controlled led technology* so that you have full control of programming the colour in each section of your toy.
here's the blurb from the aerotech website:
and links here:
main news page
details of the sequencing language
example of some sequence code
a little techy information on the software used
i don't wanna know how much i have to save up for a set of clubs - if i start working on a 5 club routine now, by the time i can juggle it, i should have enough money saved to buy the clubs...
cole. x
well, they've done it.
rgb (i.e can produce any colour you care to imagine), *fully* programmable (via usb pc link) aerotech equipment has arrived at last
anyone who saw the london juggling convention show (or was at the ejc earlier this year) will have been lucky enough to see owen and malte performing their classic 'spot the drop' routine with routine-programmed aerotech ultimate clubs
they already have plans for staff and poi with the same *individually controlled led technology* so that you have full control of programming the colour in each section of your toy.
here's the blurb from the aerotech website:
Written by: aerotech
Sequence 16 Million Colours with the new GLO-ULTIMATE equipment.
After three years of development and 100 times over budget, we bring you the ultimate in illuminated juggling equipment.
Our standard product range is designed for on the fly programming, so with a set sequence of taps it is possible to configure a product to change colour and flash between 2 Colours.
In our new ultimate range programming has been replaced with a reprogrammable RGB (The primary colours Red, Green, Blue) light sequencing program.
Each colour of the RGB is independently programmed to run a sequence of timed events to change intensity (brightness) levels. By altering the intensity levels of the RGB it is possible to select a colour from a palette of 16 Million different colours. Time increments are controllable down to 0.1 second meaning that it is possible to create a dazzling light show which can then be synchronized with other products.
A sequence is created using a simple line of code written within a standard text editor (Note book, Word etc). The file is then downloaded to the equipment using a standard USB 2.0 connection.
By using full powered USB hubs the glo-equipment fast charges from empty to 80% charged in 2 hours.
and links here:
main news page
details of the sequencing language
example of some sequence code
a little techy information on the software used
i don't wanna know how much i have to save up for a set of clubs - if i start working on a 5 club routine now, by the time i can juggle it, i should have enough money saved to buy the clubs...
cole. x
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
Internet Hate Machine
10,530 posts
Location: They seek him here, they seek him there...
10,530 posts
Location: They seek him here, they seek him there...
Posted:
*drools*
*drools*
The existance of flamethrowers says that someone, somewhere, at sometime said "I need to set that thing on fire, but it's too far away."
Clubbles Jugs
1,687 posts
Location: Manchester
1,687 posts
Location: Manchester
Posted:
did anyone see the "Spot the Drop" routine, and how good did the clubs look in the air...i mean is it worth splashing out the grande or so to buy them?
did anyone see the "Spot the Drop" routine, and how good did the clubs look in the air...i mean is it worth splashing out the grande or so to buy them?
ah wah wah wah a wah wah
BRONZE Member
old hand
1,174 posts
Location: Great Malvern [UK]
old hand
1,174 posts
Location: Great Malvern [UK]
Posted:
Wow, sounds like they've implemented just about everything I've been developing!! Damnit!
Wow, sounds like they've implemented just about everything I've been developing!! Damnit!
Cake or Death?
BRONZE Member
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
HOP librarian
1,841 posts
Location: Prague, Czech. Republic
Posted:
I like "Open source" and "do it yourself" too, thx Cole.
light,
:R
I like "Open source" and "do it yourself" too, thx Cole.
light,
:R
POI THEO(R)IST
BRONZE Member
newbie
13 posts
Location: USA
newbie
13 posts
Location: USA
Posted:
Nice, most excellent.
This is a very exciting time for glow toys, I think.
I hope we get pricing and pictures/videos of these toys soon.
Nice, most excellent.
This is a very exciting time for glow toys, I think.
I hope we get pricing and pictures/videos of these toys soon.
BRONZE Member
old hand
1,174 posts
Location: Great Malvern [UK]
old hand
1,174 posts
Location: Great Malvern [UK]
Posted:
One thing I'm keen to do is to get all the glow toys using the same interface. i.e. you only need to know one language / piece of software to produce light sequences for the toys available. Afterall, if everyone's talking the same language, it's going to open up many more doors for all us/you creative people!
One thing I'm keen to do is to get all the glow toys using the same interface. i.e. you only need to know one language / piece of software to produce light sequences for the toys available. Afterall, if everyone's talking the same language, it's going to open up many more doors for all us/you creative people!
Cake or Death?
