#484051 - 11/02/05 03:45 AM
group memberships and prejudice
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old hand
Registered: 25/08/04
Loc: Berlin, Germany
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Whilst doing a homework for my social psychology class about Effects of social categorisation (e.g. how group memberships can raise or lower your self-esteem), I found this:
Questions Implying that Group membership is abnormal and devalued
1. What do you think caused your heterosexuality?
2.When and how did you decide you were a heterosexual?
3.Is it possible that heterosexuality is just a phase you may grow out of?
4.Is it possible your heterosexuality steems from a neurotical fear of others of the same sex?
5.If you've never slept with a person of the same sex, is it possible that all you need is a good same sex lover?
6.To whom have you disclosed your heterosexual tendencies?
7.Why do you heterosexuals feel compelled to seduce others into their lifestyle?
8.Why do you insist on flaunting your heterosexuality? Why cant you just be who you are and keep quiet about it?
9.Why do heterosexuals place so much emphasis on sex?
10.There seem to be very few happy heterosexuals. Technices have been developed that might enable you to change. Have you considered aversion therapy?
11.Considering the menace of hunger and overpopulation can the human race survive if everyone were heterosexual like yourself?
12.Despite social support of marriage, the divorce rate is still 50 percent. Why are there so few stable relationships among heterosexuals?
Note: This questionaire has been used in sensitivity training workshops to provoke discussion.
*not that I think I need to remind people here but I found it interesting and wanted to share!!!*
_________________________
What is psychology?- Looking for a black cat in a dark room. What is psychoanalysis? Psychoanalysis is looking for a black cat in a dark room -- in which there is no cat -- but finding one anyway.
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#484053 - 11/02/05 05:34 AM
Re: group memberships
[Re: _Clare_]
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Registered: 22/12/04
Loc: Hampshire College, MA, USA
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ooo, i like 12. really cuts to the heart of the thing. as for ten, i haven't met many happy homos, most seam to be emo kids
_________________________
-James
"How do you know if you're happy or sad without a mask? Or angry? Or ready for dessert?"
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#484055 - 11/02/05 06:03 AM
Re: group memberships
[Re: JauntyJames]
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old hand
Registered: 25/08/04
Loc: Berlin, Germany
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I dont think the main problem here is homo or hetero... and I dont think you can just substitute one word with the other!!!
I find it interesting how prejudice in general is shown... the human brain is great in categorizing that is actually a good thing it saves resources but it can also lead to dividing the world and people in it in groups...stereotypes, prejudice, moral exclusion and worse are the resultsor can be
nobody can avoid stereotypes like I said that is the way our brain works but maybe one can pay a bit attention and think about it 
Edited by babajaga (11/02/05 06:13 AM)
_________________________
What is psychology?- Looking for a black cat in a dark room. What is psychoanalysis? Psychoanalysis is looking for a black cat in a dark room -- in which there is no cat -- but finding one anyway.
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#484056 - 11/02/05 08:01 AM
Re: group memberships
[Re: JauntyJames]
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old hand
Registered: 17/11/04
Loc: San Francisco, California, USA
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Written by: sparkey
as for ten, i haven't met many happy homos, most seam to be emo kids
okay, i'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here and not leap to the conclusion that you're a raving homophobe, despite the fact that you refer to us as homos. however, the 'most seem to be emo kids' is a gross generalization and could be applied to many, many groups of people, not just gay people. i have, for example, known a great many straight boys of which the same thing could be said, but i would never say that most straight men are "emo kids."
consider that if you grew up in a society wherein a large portion of the population considered you to be subhuman, perverted, depraved, probably a pedophile, an affront to god and the natural order of things, etc. and that these things are taught in church and some schools and members of your group are targeted by bashers and murdered simply for being who they are and that the government of your country were actually considering amending the constitution to prohibit you from accessing the same rights that others take for granted -- how happy would you be, exactly? my point being that your perception of unhappy homos may be a result of societal attitudes towards them and growing up with those attitudes firmly embedded in their psyches, and not inherent in the condition of homosexuality.
as a self-identified queer, i can tell you that if i were living in your neck of the woods, i wouldn't be too happy either. (i grew up on the east coast, in columbia, md and marlton, nj.) come visit us in san francisco. we're very gay out here, in all senses of the word.
