Forums > Social Discussion > What is the best thing that can happen now?

Posted: 20th Mar 2003
IMHO...The best result is that, knowing the US will not stop until they have 'won' is that Saddam is killed, George can have his little trophy & the UN goes into create peace and order.

There will always be a group of people that leads any country/world - an elite group and akin to a cast system is a pretty much closed circle - similar conflicts occur in lower levels 'casts,' but because the subject matter & resources are also of a smaller scale they never hit headline news papers, but for the people envolved there are just as if not more importamt. The people at the 'top' think they know what is right for others. I think there is some need for such a heirachical structure because some people need something to follow, to maintain order. Society/the media/ governments are constantly trying to tell people what to do & how to do it, and so people tend not to bother looking into themselves to find the answers. It just doesn't fit in to todays 'Buy now pay later' script (gotta love the irony )

Sould the UN seek to punish the US & UK for taking this action without the backing of the rest of the major world nations? I don't know, the only thing for sure is that the UN could never have stayed as a solid world governing body as it does not incorporate all world nations and change is inevitable - this appears to be the first real test of the UN and it appears pretty useless.

Terrorism will continue as long as the world continues, in the same way the things that make our lives joyous will continue. Life is balanced, to remove either extremity is to deny the other, the only choice is what we do with it.

Just my opinion.

Politics...shmolitics

EDIT: OK, I went on a rant & stright off the side of this topic. I just hope the war- deaths & oppression of people is over as soon as possible & that no-one takes this too seriously (not that it isn't serious stuff). I'm going off again, I'll stop

Posted: 20th Mar 2003
What now indeed.

My view of the best case scenario is roughly this: 2/3 weeks max of war to sweep through Iraq and remove the majority of the current Iraqi leadership. This is hard as it’s just not as simple as removing one evil man, but over decades every level of Iraqi government and military has been controlled by Saddam’s cronies and their like and infested with corruption. Often countries run on corruption and oppression so deeply that their removal causes immediate state paralysis before it gets better. That’s going to take the most effort to sort out: building a stable and credible country.

Many countries, espically Iraq’s neighbours, don’t like the US government. Arrogant shits is perhaps too mild a term. Whether you’re proudly waving the stars and stripes, or burning it on the streets, it should be obvious that the US leading the building of the new Iraq government is not going to lead to a trusted and credible country.

Therefore the only route available, and the one thankfully being worked on now, is a UN backed process for rebuilding the Iraqi government. The US and it’s allies need to work to appease (some people really hate that word and read it as ‘give in’. why?) the world and restore to the UN the power and credibility it needs and deserves. This means that with the rebuilding of Iraq the US will, for once, have to take it’s lead from the UN. The UN does serve a powerful and essential role in the world, and it’s too simplistic a view for people to look at this one situation and declare it useless.

Rebuilding Iraq and restoring it to it's former glory (which was a nation of wealth and health equal or above western nations) is going to take a lot of time and money, and the US+UK need to cough up quick. The advatages of a rapidly stablised Iraq and a restored UN are many fold, mainly helping to stabalise those now fragile international relationships and institutions. It may well trigger more reforms in neighboring countries, especially if the US now turns attention to the Israel/Palestine issue which is still the most important issue in the region. I may reduce the hot bed of anti-Americanism the region. Or it may not. It’s a finely balanced situation and needs to be managed with the skill and diplomacy the US often lacks, but the UN manages well.

There is opportunity to work good from all this, if done properly. However the current US government often seems blind to the subtle nuances of international politics, so we’ll just have to see how it all turns out. Instead of just moaning about the war, lets keep our fingers crossed and help push for a stable peace all around the Middle East.

Peace to you all

Posted: 21st Mar 2003
i was thinking about the number of ways that the US can be made to look like even more of an ass in the standing of the world right now.

as far as world health is concerned, a short 2-3 week war with fewest possible deaths, yes, this would be good. it would put the US up against the full fire and heat and disapproval of the UN as opposed to perhaps a long war. seriously though, this war if it carries on long enough, will get Bush reelected. it wont be too short i dont think. i really wouldnt put it past our government to plant any necessary evidence of bio weapons in Iraq any more than i wouldnt put it past a police office here to plant drugs in a car and then find it. that is not a statement of probability or likelihood (sp?) just an observation of political scruples

i speak to people here in the US and each time i am so surprised to hear someone supporting it.

the idea of the UN rebuilding the Iraqi state brings me to think of a great novel: Shogun, where the government of Japan 1600 was ruled by a council of 5 daimyos who hated eachother. and so approval for anything was a struggle that didnt benefit any one ruling party. this is a benefit of the UN, that each country is out for itself essentially, and is not going to select one country above all to receive all benefits.

an opinion...

Wow

Posted: 21st Mar 2003
Here is my never humble opinion and we all know the saying that goes along with opinions(if you dont please email me I will fully explain it to you )
I fully support My goverment and the choices they have made.War no matter what is never a good thing and thus far the US has made every attempt to spare the people of Iraq.The Un has proven it no longer works and world support has grown in support of this war since it has started.I am glad President Bush grew tired of people just talking and taking no action.And doing what needed to be done even when it wasnt the popular thing to do.As selfish as it may sound I would much rather see this battle unfold over there by those who choose to fight it. than fought on the streets of the usa by police and fire fighters cleaning up the messes from terriost attacks.Even the people of iraq had enough warning to leave if they wanted.
and can still be from harms way by laying down thier arms.

May God be with everyone involed in this

[ 22. March 2003, 07:23: Message edited by: Riz ]

I have been cursed with the imagination to envision it all

Posted: 21st Mar 2003
I had this idea for a book in which the world is on the brink of war, and that morning when the bombers are preparing to take off, none of the engines will start. The bomb timers fail and the guidance systems go dead. No guns will fire and no-one can work out why.

I don't think that's going to happen, though.

Magnus... pay it forward

Posted: 22nd Mar 2003
WOW... shibaki you posting ? YAY

I do think this is a very very good question actually...

I am genuineyly worried about the future of UN as an entity...

can they survive being overlooked and ignored by so many major states ?

shine on
cass

"I want brown bread... no, that is diesel oil..."
"So I was raised in Europe, where History comes from ..."
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