Waist Wrap

Schatz doesn’t refer to the waist wrap, that’s English nomenclature. He describes the front, btb and full fountain. I prefer fountain, because in addition to many poi spinners using waist-wrap to describe the position, having an upper waist wrap just doesn’t make sense.

The waist wrap is a 2 beat move, though at an advanced level you can do 4, double tangle. I think that’s what PinkNigel was describing. Call it the double waist wrap if you like.

Well sp1ke333, we haven’t been much help have we. The waist wrap is a club swinging move, which is a bit different to poi. To me, poi is more about forward reverse, and btb weaves; working the circle. With club swinging it’s more about wall plane moves, twisting your trunk and working a stage. An advantage of learning some club moves is that it will lead you to develop a great technique (especially in regard to planes).

So the waist wrap is not a weave. It’s made up of follow circles (windmill/mills). If you start weaving you loose the pattern. The windmill consist of long arm and shoulder circles. I learnt the windmill with poi by speeding up one poi while doing chase the sun. Poi people would call this “the giant windmill”. The circles for the top part of the windmill are done behind the head. See Jillings Fig 12.2.

So, if you still want to learn the waist wrap check out Jillings Lesson 17 Waist Circles and Waist Wraps. Then try these:

This is how the front one goes. Follow to the right - lower back circles with right; back of waist, arm-over-front with left; lower front right; and front of waist, arm-over-front with left.

This is how the back one goes. Follow to the right - lower back circle with right; back of waist, arm-over-back with left; lower front right; and front of waist, arm-over-back with left.

Good Luck

Cheers

Thank you Stone..I noticed that my thread suddenly developed into an argue regarding terminology...which is actually good because we still have to make things clear in poi jargon.
Anyway, even though i'm a beginner, i know that a windmill (a move i can do properly) is a variation of a weave. From what u said it looks like that it's not true....now, who is right? I hope I dont create a mess again with this statement!

Regarding my trainings, unfourtunately i need at least a video to get into a move, i cant really understand from written explanations, although sometimes they help of course!

Hi sp1ke333, I’m not sure how you do the windmill. Is it like the video in the HOP Library - Poi, Beginners part 2, Windmill?

Note the circles for the top part of the windmill are done behind the head.

I do it properly and i can say so because i've been taught by some english experienced poists and they told me that it's a variation of a weave

sp1ke333, I’m not being critical. I’m sure you do the windmill properly.

You said you wanted to learn the waist wrap. All I’m asking is if you do the top part of the windmill behind the head? If go in front, then I’d say it was an overhead weave rather than a windmill.

Also, if it’s a variation on the weave, then where is the “over under out” ?

sorry stone, i wasnt even thinking that u were critical u have probably misunderstood the tone of my answer...

Coming back IT...well, there's no "over under out" because it's a 2-beat weave (so "over and out" only)
I found a video about that move i'm referring to:

http://www.italianpoi.eu/cms/index.php?o...ey=22&hit=1

how would you call that?

In poi terminology, that's a windmill, somecall it an overhead weave (2-bt), you can do a 4-bt version, but it's not really worth it IMHO

Hi spike, thanks for link. It looks like a windmill.

If you know how to do the windmill, then you know how to do the waist wrap. It’s just doing continuous circles behind, or in front of the right hip; and then continuous circles behind, or in front of the left hip. I call the continuous circles follow circles, but they are also known as hipmills or just mills.

The full waist wrap is just a name for a combination of moves that links front and back hipmills. The carry, under-over and extra circle are used for transitions (links).

As a clubswinger, I’d suggest trying these moves first with a wooden spoon or even clenched fists, before poi. That way you don’t have to worry about chains.



Durbs, what do you mean it's not really worth learning the windmill? It’s a basic building move. Besides, continuous hipmills behind the back, are one of the sexiest moves in the business.


woot

thanks stone, that description helps to make things clear but still i cant manage to do it...
this probably depends on the fact that i cant do the hipmill (i feel that there's something wrong in my back circles)
one day i'll do it, i just need more practice!

Hi spike, how are the waist wraps going?

Hipmills from Michal Kahn’s Poi Spinning book. “The hipmill is step one of the waistwrap. It is similar to the windmill, but by one hip. The right hand leads, and poi spin one circle behind and in front of the right hip (not behind the back)."

I’d suggest learning the front waist wrap first (poi spin a circle behind right hip (not btb), a circle in front of belly button, a circle behind the left hip, then carry back to the right hip and start the movement again.

So, to link the front and back waist wraps instead of doing the carry, just take your left arm over the back and start circles behind the right hip (btb).

Durbs, fair point.

Hi Stone..Now i'm actually working on other things and i'm practicing just some hipmills to get into the feeling of them. It seems that I got it with the right hand but my left hand still doesnt want to learn it :P
Anyway, i'm waiting to meet someone who can show me (live) the waistwrap before concentrating on practicing it.

thanks for the hints!

Hi spike, good stuff.

I know Italy is a big place, but you might be able to track down PK sometime. Amongst other wicked moves, he has an amazingly good butterfly waist wrap.

Keep on spinning

In fact it's a move by mills section (cause the mills are the moves in wall plane with poi moving in same direction). is it right?

couldn't do a waist wrap when i was thinner, no point in learning now i'm bigger!

Is it a forward btb weave, then backward btb weave, but done in front of you?

I think i can sort of do it, but not quite

Copied and pasted from my post in a different waist wrap thread...

OK, wallplane weaves and waist wraps are NOT the same thing. They're related, but distinct moves.

It's called a waist wrap because it's an old club-swinging move. Weaves were called cross-follows back then, trivia fans!

So here's the breakdown of the moves.

A wall plane weave is a forwards 3bt weave to reverse 3bt weave and back again, done in the wallplane, with the transition between forwards and backward either in front of you, or behind you. A fountain is where the forward to backward transition is done low, and the backwards to forwards bit is done high.

A waist wrap is very similar, but done using a 2bt weave base, rather than a 3bt weave one. It also involves carries from the end of the pattern back to the start again. Say you're spinning anti-clockwise, and you start the pattern on your left hand side... the order of beats is this:

LH: behind your left hip
RH: behind your left hip
LH: in front of you
RH: In front of you
LH: in front of you
RH: In front of you
LH: behind your right hip (at this point your LH starts to carry the poi over in front of you, and start step 1 again)
RH: behind your right hip (at this point, your RH will carry in front of you, following your left hand, into step 2).

To do this behind the back, take the steps above and swap wherever it say "in front" for "behind" and vice versa.

A full waist wrap is simply a front waist wrap linked to a BTB waist wrap.

It's also worth noting that there are 4 front waist wraps (left to right or right to left, with high or low carries), and 4 BTB ones (same as above). This means there are actually 8 full waist wraps that are possible (I can only do about 3).

Hope that helps!

so no 3bt - thats where I've been going wrong! aaaaaaah.... still whack my boobs though. got the muscle memory (practiced with clubs funnily enough) now to get the poi planes right....