_________________________
taken out of context i must seem so strange
~ ani di franco
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#484058 - 11/02/05 08:35 AM
Re: group memberships
[Re: JauntyJames]
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member
Registered: 10/02/05
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Written by: sparkey
ooo, i like 12. really cuts to the heart of the thing. as for ten, i haven't met many happy homos, most seam to be emo kids
I bet if you lived in the 1700's you wouldn't have met to many happy blacks either. Or if you were jewish for.. just about all of the jewish peoples history.
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#484059 - 11/02/05 01:13 PM
Re: group memberships
[Re: snork]
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eye shifter
Registered: 09/10/04
Loc: between my headphones
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i dont know whats more interesting.
the fact that the word 'heterosexual' substituted in for homosexual sounds funny or off
or that (and i may be wrong) some people here accedentally read homosexual instead heterosexual.
btw a little side note because i think i know where this thread is going...homosexuality can be caused by an imbalance of testosterone while in the womb and shortly after. a high level in women will show an aggresive (more malelike) behavior toward the same sex.
and no an imbalance doesnt have to be a bad thing.
_________________________
If I could be granted one wish I would ask for all the questions of the universe.
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#484060 - 11/02/05 09:11 PM
Re: group memberships
[Re: Burning Brain]
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enthusiast
Registered: 19/11/04
Loc: Cork, Ireland at present
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are we to actually answer the questions, or just discuss them???
I was going to answer the 1st 3, and in doing so, realised a couple of things about myself...... strange....
_________________________
I used to be indecisive, but I'm not so sure now.....
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#484061 - 12/02/05 01:54 AM
Re: group memberships
[Re: Bretch]
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Registered: 28/08/02
Loc: sheffield
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Written by: Bretch
are we to actually answer the questions, or just discuss them???
I was going to answer the 1st 3, and in doing so, realised a couple of things about myself...... strange....
I think they were posted to discuss rather than answer, and they are an excellent and thought provoking set of questions.
1. What do you think caused your heterosexuality?
genetics?
2.When and how did you decide you were a heterosexual?
didn't decide, was just apparent from very early on
3.Is it possible that heterosexuality is just a phase you may grow out of?
No
4.Is it possible your heterosexuality steems from a neurotical fear of others of the same sex?
No; I'm not afraid of men, I just don't have romantic or sexual feelings towards them.
5.If you've never slept with a person of the same sex, is it possible that all you need is a good same sex lover?
No.
6.To whom have you disclosed your heterosexual tendencies?
It's not something I talk about much.
7.Why do you heterosexuals feel compelled to seduce others into their lifestyle?
I don't.
8.Why do you insist on flaunting your heterosexuality?
I don't.
Why cant you just be who you are and keep quiet about it?
I do.
9.Why do heterosexuals place so much emphasis on sex?
Insecurity caused by social, media and peer pressure.
10.There seem to be very few happy heterosexuals. Technices have been developed that might enable you to change. Have you considered aversion therapy?
No; I'm happy as I am.
11.Considering the menace of hunger and overpopulation can the human race survive if everyone were heterosexual like yourself?
Maybe, maybe not. Heterosexuality isn't the problem- it's having children that contributes to overpopulation.
12.Despite social support of marriage, the divorce rate is still 50 percent. Why are there so few stable relationships among heterosexuals?
I think it's the nature of all relationships in our culture, both hetero and homo, that they tend to be difficult to maintain for many.
_________________________
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
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#484062 - 12/02/05 05:03 AM
Re: group memberships
[Re: onewheeldave]
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Registered: 22/12/04
Loc: Hampshire College, MA, USA
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i'm sorry, i didn't realize that anybody took offence in the term "homo" as it is an abreviation for homosexual. no offense was ment. and i didn't mean to generalize, i was simply makeing an observation that most of the homosexuals i meet in my town tend to be emo kids. sorry if offense was taken, none was ment
_________________________
-James
"How do you know if you're happy or sad without a mask? Or angry? Or ready for dessert?"
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#484064 - 12/02/05 06:17 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: Doc Lightning]
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veteran
Registered: 15/05/03
Loc: London/ Surrey
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Nice questionnaire! Would love to actually get some homophobes to seriously answer it...
_________________________
The optimist claims that we are living in the best of all possible worlds.
The pessimist fears this is true.
Always make time to play in the snow.
