TheApprovingNinja
From the Ashes of a Ninja Rise THE HIPS OF RAGE
Member #5094
Reged: 08/07/03
Loc: Edinburgh
596611
|
Re: Drews Poi and Stick Video Blog find similar
12/02/06 10:48 PM
|
|
|
thanks for the ninja cartoon drew everyone needs to have a horse with a ninja mask
-------------------- Viva UGLY STAFF
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Rev
Bastard newbie messiah

Member #4257
Reged: 14/03/03
Loc: Apparently lost in my ego
596752
|
13/02/06 05:05 AM
|
|
|
Written by: NYC
Unfortunately, after watching some special on Fox basically taking apart all of David Blane's tricks (but without saying his name) it was suggested that all "Street Magic" is staged and reedited to look like it was actually done with regular folks. He does a "levitation" one where he literally brings in a crane and wires to lift him up for the camera and then does a completely DIFFERENT levitation trick for the actual street audience. The show then edits the two together showing him doing a very impressive trick.
I havent seen that special, but I've seen some like it.. basically they pay the audiences to 'wow' even though no trick is actually performed.. that way they get the 'reaction' look.. but the levitation thing was never explained by crane... my firend's martial arts teacher can use shadows and the land around him to make it look like he's levitating like an inch off the ground, but he's really standing on the toes of one foot.. its hard to explain but it really does create this optical illusion..
that being said.. all magic works the exact same way.. so when you watch a magic show, its just like watching a movie or play... its called 'suspension of disbelief' or something similar.. and its an understood part of the show.. whether done like 'reality tv' (real peple, fake 'real' plot) or done hollywood style.. so does it really make you think any less of it? I mean did it actually make a disbeliever out of you or were you that way to begin with NYC?
it sounds like it just made you jaded and now you need a hug..
-------------------- More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
"Obviously, you're not a golfer.."- The Dude
"buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
"FEMA has never done catastrophe planning..."-Michael Brown
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
NYC
Newbie Wrangler

Member #552
Reged: 26/08/01
Loc: NYC, NY, USA
597046
|
13/02/06 01:59 PM
|
|
|
No, no hug needed. (But I'll always take one )
I think there are some amazing magicians. Using camera tricks, edits, and special effects when you're "supposed" to be just showing street magic is dishonest. I do think it's a different level of dishonesty than regular magic.
I mean, you can CGI a world of aliens and sci fi... how hard can it be to special effect a card trick?
-------------------- Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
bluecat
azuremog

Member #3686
Reged: 15/12/02
Loc: everywhere
597098
|
13/02/06 05:38 PM
|
|
|
hey! that was MY link to the ninja horse *silk*

drew, do you want other vids posted in here? or hould we have copycat threads?
-------------------- Holistic Spinner (I hope)
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
NYC
Newbie Wrangler

Member #552
Reged: 26/08/01
Loc: NYC, NY, USA
597639
|
14/02/06 11:47 AM
|
|
|
Other videos here.
This way it makes it easier for me.
Which is really all that matters.
-------------------- Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
coleman
big and good

Member #2914
Reged: 29/08/02
Loc: lunn dunn, yoo kay
598159
|
15/02/06 06:18 AM
|
|
|
yeah, cos fox are well-known as a reliable source of accurate information... 
the levitation audience cuts from his first series are indeed camera tricks - he did the balducci levitation on the street and then they cut in the 4-5 foot wire levitation for the tv show 
that lost blaine a lot of credibility.
still, using that one example to discredit the whole street magic genre is a bit weak don't you think?
have you seen criss angel's show at all? it is variable quality but he still has some great tricks dotted through the series - the razor blades combined with needles from stomach trick completely blew me away.
still, if it ain't your bag, its not going to impress, no matter how high quality it is - cyril's 'amazing prediction' is about as high quality as it gets imho 
cole. x
-------------------- "i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
NYC
Newbie Wrangler

