Effect and Cause

So it seems to me that a lot of people believe in Cause and Effect but dismiss Effect and Cause (where the effect happens before whatever caused it)...

Now i've always been a believer in effect and cause but would be very interested to hear what people think about it all.

I'd like to learn about;

That experiment where you have a laser going through 2 slits (mike psi was telling me about it on the way to ejc last year but it's very hard to grasp)

quantum computer weirdness

and interesting concepts about Time (or bizarre Time related experiences you've had with poi)

m

this link will keep you busy for months. i go here when i get the time and inclination. there's real physicicts that will answer your questions if they are reasonalbly thought out. there's one guy who will blow you off if you ask stupid questions but everyone else is nice.
quantum physics tribe

of special note in this one is the comment, insightful and wise, by myself this thread will blow your mind for a while.define time

this new thread looks like it has some juciy links, haven't followed them yet standind wave hteory of matter

nice one arashi. should fill the void before my netpro course materials arrive

god, people should have been, like me, in school (and when i say school I mean it, not university) and read all that [censored] then. yadda yadda wave / particle duality blah blah blah wave/particle collapse, rhubarb rhubarb, entangled quantum states, boring boring, watched pot never boils la la la. Woo hoo, and then you get to macro states and it has no effect! Booyah!

Damn meg, you missed your calling.

You should have been a physics teacher



And just cos it's appropriate:

Science is too easy, it's just an algorithm.

mmm gstring theory.

hey matt id suggest reading

The Quantum Brain: The Search for Freedom and the Next Generation of Man by Jeffrey Satinover

i found it was an excellent read one of the most challenging books ive read, it explains quantum weirdness quite well (in a brain twisting kind of way)

There is no such thing as 'cause' AND 'effect'. Just a long series of 'effects' OR 'causes'.

ie -
effect (which causes) effect (which causes) effect ...
OR
cause (which was caused by) cause (which was caused by)...

Infinate patterns of essentially the same thing happening.

For the two slit experiment it appears that photon act like both waves and particles which means that a single photon is able to interfere with itself. Apparently it's just the way nature works. Don't ask me to explain it any further cos it scares me.

A lot of people make some very wild claims about quantum dynamics (my signiture is an example of over-extending some of the metaphores used to explain quantum dynamics). All I know for sure is that you really can't say anything but the most basic things about it unless you've spent half your life studying it so there are a lot of crap book on the subject written by people who have no idea about the subject. Personally I have only a working knowledge of it but I do recognise the 'bull-s**ters' if I see them.

I'm not really sure what you mean by effect then cause. We are told by the quantum physicists that the timing of a nuclear fission event is random, as is the formation of particle/anti-particle pairs. I'm not sure but that might be an example of effect without cause (any quantum physicists in the crowd?). With the exception of thermal dynamics most equations in physics work perfectly well if you regard the causes as effects and visa versa and time running backwards (again I might have it totally wrong since I'm well out of my leage here) but I suspect that that is not what you are refering too.

Could you explain this effect and cause more throughally and your reasoning and evidence for it please?

Embrace the horror

Horror duly embraced, and a new website saved to favourites, thanks

matt - look up 'pauli's exclusion principle' and the 'epr experiment'.
then think how this could be applied to computing

the double slit experiment is not an example of 'effect and cause'.

i'm personally not aware of any situation that could be described as 'effect and cause'.


cole. x

It's hard to be contary when noone has any idea what is being discussed

coleman, not that experiment. people were saying the Ashfar Experiment of July 2004 corroborated the Transactional Interpretation of Quantum Mechanics (killing off support of the Copenhagen Interpretation). I think it's been argued pretty successfully that it still doesn't "prove" anything, which is kind of how I see QM staying for quite a while. but yeah, i think in general "Transactional Interpretation of Quantum Mechanics" is what he's trying to discuss, if you want to google up and prepare to get contrary, but I could be wrong.

-- dut

Transaction Interpratation

Afshar Experiment

Apparently you are right and there is strong disagreement that the Afshar experiment disproves the Principle of Complementarity

From what I can tell the Transactional Interpatation seems to be consistant but it is unpopular and seems to have attracted a large number of people from the lunatic fringe.

However I don't think that this interpratation is what Spherculist was hinting at. I think he meant something of a supernatural nature, but it's hard to tell from his original post.

[t-jack]
Someone had a theory of everything based on available evidence 10,000 years ago, and again after that, and after that and after that and numerous other times until the present day. All of them have successfully "proved" their theories, until the next one arrives....I wonder how we'll "think we know" in another 10,000 years or so?!

[/t-jack]