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#484065 - 12/02/05 06:36 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: Doc Lightning]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 09/09/01
Loc: Galveston, TX
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Written by: ...Lightning...
I'm not so sure about that. If homosexuality isn't a choice, then doesn't it follow that heterosexuality isn't, either?
To me, yup it does. I don't believe there is any right/wrong to who you choose to love or why. If it's another woman (in my case), so be it. If it's a man, so be it. I don't think I'm predetermined to have to fall in love with (or want sexually) a man only, or a man first.
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#484066 - 12/02/05 08:04 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: polythene]
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Registered: 28/08/02
Loc: sheffield
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Written by: polythene
Nice questionnaire! Would love to actually get some homophobes to seriously answer it...
Two ideas-
1. It would be good to see some responses to it from anti-homosexuals; I wonder if their's some kind on online group who oppose homosexuality, yet are capeable of some kind of rational debate on the issue- it would be interesting to send it to them and see what they make of it.
2. Is 'homophobic' a good word to use? It's obviously implying that anyone who disagrees with homosexuality does so purely because they are scared by, or of, homosexuals (and possibly implying they are scared of their own, buried, potential homosexualtiy?).
Now it may be the case that many are, but I don't think it applies to them all. The reasons they oppose homosexuality may be wrong, or based on mis-understandings, but they're not fear.
Perhaps more important- there's no better way to wind-up someone who disagrees with homosexuality, than to accuse him/her of doing so out of fear. Wrong as their beliefs may be, they are nontheless their beliefs, as important to them as ours are to us.
Does not the phrase 'homophobe' trivialise and belittle those beliefs, when it would be more constructive to challenge them in a more productive way instead.
_________________________
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
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#484067 - 12/02/05 08:16 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: spritie]
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old hand
Registered: 17/11/04
Loc: San Francisco, California, USA
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Incidentally, I am familiar with these questions from my undergraduate days (nearly 20 years ago now--yikes!!). I'm not sure of the source, but these were used as part of sensitivity trainings by gay-rights organizations. These are questions that gay people get with some frequency, even to this day, which given the current state of affairs in my own country anyway, isn't really much of a surprise. By substituting "heterosexual" for "homosexual" it was intended to point out the ridiculousness of the questions.
Questions 11 and 12 are asked of gay people without the qualifying statements i.e.,
11. Can the human race survive if everyone were (homosexual) like yourself?
12. Why are there so few stable relationships among homosexuals?
And yes, I myself have been confronted with a number of these questions throughout my life, not in a rhetorical way (as they are presented here) but with all seriousness. One time at Thanksgiving my partner's family posed to us question 12. When it was pointed out that my partner and I had been together for 10 years which was longer than any of his siblings' marriages (including both of his brother's previous marriages combined), they shut up right quick.
_________________________
taken out of context i must seem so strange
~ ani di franco
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#484068 - 12/02/05 08:28 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: onewheeldave]
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old hand
Registered: 17/11/04
Loc: San Francisco, California, USA
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Written by: onewheeldave
Is 'homophobic' a good word to use? It's obviously implying that anyone who disagrees with homosexuality does so purely because they are scared by, or of, homosexuals (and possibly implying they are scared of their own, buried, potential homosexualtiy?).
Does not the phrase 'homophobe' trivialise and belittle those beliefs, when it would be more constructive to challenge them in a more productive way instead.
You raise a good point here, OWD. I have often thought that homophobe is not the most accurate word to use, nevertheless it has become the default word applied to those who oppose homosexuals.
On the other hand, there is some degree of fear involved in that many such people are afraid that we will be out to seduce their children, automatically leaping to the assumption that homosexual = pedophile/sexual predator. There have also been studies involving questioning men about their attitudes towards homosexuality and then showing them pornographic images of various gender configurations (mm, mf, ff). They attached electrodes to the subjects...um, equipment, to measure responsiveness to said images. It was discovered that those who most vehmently opposed homosexuality demonstrated arousal when shown images of male/male couplings. So a fear of their own latent homosexuality is apparently at play, at least in some individuals that would be referred to as "homophobic."
_________________________
taken out of context i must seem so strange
~ ani di franco
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#484069 - 12/02/05 08:34 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: _khan_]
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old hand
Registered: 17/11/04
Loc: San Francisco, California, USA
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Sorry for the multiple postings here, but the other interesting thing about the word homophobe is that "homo" technically means "same." Hence the word "homophobe," if we are to go by its linguistic roots, actually means "fear of sameness."