Member #552
Reged: 26/08/01
Loc: NYC, NY, USA
598215
|
15/02/06 08:25 AM
|
|
|
I was actually referring to that 'levitation' one among the ones you posted. The camera angles are very suspisious as are the audience participation. There are some clear helpers in the audience as well. I forget which one they are but it's kinda obvious when you see it.
Using camera tricks and plants completely discredits the idea of "street magic" and your boy is using camera tricks and plants.
Slight of hand is fantastic. Close up magic is difficult and takes years. SAYING you're doing close up magic or street magic when you're really just using camra tricks is stupid.
I'd be easy to spend some money to make a CGI video showing me juggling 14 balls. But if I posted it as real on a juggling site, I'd be a fraud.
Same with "street magic".
-------------------- Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
coleman
big and good

Member #2914
Reged: 29/08/02
Loc: lunn dunn, yoo kay
598636
|
15/02/06 11:46 PM
|
|
|
if suspicious camera angles spoil a trick for you then i guess stage illusions just aren't for you.
most stage illusions wouldn't work if the viewing angles were not carefully controlled by the performer.
the aim of street magic is to take stage illusion and turn it into close-up - those suspicious angles you mentioned can be reduced but they are always going to involved somewhere
Written by: nyc
It would be easy to spend some money to make a CGI video showing me juggling 14 balls. But if I posted it as real on a juggling site, I'd be a fraud. Same with "street magic".
that's a silly comparison dude - the point of magic is to make impossible things happen -
magicians are frauds by definition.
the idea is to fool you into believing that the impossible thing that just happened, actually did happen.
i have a feeling that anything you see on tv, you will dismiss since it could just be a special effect
as long as the performer can perform the effect live, i'm happy to watch a video of it - the audience reaction (staged or no) doesn't come into it.
i personally don't think cyril uses any camera tricks (i.e. cuts, heavily omitted sections of the stage or special effects) and i'm far from sure that there is a plant in that levitation (spotting a plant on a japanese tv show is quite a skill! ) - i guess you just don't dig this kind of entertainment.
of course, seeing magic performed live is generally a million times better since misdirection is far more powerful in person than it can ever be on a tv screen
cole. x
-------------------- "i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
mech
maker of pointless avtars

Member #4853
Reged: 09/06/03
Loc: "In your ear"
598753
|
16/02/06 02:29 AM
|
|
|
Written by: coleman
"I't would be easy to spend some money to make a CGI video showing me juggling 14 balls. But if I posted it as real on a juggling site, I'd be a fraud. Same with "street magic".
YES! YES! :D:D:D
i finaly get to correct cole!  THE FIRST TIME EVER!
cole you either need one more or one less of these >> "
sorry dude 
i know you could throw a stone and find one of mine, but you know, im a stupid git 
-------------------- Step (el-nombrie)
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
coleman
big and good

Member #2914
Reged: 29/08/02
Loc: lunn dunn, yoo kay
598799
|
16/02/06 03:55 AM
|
|
|
don't know what you're on about mech...
since this is drew's video thread and i've contributed towards its rapid descent into chatty discussion in his absence ( ), i'll offer up this little robotic-funk-induced-eye-nugget:
sony's qrio dancing like a crazy little bitch
so, who wants to go teach it to spin poi with me then...?
cole. x
-------------------- "i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Rev
Bastard newbie messiah

Member #4257
Reged: 14/03/03
Loc: Apparently lost in my ego
598856
|
16/02/06 05:51 AM
|
|
|
ahh to hell with that.. I already have a gay snowman that spins poi...
-------------------- More useless information courtesy of Rev...
Confusing the masses, one post at a time...
"Obviously, you're not a golfer.."- The Dude
"buy the ticket... Take the ride..." -Raoul Duke
"FEMA has never done catastrophe planning..."-Michael Brown
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
NYC
Newbie Wrangler

Member #552
Reged: 26/08/01
Loc: NYC, NY, USA
599078
|
16/02/06 12:36 PM
|
|
|
Naa... you're missing my point Cole.
I'm all for camera angles when doing magic. It's specific editing and camera tricks that are specific to cameras that I find hypocritical when suggesting "street magic". I know it may sound arbitrary but I don't think using post-production editing is fair when shooting something as "street magic"... the same way I'm annoyed when those "reality shows" edit scenes together to make it appear that things have happened that really haven't. I don't think picking a random volunteer from the audience who's actually working with the magician says much for their slight of hand skills.
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
NYC
Newbie Wrangler