BRONZE Member
newbie
13 posts
Location: USA
newbie
13 posts
Location: USA
Posted:
One thing I've noticed while reading these forums... we don't even have the same language for the poi tricks, do you think we're going to have the same language for the programs which are used on the poi themselves?
hehe...
Written by: *HyperLight
One thing I'm keen to do is to get all the glow toys using the same interface. i.e. you only need to know one language / piece of software to produce light sequences for the toys available. Afterall, if everyone's talking the same language, it's going to open up many more doors for all us/you creative people!
One thing I've noticed while reading these forums... we don't even have the same language for the poi tricks, do you think we're going to have the same language for the programs which are used on the poi themselves?
hehe...
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
hyperlight - i think that the programming language/interface may represent one of the biggest differentiators available in this market and as aerotech have plumped to release these products with code as the only control system available, the opportunity should be jumped on...
a programming language, no matter how simple, will scare off a *lot* of people.
jo 'illuminati' derry's proposed control system looked ideal for those people who don't want to set their toys' sequences using code.
a user-friendly gui (with an on-screen preview of the sequence) would seem to me to have the widest appeal.
the ideal interface would be timeline based (as with music sequencing or video editing software) which would make syncing to music (something most people will want to use these products for) a complete doddle.
it won't be too long before aerotech are pressured to develop and release a front end of this kind - as they already have the underlying code established, something like this shouldn't be too far behind...
cole. x
hyperlight - i think that the programming language/interface may represent one of the biggest differentiators available in this market and as aerotech have plumped to release these products with code as the only control system available, the opportunity should be jumped on...
a programming language, no matter how simple, will scare off a *lot* of people.
jo 'illuminati' derry's proposed control system looked ideal for those people who don't want to set their toys' sequences using code.
a user-friendly gui (with an on-screen preview of the sequence) would seem to me to have the widest appeal.
the ideal interface would be timeline based (as with music sequencing or video editing software) which would make syncing to music (something most people will want to use these products for) a complete doddle.
it won't be too long before aerotech are pressured to develop and release a front end of this kind - as they already have the underlying code established, something like this shouldn't be too far behind...
cole. x
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
PLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Posted:
Oooo, the programming language is sooo cute!
Oooo, the programming language is sooo cute!
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
BRONZE Member
old hand
1,174 posts
Location: Great Malvern [UK]
old hand
1,174 posts
Location: Great Malvern [UK]
Posted:
Cole; I couldn't agree more - I've been thinking the same thing with regards to programming. I'm not familiar with what Jo had in mind to control his stuff (pre-programmed sequences with buttons to switch between?).
The way I see it, there are probably three groups of people that need to be catered for..
1) The kind of people who are terrified / uninterested in technology and just want something that makes nice patterns with the minimum amount of fuss. So for them, you have a bunch of inbuilt functions with a range of options that do some nice stuff.
2) The kind of poeple who what to write sequences to put to music or whatever, but either don't know how, or don't want to know how, to write code. For them, you make the gui interface you mentioned. To be honest, this is how I'd imagine most people would program poi like Aerotech's, Polarity, or my own creation. I'd imagine it would run something like windows movie maker. i.e. you just drag and drop thumbnails to produce a squence. You hit play and voila, it shows you what to expect.
3) People like me who are 'techies' ...we want the option to write our own software to program our toys, we want hands-on access to the things and actually enjoy playing around with code. Of course I suspect this group is probably the minority (or there'd be a lot more programmable glow toys out there!). For these guys, you have access to the intermediate language somewhere between what the processors on the poi execute, and what group (2) play with.
From what I've read of the new aerotech's, they sound like they'd be very much compatible with my own toys. i.e. they use the same language to control their poi to what I've been developing. I had planned to write a nice simple to use gui aimed at group (2) which options to produce code that group (3) would write. I see no reason why something myself or Aerotech produce couldn't be compatible, because the underlying technology is pretty darn similar
Cole; I couldn't agree more - I've been thinking the same thing with regards to programming. I'm not familiar with what Jo had in mind to control his stuff (pre-programmed sequences with buttons to switch between?).
The way I see it, there are probably three groups of people that need to be catered for..
1) The kind of people who are terrified / uninterested in technology and just want something that makes nice patterns with the minimum amount of fuss. So for them, you have a bunch of inbuilt functions with a range of options that do some nice stuff.
2) The kind of poeple who what to write sequences to put to music or whatever, but either don't know how, or don't want to know how, to write code. For them, you make the gui interface you mentioned. To be honest, this is how I'd imagine most people would program poi like Aerotech's, Polarity, or my own creation. I'd imagine it would run something like windows movie maker. i.e. you just drag and drop thumbnails to produce a squence. You hit play and voila, it shows you what to expect.