_________________________
taken out of context i must seem so strange
~ ani di franco
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#484070 - 12/02/05 09:27 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: spritie]
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HOP Mad Doctor
Registered: 28/05/01
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
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#484071 - 12/02/05 09:28 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: _khan_]
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ARRRR!
Registered: 11/08/04
Loc: Charlotte, NC, USA
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I have heard people ask some of those questions before simply out of curiosity. Granted, they were not the sharpest tools in the shed but they meant no harm. Homosexuality is completely alien to many people in the southeast U.S., mostly due to lingering outward hostility that causes people to repress who they are.
This reminds me of a close friend of mine who is STRONGLY homophobic. His wife left him for another woman which amplified his hatred. I can't help but wonder how things would have been different if the morals of the southeast had not kept her in the closet with fear. Now he has to deal with a messy divorce, bitter resentment towards homosexuals and shame stemming from other like minded homophobes. All that pain... caused by the ignorance of people who simply believe homosexuality is bad because their parents or the bible said so.
_________________________
"My skin is singed but it heals my heart and with glowing pride I'll wear my scars." -Davey Havok
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#484072 - 12/02/05 09:41 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: mtbeer]
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HOP Mad Doctor
Registered: 28/05/01
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
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Sparkley, as for gays having more emotional problems...you're exactly right. This is documented.
Not surprising when you are raised in a society that tells you that it's wrong to be what you were born.
_________________________
-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura
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#484074 - 12/02/05 10:16 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: Doc Lightning]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 09/09/01
Loc: Galveston, TX
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Written by: ...Lightning...
I'm confuzzled.  Are we agreeing or disagreeing?
I honestly have no idea. Oops!  What were you trying to say, and then maybe I can figure it out?
Food fight, you say? Takes out the super soaker filled with chocolate pudding and aims Lightning's direction
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#484076 - 12/02/05 10:41 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: NYC]
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HOP Mad Doctor
Registered: 28/05/01
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
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YUMMM!!!!! PUDDING WRESLING!
*tackles Spritie*
_________________________
-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura
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#484078 - 14/02/05 04:31 AM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: spritie]
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HOP Mad Doctor
Registered: 28/05/01
Loc: San Francisco, CA, USA
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ACK!!! NOOOOOooooo!!!!!!
*tickles Spritie mercilessly while gleefully hijacking the thread into a tickle war*
_________________________
-Mike )'(
Certified Mad Doctor and HoP High Priest of Nutella
"A buckuht 'n a hooze!" -Valura
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#484079 - 14/02/05 12:26 PM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: onewheeldave]
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veteran
Registered: 15/05/03
Loc: London/ Surrey
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OWD: In this case, I felt homophobic was the correct term to use, because these are the people whose answers to the questionnaire I would like to read, not, as you assumed, necessarily people who oppose homosexuality:
Phobias can be mild, many people who are 'slightly uncomfortable' in the presence of spiders would still consider themselves arachnophobic, albeit mildly arachnophobic. I feel that this principle can be equally applicable to the term homophobia. There are plenty of people out there who are not opposed to homosexuality, (for example do not oppose homosexual marriages) but would feel 'uncomfortable' in the presence of homosexuals.
This is my target audience. I would love to see what kind of answers were given, and would love to talk to the questionnee (not that that's a word, but hey) afterward to see if it made them think about why they feel uncomfortable, if it changed their way of thinking and/or if it made a difference to the way they felt in the presence of homosexuals.
Please correct me if you think this is an inappropriate use of the word, now I've made it clear to whom I was referring.
_________________________
The optimist claims that we are living in the best of all possible worlds.
The pessimist fears this is true.
Always make time to play in the snow.
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#484080 - 14/02/05 01:43 PM
Re: group memberships and prejudice
[Re: polythene]
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Registered: 28/08/02
Loc: sheffield
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Put that way yes, it makes sense.
If the group you're refering to is people who are afraid of, or uncomfortable in the presence of homosexuals, then 'homophobe' is entirely appropriate.
I misunderstood your context; sorry.
_________________________
"You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it."
--MAJOR KORGO KORGAR,
"Last of The Lancers"
AFC 32
Educate your self in the Hazards of Fire Breathing STAY SAFE!
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