Member #552
Reged: 26/08/01
Loc: NYC, NY, USA
599081
|
16/02/06 12:38 PM
|
|
|
And I think that this video will serve to get Drew's video thread back on track and away from pesky Cole and his contrarification of my senseless critiques. 
There's been quite an outbreak of artsy flash mobs in New York... I like it. 
It's an obvious tip of the hat to the bouncyball commercial that you all seem to like so much.
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Glåss
Eeeeeep

Member #829
Reged: 08/11/01
Loc: Bristol
599335
|
17/02/06 02:34 AM
|
|
|
Hmmm Well I've been a little bit bust with work over here in london land, and it just started hailing really hard, so the birds in the c-anal are looking a little bit bedraggled.
Part of why I haven't posted is because there have been an incredible flurry of videos posted in the last 2 weeks and I aven't felt a need for
_________________________________
Rob you asked if it was ok to poast links, I say yes please, BUT Only post a video/link that is brilliant or highly innovative in some way, and:
1) I haven't seen it before
2) and I haven't seen something in the same genre but better before.
3) Or it makes me laugh.
So If you're unsure wbout what or when to post here then PM me the link and I will decide, thats what quite a fel people have been doing, and hence I am very grateful to them for the links, the've been awesome - I don't reply to to PM's but I do reply when I post them here.
_____________________________________________________________
Coleman: Huge thankies, I love robots, I love dancing, I love dancing robots.
Although I do think seriously that Sony are loosing thier cool, theres something about the brand I really don't like nowdays, and Qrio is starting to look a bit out of date too
Dance battle I would love to see:
Who would win - Sony qrio (colmans link above) Vs
Ringtone dancer: http://ringtonedancer.contagiousmedia.org/
(this is not a good video clip - it will not enhance your life in any way, it is very very bad, so bad that its kind of good again, but I think that Ring tone dancer and sony qrio have similar dance styles!)
_____________________________________________________________
And NYC thatnks for the light graffiti artsy flash mob brilliance
I love that too, theres gotta be some burners in that crowd, although, really don't like the use of the ball bouncing advert music - its really too strong a reference which makes me suspicious that they are viral advertising for whatever that ball video was for! Damn cool.
_____________________________________________________________
Magic:The magician debate above I have been following with great interest, and I'm busy writting a lovely reply to it, I'm also hunting down a good video link to post today. as above ring tone dancer doesn't really count.
Smiles Dr Ew
Edited by Glåss (17/02/06 02:37 AM)
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
ben-ja-men
gay model poet aka derik troy

Member #4889
Reged: 12/06/03
Loc: Adelaide
599772
|
17/02/06 06:39 PM
|
|
|
Written by: Glåss
Dance battle I would love to see: Who would win - Sony qrio (colmans link above) Vs Ringtone dancer: http://ringtonedancer.contagiousmedia.org/ (this is not a good video clip - it will not enhance your life in any way, it is very very bad, so bad that its kind of good again, but I think that Ring tone dancer and sony qrio have similar dance styles!)
the ringtone dancer would win hands down as qrio is now dead defunked and otherwise kaput
-------------------- Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourself, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous and talented? Who are you NOT to be?
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
NYC
Newbie Wrangler

Member #552
Reged: 26/08/01
Loc: NYC, NY, USA
600026
|
18/02/06 05:52 AM
|
|
|
Dear Drew,
My 4th period class is now completely addicted to the JCB song. As it was the last day before a week's vacation I said if they balanced all their equations we could watch the video during the last 5 minute of class. They were great and we all got to leave with a smile on our faces.
Thank you for making my day and the days of 26 hard working kids you'll never meet.
-------------------- Well, shall we go?
Yes, let's go.
[They do not move.]
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Suibom
I looked in a mirror and noticed I was infinitely twisted.