3) People like me who are 'techies' ...we want the option to write our own software to program our toys, we want hands-on access to the things and actually enjoy playing around with code. Of course I suspect this group is probably the minority (or there'd be a lot more programmable glow toys out there!). For these guys, you have access to the intermediate language somewhere between what the processors on the poi execute, and what group (2) play with.
From what I've read of the new aerotech's, they sound like they'd be very much compatible with my own toys. i.e. they use the same language to control their poi to what I've been developing. I had planned to write a nice simple to use gui aimed at group (2) which options to produce code that group (3) would write. I see no reason why something myself or Aerotech produce couldn't be compatible, because the underlying technology is pretty darn similar
Cake or Death?
BRONZE Member
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Classically British
5,689 posts
Location: Epsom, Surrey, England
Posted:
Does this programming code thing mean that they've completely removed the tap programming?
I can see how the coding is cool, especially for performances, but for just playing around in the dark I would've thought they need/want to keep the flexibilty of on-the-trot programming...
Does this programming code thing mean that they've completely removed the tap programming?
I can see how the coding is cool, especially for performances, but for just playing around in the dark I would've thought they need/want to keep the flexibilty of on-the-trot programming...
Burner of Toast
Spinner of poi
Slacker of enormous magnitude
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
i don't know for sure, but i would guess that the shock sensor will still be used to access the menus and to turn the props on and off.
they definitely still have the 'change colour on catch' feature (which will also be programmable in the sequencer) so the sensor is definitely in there.
i reckon they'll have the classic aerotech menus with all the functionality of the old toys, plus the infamous MENU SEVEN which i would guess would be used to start the pre-programmed sequence running
cole. x
i don't know for sure, but i would guess that the shock sensor will still be used to access the menus and to turn the props on and off.
they definitely still have the 'change colour on catch' feature (which will also be programmable in the sequencer) so the sensor is definitely in there.
i reckon they'll have the classic aerotech menus with all the functionality of the old toys, plus the infamous MENU SEVEN which i would guess would be used to start the pre-programmed sequence running
cole. x
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
Forget puppy power, Scrappy's just gay
632 posts
Location: Southampton Uni
632 posts
Location: Southampton Uni
Posted:
Wow... a langauge with Jump to commands! That's simple, wince inducing, and extremely old school!
Wow... a langauge with Jump to commands! That's simple, wince inducing, and extremely old school!
Spin, bounce, be one with the world, because it is yours to enjoy...
addict
406 posts
Location: Oxford, UK
406 posts
Location: Oxford, UK
Posted:
Would you prefer objects for your juggling clubs?
Written by: Drudwyn
Wow... a langauge with Jump to commands! That's simple, wince inducing, and extremely old school!
Would you prefer objects for your juggling clubs?
"Take that, math!"
Forget puppy power, Scrappy's just gay
632 posts
Location: Southampton Uni
632 posts
Location: Southampton Uni
Posted:
Nah, it's a script, so it needs functions... although OO clubs would be fun, if totally pointless. You coming along tonight?
Nah, it's a script, so it needs functions... although OO clubs would be fun, if totally pointless. You coming along tonight?
Spin, bounce, be one with the world, because it is yours to enjoy...
BRONZE Member
old hand
1,174 posts
Location: Great Malvern [UK]
old hand
1,174 posts
Location: Great Malvern [UK]
Posted:
Pointerless? ...oh dear, I need to get out more (and so do you if you got that!)
Pointerless? ...oh dear, I need to get out more (and so do you if you got that!)
Cake or Death?
addict
577 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
577 posts
Location: Oregon, USA
Posted:
Indeed.. if for no other reason than to collect your garbage..
Indeed.. if for no other reason than to collect your garbage..
Definition of poi- A Hawaiian food made from the tuber of the taro that is cooked, pounded to a paste, and fermented.
Ahnold discussing poi - "It is naht a toober!"
BRONZE Member
Carpal \'Tunnel
6,207 posts
Location: "In your ear", United Kingdom
Carpal \'Tunnel
6,207 posts
Location: "In your ear", United Kingdom
Posted:
on a geekie note the tech batteries they will be using will be the early stages of the new ltop deisn batteries, being introduced next year, this is new tech, designed to give 80% charge in a short time, so by next year it is set to be a standard in high drain appliences, and be under an hours charge time.......
i would like to see the clubs before i buy any, and i wonder will they still work 5 mins after i buy them....
also if they are using java, which it looks like they are, what happens if dun microsystems changes the java code again, i knwo it wont be a hassle for the guys who have clubs, as teh code inside will remain teh same, but if you wnat to buy another one, yowu ill have to code in two different langs?
on a geekie note the tech batteries they will be using will be the early stages of the new ltop deisn batteries, being introduced next year, this is new tech, designed to give 80% charge in a short time, so by next year it is set to be a standard in high drain appliences, and be under an hours charge time.......
i would like to see the clubs before i buy any, and i wonder will they still work 5 mins after i buy them....
also if they are using java, which it looks like they are, what happens if dun microsystems changes the java code again, i knwo it wont be a hassle for the guys who have clubs, as teh code inside will remain teh same, but if you wnat to buy another one, yowu ill have to code in two different langs?
Step (el-nombrie)
PLATINUM Member
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Flying Water Muppet
5,276 posts
Location: Edin-borrow., United Kingdom
Posted:
yeah, they should have put some of those "come from" commands in. They're much better...
And mech, since when did sun change javas code? It's always backwards compatible anyway? And that doesn't really matter if they're using it on the chip cos its a cut down embedded system version. And considering the external programming language will remain the same it will have absolutely no effect anyway.
Written by: Drudwyn
Wow... a langauge with Jump to commands! That's simple, wince inducing, and extremely old school!
yeah, they should have put some of those "come from" commands in. They're much better...
And mech, since when did sun change javas code? It's always backwards compatible anyway? And that doesn't really matter if they're using it on the chip cos its a cut down embedded system version. And considering the external programming language will remain the same it will have absolutely no effect anyway.
"the now legendary" - Kaskade
"the still legendary" - Kaskade
I spunked in my friend's aquarium and the fish ate it. I love all fish. Especially the pink ones. They are my bitches. - Anon.
GOLD Member
still can't believe it's not butter
6,978 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
still can't believe it's not butter
6,978 posts
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posted:
bill_says("dang, that's impressive specs!"){
saving_init(now);
practicepoi_init(now);
}
bill_says("dang, that's impressive specs!"){
saving_init(now);
practicepoi_init(now);
}
Laugh Often, Smile Much, Post lolcats Always
SILVER Member
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
15,417 posts
Location: South Wales
Posted:
Erm... unless I had already fallen asleep at the LJC show.. I dont think I saw Owen doing any juggling... over the entire weekend..
Erm... unless I had already fallen asleep at the LJC show.. I dont think I saw Owen doing any juggling... over the entire weekend..
addict
406 posts
Location: Oxford, UK
406 posts
Location: Oxford, UK
Posted:
It's just their GUI that's written in Java by the looks of it. That means that at absolute worst their GUI might change - you'd still be coding the same assembler-esque scripts for the clubs, just uploading/synchronising in a different environment. No problem. Mind you, mcp's right - Sun haven't changed the language drastically in the time I've been writing it (3 years) and they wouldn't change anything that wasn't backwards compatible.
Written by: mech
on a geekie note the tech batteries they will be using will be the early stages of the new ltop deisn batteries, being introduced next year, this is new tech, designed to give 80% charge in a short time, so by next year it is set to be a standard in high drain appliences, and be under an hours charge time.......
i would like to see the clubs before i buy any, and i wonder will they still work 5 mins after i buy them....
also if they are using java, which it looks like they are, what happens if dun microsystems changes the java code again, i knwo it wont be a hassle for the guys who have clubs, as teh code inside will remain teh same, but if you wnat to buy another one, yowu ill have to code in two different langs?
It's just their GUI that's written in Java by the looks of it. That means that at absolute worst their GUI might change - you'd still be coding the same assembler-esque scripts for the clubs, just uploading/synchronising in a different environment. No problem. Mind you, mcp's right - Sun haven't changed the language drastically in the time I've been writing it (3 years) and they wouldn't change anything that wasn't backwards compatible.
"Take that, math!"