Member #24431
Reged: 02/09/05
Loc: Oregon, USA
600189
|
18/02/06 10:36 AM
|
|
|
Rofl.. I finally relented to my 5yo and let him use a messenger program so I can help him with his reading and writing while at work.. and every morning for the last week, I get a message from him asking for the link to the JCB song :P.. It's just disgustingly cute.
Such a great vid..
-------------------- Definition of poi- A Hawaiian food made from the tuber of the taro that is cooked, pounded to a paste, and fermented.
Ahnold discussing poi - "It is naht a toober!"
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Glåss
Eeeeeep

Member #829
Reged: 08/11/01
Loc: Bristol
600276
|
18/02/06 04:21 PM
|
|
|
I don't know if this is real, or he is a magician (ie its faked) http://www.pistolwimp.com/media/41516/ Expect to see: a video of an old man appearing to support himself upside down on one finger while leaning against a wall
I think its a dodgy fake, I suspect that theres a support up in the wall, or perhaps there are wires. Note: that you do not see the top of his feet! That finger arm and hand don't look like they are under much strain. If you press with your index finger you will tend to see tighter definition in the tendons around the wrist
But I thought that this would be topical after the debate about magicians and David Blaine fakes.
Does it devalue the shaolin monks if we know that they fake some of their "spectacular feats of chi?"
 its fun to watch anyway
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Suibom
I looked in a mirror and noticed I was infinitely twisted.

Member #24431
Reged: 02/09/05
Loc: Oregon, USA
600286
|
18/02/06 05:55 PM
|
|
|
Crazy.. I don't see any obvious indications of fakery.. You *do* see the top of his feet. Also, I thought he might be holding onto a wire with his other hand and that it might be obscured by the angle and the meeting of the two walls, but the angle changes further in the video and there is no wire. Also, his finger has obviously gone through strengthening, on both hands in fact... And I think you're seeing about as much stress to the wrist as you might see with that kind of feat and training.
Interesting find Thanks for sharing, as usual .
-------------------- Definition of poi- A Hawaiian food made from the tuber of the taro that is cooked, pounded to a paste, and fermented.
Ahnold discussing poi - "It is naht a toober!"
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
pricklyleaf
Now with added berries!

Member #17440
Reged: 07/03/05
Loc: Manchester
600354
|
19/02/06 12:26 AM
|
|
|
Mmm... I can't believe thats real, his finger would be at least bent back under the weight. I wonder if he's even upside-down at all, he could be standing on a platform we don't see and be the right way up, just touching the ceiling with his finger.
What makes me really suspicious is the fact we don't see him get up there or down, yet they show him stretching...
-------------------- Live like there is no tomorrow,
dance like nobody is watching
and hula hoop like wiggling will save the world.
“What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.”
Ralph Waldo Emerson
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
coleman
big and good

Member #2914
Reged: 29/08/02
Loc: lunn dunn, yoo kay
600987
|
21/02/06 01:24 AM
|
|
|
hai-tank (aka 'hai deng') was a great master but was not shaolin - he was a monk from another region, brought in to shaolin at a time when interest in the monks was being revived by the government and he was one of the first 'touring monks', visiting america in the 60's.
i think some fabrication crept in around that time regarding what the monks could make possible through harnessing qi
it is very possible that he could perform that skill when he was younger but that was filmed when he was in his 80's - i think they faked it
here is some footage of some 'normal' high-level kung fu finger skill: clickit
and here's a photo of someone demonstrating the two fingered technique:
?
and drew, what happened to your lovely reply...?
("The magician debate above I have been following with great interest, and I'm busy writting a lovely reply to it")
cole. x
-------------------- "i see you at 'dis cafe.
i come to 'dis cafe quite a lot myself.
they do porridge."
- tim westwood
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
arashi
raised by sighthounds

Member #1678
Reged: 21/03/02
Loc: austin,tx
601858
|
22/02/06 06:46 PM
|
|
|
i dunno, i've seen convincing film of that old dude doing finger stands... on the old docu-movie with jet li as a kid maybe?
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Glåss
Eeeeeep