SILVER Member
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
big and good and broken
7,330 posts
Location: lunn dunn, yoo kay, United Kingdom
Posted:
i just assumed it had happened because it was in the line up before the weekend: ljc info from owen.
i guess the plan for the show changed
apparently they wrote the glo-ultimates sequence for 'spot the drop' for their act at the ejc earlier this year - they performed it there so it wasn't anything new...
cole. x
Written by: UglyCowsOfFrance
Erm... unless I had already fallen asleep at the LJC show.. I dont think I saw Owen doing any juggling... over the entire weekend..
i just assumed it had happened because it was in the line up before the weekend: ljc info from owen.
i guess the plan for the show changed
apparently they wrote the glo-ultimates sequence for 'spot the drop' for their act at the ejc earlier this year - they performed it there so it wasn't anything new...
cole. x
"i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
SILVER Member
Tosser
1,712 posts
Location: Bristol,UK
Tosser
1,712 posts
Location: Bristol,UK
Posted:
Gloclub Ultimate Video HERE
Honestly, they look nice and bright, yes they are RGB, but £250 per unit? And the user has the option of opening them up and fixing or replacing parts themselves now (batteries are highlighted particulary). So if the clubs break Aerotech would prefer you don't whinge about having to send them back for the umpteenth time, so instead you can do it yourself.
Dodgy USP if you ask me.
Gloclub Ultimate Video HERE
Honestly, they look nice and bright, yes they are RGB, but £250 per unit? And the user has the option of opening them up and fixing or replacing parts themselves now (batteries are highlighted particulary). So if the clubs break Aerotech would prefer you don't whinge about having to send them back for the umpteenth time, so instead you can do it yourself.
Dodgy USP if you ask me.
BRONZE Member
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Still wiggling
5,967 posts
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland (UK)
Posted:
Ermmm...
Ultimate Aerotech poi to be priced at £150 - each. That's £300 for poi.
Good grief.
Ermmm...
Ultimate Aerotech poi to be priced at £150 - each. That's £300 for poi.
Good grief.
Getting to the other side 
SILVER Member
Tosser
1,712 posts
Location: Bristol,UK
Tosser
1,712 posts
Location: Bristol,UK
Posted:
Quite.
Quite.
GOLD Member
co-director of A.C.B.I.S.H.A.
761 posts
Location: in the corner beside the filing cabinets, 2nd floo...
co-director of A.C.B.I.S.H.A.
761 posts
Location: in the corner beside the filing cabinets, 2nd floo...
Posted:
yeah its damn pricey, but dont forget what youre getting.. do they do the same for staffs.. you can use a pair of socks for spinning, or you can get super amazing programmable delux aerotechs.. you can use a disposable camera to take pics , or you can get a cannon superzoom 9000 with attachments for €500.. its all a question of relativety..
*runs off to start saving for aerotech ultimate staff*
yeah its damn pricey, but dont forget what youre getting.. do they do the same for staffs.. you can use a pair of socks for spinning, or you can get super amazing programmable delux aerotechs.. you can use a disposable camera to take pics , or you can get a cannon superzoom 9000 with attachments for €500.. its all a question of relativety..
*runs off to start saving for aerotech ultimate staff*
There's no place like 127.0.0.1, There's no place like 127.0.0.1, There's no place like 127.0.0.1,
"in most of our friends we're the hippies. but we have hippie friends of our own.. its like a dog having its own pet" - H. Sinoquet 19-03-2005
member
117 posts
117 posts
Posted:
Anyone know when there staffs are comming out and how much they're going to cost?
I'm soo tempted to see if I can get familly to club together *parden the pun* and buy me a staff for xmass this year if they're out in time.
Anyone know when there staffs are comming out and how much they're going to cost?
I'm soo tempted to see if I can get familly to club together *parden the pun* and buy me a staff for xmass this year if they're out in time.
journeyman
89 posts
Location: Limoges (France)
89 posts
Location: Limoges (France)
Posted:
I still wonder how the colours change altogether on these clubs. A friend of mine who saw them in Slovenia told me the sequence starts when you unplug the props from your computer so, according to him, you need a computer at any time you want to juggle or spin Ultimate stuff. This raises two possibilities :
-either he's right and this is total non-sense, needing a laptop when moving to meetings and conventions :|
-or he's wrong (what I guess is more likely) and I will be allowed to laught at him until his last breath.
Anyone know how this works ?
EDITED_BY: milka (1144436842)
I still wonder how the colours change altogether on these clubs. A friend of mine who saw them in Slovenia told me the sequence starts when you unplug the props from your computer so, according to him, you need a computer at any time you want to juggle or spin Ultimate stuff. This raises two possibilities :
-either he's right and this is total non-sense, needing a laptop when moving to meetings and conventions :|
-or he's wrong (what I guess is more likely) and I will be allowed to laught at him until his last breath.
Anyone know how this works ?
EDITED_BY: milka (1144436842)
member
117 posts
117 posts
Posted:
They're certainly going to have some form of processor and flash rom in them.
I kinda hope that they have a switch to turn them on and off though.
They're certainly going to have some form of processor and flash rom in them.
I kinda hope that they have a switch to turn them on and off though.
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