Member #829
Reged: 08/11/01
Loc: Bristol
602009
|
23/02/06 02:05 AM
|
|
|
POI POI POI today Watch these if you like poi:
http://www.loveandfire.de/index.htm
go to the gallery, there are 3 poi videos from Hamburg.
The're Nice videos of a poi community that I think is up and coming, Not overly technical or any thing like that, just nice and smilie, good attitude and great editing, expect to see a dog digging and "oh yeah".
I think that we will see some awesome videos to be coming out of hamburg soon.
Also Strugz Sent me this video of Yuta ....
edit:
Suibom adds a better link: if you don't want the silliness that is YouTube, then you can get the file directly here:
http://poicommunity.poke1.jp/net/bonenkai.html
It is fire6, and take a look at the rest of the community there as well:
http://poicommunity.nobody.jp/
/edit
...on You tube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8kdpn72aVAs&search=poi
Some of the filming is not so good (classic overly dark filming of firespinning,) But being Yuta, the spinning is awesome mix of techinical and movement
Big thanks StrugZ and thanks to Yuta for all his videos, Always a joy to watch.
_____________________________________________________
Coleman and NYC: about Magic this is not brillaintly worded - sorry, but have a lot of work to do today, and I'm running late, so Youll have to have it like this:
With reference to camera/ editing trickery used by David Blaine
No matter what they say:
A magician is not a liar.
A magician is not a fraud.
A magician is not dishonest.
also
Never trust anything a professional magician says about their work.
Magic is deception, but its not a Lie nor is it dishonest, because in watching magician,
in esscence you, the audience, enter into a non-verbal agreement which goes something like this:
"The magician will deceive me (the audience) for the purpose of my entertainment."
This is reminicent of the debate around the movie "Fargo" by the Coen Brothers.
Fargo opens with: "This is a true story. The events depicted in this film took place in Minnesota in 1987. At the request of the survivors, the names have been changed. Out of respect for the dead, the rest has been told exactly as it occurred."
Thats not true. The film is fiction dressed up as fact,
and so, in a way, is a magic performance.
With up close street magic, you stage is moved into the street, the realm of real life, but it is still a "stage".
and the magican is still a performer - for your entertainment.
I had a big discussion with a magician friend - Karl from Sweden about this:
Magic gains a lot of audience from being on telly, but magic also suffers heavilly from being able to rewind and watch it repeatedly in slow motion!!! (And magicians really don't like TV and internet exposes.)
Karl presented David Blaines arguements that, when people were interviewed after watching the levitation trick in the street, and asked what they saw, they would say,
"Maaaan it was like totally incredible he levitated like a foot* off the ground." (*30cm)
Always they would remember it much higher than he actually went (less than 10cm!)
So in the fake with wires, he is showing it to the TV audience in the way that the people who were there remember actually seeing it.
Magicians are manipulating peoples perception of reality, rather than reality.
But in the now era, Technology can create for us, better magic than a magician
Therefore to complain that David Blaine use of editing of up close magic was "cheating" is incorrect,
he is a magician, and that goes with the terratory.
That being said, I whole heartedly agree with you Mr NYC, that it sucks, in the way that is leaves a bad taste in your mouth.
And knowing that DB is (untruthful) heavilly devalues his publicity stunt tricks like the box over the thames "with only water" for 40 days.
Because of this i rarely bother watching magic on screen anymore, for anything other that the quaility of the presentation. and certainly not DB.
Its rare that i can get that excited feeling of disbelief with magic on telly.
All TV magic: I know there are wires, I know they are "cheating", I know that the audience can all be plants and I know that it is edited afterwards. where's the entertaiment in that - only in the skill of the performer to tell a story.
Smiles
Drew
Edited by Glåss (23/02/06 03:28 AM)
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Suibom
I looked in a mirror and noticed I was infinitely twisted.

Member #24431
Reged: 02/09/05
Loc: Oregon, USA
602085
|
23/02/06 03:17 AM
|
|
|
That Yuta vid is definitely fun.. if you don't want the silliness that is YouTube, then you can get the file directly here: http://poicommunity.poke1.jp/net/bonenkai.html
It is fire6, and take a look at the rest of the community there as well: http://poicommunity.nobody.jp/
Yuta's done a damn fine job (there's also an english translation of the site, look at the bottom of the menu column).
-------------------- Definition of poi- A Hawaiian food made from the tuber of the taro that is cooked, pounded to a paste, and fermented.
Ahnold discussing poi - "It is naht a toober!"
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|
Glåss
Eeeeeep

Member #829
Reged: 08/11/01
Loc: Bristol
602105
|
23/02/06 04:17 AM
|
|
|
Ah, thanks Suibom - you rock always good to have a propper souce link  I'll update the post above.
Also, I forgot the PS on the post above: the Hamburg crew are using my orange poi, I've Just sent them a package of another 20 pairs of super orange poi, and even some super white poi!! So more lovely orange poi happiness will be spread soon. :Hugs:
Post Extras:
Notify moderator!
|
|
|